Another agent acting like Scott Boras

[chisoxfan09]

Hey all, been pokin around looking at power righties who would rock pitching for us at the Cell and on the road. I came across Josh Johnson from the Fish who is dominating. He has a huge fastball (He can bring it at 97-99 from the video I saw on MLB.COM) and a nasty biting slider (really dips down and away to right handed hitters and he can bring that up to 89-90!! The point of this post is twofold:

 

1. Albeit the Fish have a huge track record for trading away their best MLB players once they are about to hit Free Agency or Arbitration (Dontrelle Willis, Miguel Cabreara, Josh Beckett to name a few) Josh Johnson had Tommy John surgery in 2007 and missed most of 07 and half of 08. I admit he has been lights out since then (15-2) and I will put up peripheral stats if anyone wants them. Would it not be very risky to ask for this kind of payday so early? The link below states in the article that Johnson is getting to the point (will come pretty soon) that the Fish will have to seriously consider trading him (May not be until next year when his 2nd and infinitely more expensive arb year kicks in). He signed last Dec for 1.4 million which is an absolute bargain. So just supposed the Fish cannot agree on an arbitration figure and their management (Very likely with next arb hearing and the Fish's history) panick and decide it is time to ship him. Would it not be worth KW at least exploring a trade for him or working a deal much like Santana did with the Mets once he was traded (Not sure if you can do that with contracts that are in the middle of arb). I know the team can buy out the arb years so I was wondering what kind of payday Johnson would want if he had a Cy Young type year which he is having (7-1, 2.66 ERA). 10-12 million for his 2010/2011 contract years?

 

2. Doesn't it seem that his agent Matt Sosnick is grandstanding a bit too early? He only really has had one decent year out of 4 pro year and that was his rookie year 2006 when he was 12-7? I mean he has not even compiled one great year yet and this dude already wants a Sabathia type payday. And he is playing this in the media cuz he know the Fish are in a bind when they have starters (Pitching or otherwise) that have 1-2 good years and are ready for arb or free agency. I would certainly expect Scott Boras to use his clown antics in the media but this guy? This whole asking for the world without even having proved yourself for 2-3 years is getting out of hand. But I bet he is (as the article highlights) already showcasing his player to the Yankees. It is always about money with them.

 

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/baseball...ry/1108059.html

 

Just worried because Johnson has had Tommy John surgery. Anyone agree?

[chw42]

I would not put that kind of money on a guy who has had one full healthy season and that being his rookie season.

 

This would be like the Yankees signing Carl Pavano after he had one good season.

 

Plus he had TJS, which is a definite bad sign for a guy who throws hard and also features a hard slider (Francisco Liriano anyone?)

[spiderman]

I wouldn't give him that kind of money, but if he stays healthy, he's going to get a massive contract from some big market club.

[chisoxfan09]

Good point chw42. Liriano has not been the same at all since his surgery. Neither was Kerry Wood to be honest. He had a couple of ok seasons for the Cubs but was never the same. But you know what the Yankees may already be drooling over this kid and may want to trade for him or wait until he is a FA. Just can't see the Fish paying him more than (Dunno really) 4-6 million next year if he goes 18-6 for example.

Heck the Cubs gave Dempster a 4 year 52 million dollar contract after only 1 good year. He did really well as their closer for 3 years (2005-2007) before switching over. That is not really a precedent but it is similar to the one year wonder that Johnson is being portrayed as.

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Hey all, been pokin around looking at power righties who would rock pitching for us at the Cell and on the road. I came across Josh Johnson from the Fish who is dominating. He has a huge fastball (He can bring it at 97-99 from the video I saw on MLB.COM) and a nasty biting slider (really dips down and away to right handed hitters and he can bring that up to 89-90!! The point of this post is twofold:

 

