witesoxfan Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 22, 2009 -> 11:49 AM) The Brewers should trade Escobar when his value is high. I've seen him play a handful of times, and he seems like nothing more than a weak hitting, slick fielding SS. You might as well trade for Caesar Izturis then. The Brewers only have a few more years left with the Fielder/Braun dynamic duo, so they really should go after Halladay. I won't make comparisons to either side, but if you could find a player with defense as good as Izturis or say, Omar Vizquel - or something similar - and get just a bit of offense to go with it (say .700 OPS), I'd personally say that's worth much more than JJ Hardy putting up 2-3 good months a year. Hell, if the Brewers wanted to be really risky, they'd deal Hardy, Parra, and some other solid prospect for Halladay, which equals less money in arbitration and more guaranteed contracts going into next year, and they'd go with Escobar at SS and they'd try and acquire a good offensive backup infielder who can play better defense than Felipe Lopez at 2B (so resign Ray Durham or activate Rickie Weeks) and go from there. If Macha's a good enough manager, he'd figure out ways to get all 3 good enough playing time up the middle. Of course, Hardy's two good months are coming. Agree completely with the second part. I wouldn't be entirely surprised to see Prince dealt this offseason to be honest). Edited July 26, 2009 by witesoxfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jul 26, 2009 -> 07:41 AM) I wonder if the Braves were scouting Dye under the possibility that on July 31st the Sox look to be out and the Braves look to be in it. I can't imagine Kenny pulling off anything even slightly resembling another White Flag trade, but still, the Braves have needed an OF all year even after picking up McLouth, and they have been linked to Dye since the offseason. The Braves are just too far back to be making moves for this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 The Phillies offered the Jays everything except Drabek and were turned down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkin Escobar Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 I hope Halladay stays in Toronto. I hope they continue to finish 4th and I hope next year they move him for a similar package to Sabathia. One very good prospect, one good and another instead of the 4-5 theyre demanding now. Even then - I hope that moron Ricciardi can't find a deal next year and lets him walk - only to have him sign with a bad team so he ends up with all sandwich picks and drafts no top-flight talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 I wish this Phillies deal would just die already. The constant back and forth is becoming very tiresome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Jul 26, 2009 -> 06:33 PM) I wish this Phillies deal would just die already. The constant back and forth is becoming very tiresome. It sounds like there is a lot of posturing going on...Next 3-4 days should be pretty interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I wish Halladay and Ricciardi would just go the hell away already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilmot825 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I think Clayton Richard has looked so good the last starts that him, Poreda, Fields, and a PTBNL could now land Halladay since the Phils wont give in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I wish our team would fill needs through the free agent route. It's kind of scary thinking of trading Richard. He definitely has shown potential. I mean that was an effective pitcher tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenksycat Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I can't wait till the Jays screw themselves and end up with the same type of "haul" the idiots from the Twins got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 9:45am: Tim Brown of Yahoo! Sports says that as of Saturday night, the Angels "were of the mind to remove themselves from the Roy Halladay talks, believing they were never going to come close to the Blue Jays’ asking price of Joe Saunders, Erick Aybar, Brandon Wood and a prospect such as outfielder Peter Bourjos." Either all of these trade rumors are false, or both the Angels and Blue Jays are very stupid. The first rumor was that the Blue Jays turned down Weaver and that seems extremely stupid. Now, if it's true the Angels offered Weaver but now only had to give Saunders and Aybar with one failed prospect and another meh prospect, and they feel that is too much to give up, that's beyond stupid. All of these rumors have to be BULL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 The 2008 Orioles/Mariners trade has set the precedent in regards to what is deemed an acceptable package for an ace pitcher. It's pretty clear Riccardi wants the equivalent to the gold package the Orioles received for Erik Bedard. Problem is no GM wants to be the next Bill Bavasi (that trade was the final nail in his coffin). Halladay isn't going anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisoxfan09 Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 The 2008 Orioles/Mariners trade has set the precedent in regards to what is deemed an acceptable package for an ace pitcher. It's pretty clear Riccardi wants the equivalent to the gold package the Orioles received for Erik Bedard. Problem is no GM wants to be the next Bill Bavasi (that trade was the final nail in his coffin). Halladay isn't going anywhere. I am happy if KW is exploring other options. To be honest now I would rate Haren as a better pitcher to Halladay in terms of longevity and financial sense. As a pitcher as well. But there are many who would disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Jul 27, 2009 -> 10:47 AM) I am happy if KW is exploring other options. To be honest now I would rate Haren as a better pitcher to Halladay in terms of longevity and financial sense. As a pitcher as well. But there are many who would disagree. Unless the Sox are willing to trade away a farm system that Kenny has just started to rebuild for Halladay (doesn't seem like a possibility anymore) or Haren, I really don't see the point of making a trade. The starting rotation is solid from #1-#3, Contreras has been fine in the backend of the rotation, and the #5 spot isn't much different than most teams. The bullpen has the arms (Jenks, Thornton, Dotel, etc) but needs to get it together. Offensively, they still don't hit as well as I think they should with that lineup, but there really aren't any obvious spots that Williams would upgrade at. That isn't to say that this team is stacked - it can definitely upgrade it's pitching, but I wonder if the best idea at this point is to let the season play out as it is, and then evaluate which of these free agents (Thome, Dye (they aren't going to pay him $12 million), and Contreras) they may want back at a reduced price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisoxfan09 Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 Unless the Sox are willing to trade away a farm system that Kenny has just started to rebuild for Halladay (doesn't seem like a possibility anymore) or Haren, I really don't see the point of making a trade. The starting rotation is solid from #1-#3, Contreras has been fine in the backend of the rotation, and the #5 spot isn't much different than most teams. The bullpen has the arms (Jenks, Thornton, Dotel, etc) but needs to get it together. Offensively, they still don't hit as well as I think they should with that lineup, but there really aren't any obvious spots that Williams would upgrade at. That isn't to say that this team is stacked - it can definitely upgrade it's pitching, but I wonder if the best idea at this point is to let the season play out as it is, and then evaluate which of these free agents (Thome, Dye (they aren't going to pay him $12 million), and Contreras) they may want back at a reduced price. My spidey sense tells me Haren would be a great pickup but not to mortgage the farm. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Jul 27, 2009 -> 11:16 AM) My spidey sense tells me Haren would be a great pickup but not to mortgage the farm. :-) It would be a great pickup, but it would gut the system. Plus, do we even know for certain that he's actually available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisoxfan09 Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 It would be a great pickup, but it would gut the system. Plus, do we even know for certain that he's actually available? No TBH no. I really don't think the Dbacks are going to even listen to offers. It would cost more than Halladay as you say probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Haren/Buehrle/Floyd/Danks in the playoffs = sexy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisoxfan09 Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 Haren/Buehrle/Floyd/Danks in the playoffs = sexy. I think it would take one of either Danks or Floyd as the centerpiece to get the Dbacks to even listen. And then they would probably demand both Richard and Poreda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Jul 27, 2009 -> 02:09 PM) I think it would take one of either Danks or Floyd as the centerpiece to get the Dbacks to even listen. And then they would probably demand both Richard and Poreda. If I'm the Dbacks I demand, not ask, but f***ing demand one of Danks/Floyd, Hudson and Flowers. Probably would take a couple other guys. In other words, ain't nothin' happening here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 26, 2009 -> 10:12 PM) Either all of these trade rumors are false, or both the Angels and Blue Jays are very stupid. The first rumor was that the Blue Jays turned down Weaver and that seems extremely stupid. Now, if it's true the Angels offered Weaver but now only had to give Saunders and Aybar with one failed prospect and another meh prospect, and they feel that is too much to give up, that's beyond stupid. All of these rumors have to be BULL. I'm not sure if they're all bull, but the vast majority of them certainly are. Even Ricciardi wouldn't be arrogant enough to turn down Jered Weaver plus a couple of other solid prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
103 mph screwball Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Today is the self imposed Halladay trade deadline. If there are not at least new rumors added to the "Halladay Superthread" today, then I'm guessing Halladay keeps paying Canadian taxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan562004 Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 QUOTE (103 mph screwball @ Jul 28, 2009 -> 08:21 AM) Today is the self imposed Halladay trade deadline. If there are not at least new rumors added to the "Halladay Superthread" today, then I'm guessing Halladay keeps paying Canadian taxes. I'm leaning towards that too. However, I wouldn't be shocked if he goes to the Phils, it seems like the two teams have had heavy conversations. If I'm the Phils I move Drabek if that's what they want, the NL is so terrible right now that if the Phils add Halladay they are the clear cut favorites in my book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 If Halladay stays, I think Ricciardi has totally failed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 28, 2009 -> 09:26 AM) If Halladay stays, I think Ricciardi has totally failed Since he signed Wells to that monster contract, I think he already had failed. But I agree, you are not gonna make the playoffs next year with Halladay, trade him away, save the money and get some good young players. With the youngsters they already have, they can set themselves up nicely for the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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