1. Albeit the Fish have a huge track record for trading away their best MLB players once they are about to hit Free Agency or Arbitration (Dontrelle Willis, Miguel Cabreara, Josh Beckett to name a few) Josh Johnson had Tommy John surgery in 2007 and missed most of 07 and half of 08. I admit he has been lights out since then (15-2) and I will put up peripheral stats if anyone wants them. Would it not be very risky to ask for this kind of payday so early? The link below states in the article that Johnson is getting to the point (will come pretty soon) that the Fish will have to seriously consider trading him (May not be until next year when his 2nd and infinitely more expensive arb year kicks in). He signed last Dec for 1.4 million which is an absolute bargain. So just supposed the Fish cannot agree on an arbitration figure and their management (Very likely with next arb hearing and the Fish's history) panick and decide it is time to ship him. Would it not be worth KW at least exploring a trade for him or working a deal much like Santana did with the Mets once he was traded (Not sure if you can do that with contracts that are in the middle of arb). I know the team can buy out the arb years so I was wondering what kind of payday Johnson would want if he had a Cy Young type year which he is having (7-1, 2.66 ERA). 10-12 million for his 2010/2011 contract years?

 

2. Doesn't it seem that his agent Matt Sosnick is grandstanding a bit too early? He only really has had one decent year out of 4 pro year and that was his rookie year 2006 when he was 12-7? I mean he has not even compiled one great year yet and this dude already wants a Sabathia type payday. And he is playing this in the media cuz he know the Fish are in a bind when they have starters (Pitching or otherwise) that have 1-2 good years and are ready for arb or free agency. I would certainly expect Scott Boras to use his clown antics in the media but this guy? This whole asking for the world without even having proved yourself for 2-3 years is getting out of hand. But I bet he is (as the article highlights) already showcasing his player to the Yankees. It is always about money with them.

 

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/baseball...ry/1108059.html

 

Just worried because Johnson has had Tommy John surgery. Anyone agree?

 

 

The Marlins will not trade Josh Johnson any time soon.

 

He made his debut just a few years back so he's under their control for a few more years. They are scheduled to move into a new stadium in 2012 which they feel will help attendance and thus drive revenue.

 

Unless they get absolutely blown away with a deal he won't be going anywhere. The Marlins arent the Marlins of 1998 anymore. They trade players away to get better now or in the next 1-2 years. the days of them being everyone elses farm team are over.

[chw42]

The Marlins will not trade Josh Johnson any time soon.

 

He made his debut just a few years back so he's under their control for a few more years. They are scheduled to move into a new stadium in 2012 which they feel will help attendance and thus drive revenue.

 

Unless they get absolutely blown away with a deal he won't be going anywhere. The Marlins arent the Marlins of 1998 anymore. They trade players away to get better now or in the next 1-2 years. the days of them being everyone elses farm team are over.

 

Yeah, but the arbitration money might become too much for the Marlins to handle.

 

If it gets taken to court and Johnson is really good, he might eventually get $9-10 million in an arbitration case.

[chisoxfan09]

Sonix, that was part of my reasoning (They picked up 6 prospects for Willis/Cabrera). But the agent is forecasting a Sabathia payday for 2012 when they open the stadium. He is a health risk as a previous TJS pitcher. You say they are not the Marlins of 1998 but as noted they have traded away their best players to avoid huge paydays. I am convinced that present ownership won't continue to follow that line. The Yankees were pretty adamant not to trade away either Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain, Melky Cabrera, etc (as an example of a team with a solid farm and a ton of $$$). But they may be tempted to chase Johnson after 2011 if not sooner. Just can't imagine the Fish paying massive arb bucks in the coming 2 years. I could and might be wrong.

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Sonix, that was part of my reasoning (They picked up 6 prospects for Willis/Cabrera). But the agent is forecasting a Sabathia payday for 2012 when they open the stadium. He is a health risk as a previous TJS pitcher. You say they are not the Marlins of 1998 but as noted they have traded away their best players to avoid huge paydays. I am convinced that present ownership won't continue to follow that line. The Yankees were pretty adamant not to trade away either Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain, Melky Cabrera, etc (as an example of a team with a solid farm and a ton of $$$). But they may be tempted to chase Johnson after 2011 if not sooner. Just can't imagine the Fish paying massive arb bucks in the coming 2 years. I could and might be wrong.

 

Well I've followed the Marlins since their inception into the league as my NL team so I know a lot more about them the average baseball fan (not saying you specifically, just pointing out where I'm coming from). That was their M.O. in recent years, yes. But, the management and ownership have begun to take a different approach to things. They will never be big spenders but they know that they can't keep relying on young players all the time. They are convinced moving into their new stadium will essentially rescue their team and allow them to sustain a middle of the road payroll. They should have the payroll felxibility in the coming years to afford a few contracts like the one JJ should command. (And if they are wrong about the stadium - which is in a much better loaction by the way - helping them out then there becomes a decent chance the franchise moves eventually anyways.)

 

Their pitching staff right now is so young and just LOADED with potential. A couple guys are injured and since his surgery JJ has been awesome. Couple him with Volstad/Badenhop/Van Den Hurk/Nolasco/Sanchez/West/Miller and you'd like to think they could have a killer 1-2-3. They are a year or two away from being legitimate contenders. I really don't foresee them trading away Johnson before getting to 2011 season and robbing them a chance at a very talented team. They just ponied up for Hanley so that was a good first step and retaining players.

 

They traded Miggy/Dontrelle because they had legitimate concerns about them in addition to the money they were going to need. And, the return on them was ridiculous. If they trade Johnson they will fleece whoever makes that trade. If this were two years ago I'd feel differently, but I really don't see them moving Johnson or Volstad for a while, if at all.

[chisoxfan09]

Well I've followed the Marlins since their inception into the league as my NL team so I know a lot more about them the average baseball fan (not saying you specifically, just pointing out where I'm coming from). That was their M.O. in recent years, yes. But, the management and ownership have begun to take a different approach to things. They will never be big spenders but they know that they can't keep relying on young players all the time. They are convinced moving into their new stadium will essentially rescue their team and allow them to sustain a middle of the road payroll. They should have the payroll felxibility in the coming years to afford a few contracts like the one JJ should command. (And if they are wrong about the stadium - which is in a much better loaction by the way - helping them out then there becomes a decent chance the franchise moves eventually anyways.)

 

Their pitching staff right now is so young and just LOADED with potential. A couple guys are injured and since his surgery JJ has been awesome. Couple him with Volstad/Badenhop/Van Den Hurk/Nolasco/Sanchez/West/Miller and you'd like to think they could have a killer 1-2-3. They are a year or two away from being legitimate contenders. I really don't foresee them trading away Johnson before getting to 2011 season and robbing them a chance at a very talented team. They just ponied up for Hanley so that was a good first step and retaining players.

 

They traded Miggy/Dontrelle because they had legitimate concerns about them in addition to the money they were going to need. And, the return on them was ridiculous. If they trade Johnson they will fleece whoever makes that trade. If this were two years ago I'd feel differently, but I really don't see them moving Johnson or Volstad for a while, if at all.

 

I meant I was not convinced they would not follow that line. Anyway the agent can shoot his mouth off all he wants as the arb years are strictly between the team and the player. Only goes to mediation if the two parties cannot agree. Wonder what the precedents are for a good SP of his caliber. Have not followed the arb rulings but would be curious to know what he stands to earn. Somebody said 9-10 million but in a comparable way with Ryan Howards payoff (I know the Phils offered 14 and he wanted 18 but cannot find the settlement figure) it may be over 10.

Edited June 22, 2009 by chisoxfan09

[Flash Tizzle]

No way in hell his delivery is anything you'd want to be a part of for an extend amount of time. It's just plain ugly to look at. I don't blame Johnson for doing everything he can to milk a team out of money before his elbow falls off.

 

However, Florida should be in no hurry to consider trading him. No arbitrator is going to award Johnson anywhere near his asking figure. I doubt the MLB arbitration record (I believe set by Gagne) would be broken for Josh f***ing Johnson.

Edited June 22, 2009 by Flash Tizzle

[chisoxfan09]

Flash, thanx for your reply. I just can't get nowadays with 1 good year with maybe 15-18 wins and now the guy is at Sabathia's talent level or earning potential. Man the agents are getting as bad as the media that allow them to overhype their players. I really like free agency for what it was intended to do but this guy is chachingin the cash register 2.5 years before Johnson even gets there, and that's without knowing what kind of season he will finish with in 2009 let alone 2010/2011. Plus what you said that his elbow may fall off.