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Halladay Superthread


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What's Rolen's contract situation? I honestly wouldn't mind having Rolen around the next few seasons. Try to make a deal, sign Roy to an extension, keep one of Richard or Poreda (probably Richard) and our rotation is set for the next 3 seasons.

 

Poreda, Fields, Getz, Flowers, and Allen for Holiday and Rolen.

 

Your 2009 White Sox:

 

Pods, Ramirez, Dye, Thome, Konerko, AJ, CQ, Rolen, Beckham

 

Buerhle, Holiday, Danks, Floyd, Contreras (Richard goes back as a long reliever/spot starter until 2010 when he replaces Contreras)

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QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 11:57 AM)
I'd pass on Doc H. Let's develop our own and compete that way

 

 

LOL, yeah why would we need a perennial Cy Young contender when we can experience growing pains and career uncertainty instead?

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QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:15 PM)
What's Rolen's contract situation? I honestly wouldn't mind having Rolen around the next few seasons. Try to make a deal, sign Roy to an extension, keep one of Richard or Poreda (probably Richard) and our rotation is set for the next 3 seasons.

 

Poreda, Fields, Getz, Flowers, and Allen for Holiday and Rolen.

 

Your 2009 White Sox:

 

Pods, Ramirez, Dye, Thome, Konerko, AJ, CQ, Rolen, Beckham

 

Buerhle, Holiday, Danks, Floyd, Contreras (Richard goes back as a long reliever/spot starter until 2010 when he replaces Contreras)

 

Rolen has 1 more year left on his deal for 11 million. We'd either have to get some cash in return or get the Blue Jays to take on one of our bad contracts, and the only one that comes to mind is Linebrink.

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Peter Gammons just said on ESPN 1000: He would be surprised if Kenny didn't make a phone call and put together a package for Roy Halladay. Didn't say Kenny DID, just said he would be surprised if Kenny didn't try.

 

No other details.

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QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:19 PM)
How old was Pedro when his stuff took a nose dive...particularly his fastball?

 

Around 34, but I don't see the comparison as Pedro and Halladay are two different types of pitchers, IMO.

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I don't really plan on going through all 10 pages+ and reading everyones comments so I'll just throw out my two cnts and if I repeat or step on someone's ideas - my bad.

 

Halladay would be a nice addition for us. For anyone, even if it costs quite a bit.

 

He puts us in a great shot to win this year especially if Quentin can return healthy and to 08' form. Our offense has stepped it up and putting Halladay game 1 and Buehrle game 2...That is going to be tough to beat.

 

Now if you're all in for this season, you'll make a big move. Our team scares me because of the age of our offense and contract situations for the future but thats irrelevant right now.

 

They probably want big league ready or high-rated prospects. We don't have many we'd be open to dealing. Beckham and Danks are off limits. Poreda is available in this scenario and so should everyone else be.

 

Richard isn't great but he is a 5 starter who is mlb ready. I think they'll want two upper-level prospects who are close to mlb ready on top of that. So your choice of Poreda, Flowers, Allen. My assumption is they'll bite on Poreda and Allen. And then I think they'll want probably 2 lower level high ceiling prospects which is going to be Carter and Hudson. My guess.

 

So would you move Richard, Poreda, Allen, Hudson and/or Carter....That is a steep price for us.

 

I think we can survive but KW and the Sox would need to up payroll for the next couple seasons because of our younger players who are due raises, and also because if you waste your prospects to acquire a Halladay - you better go all-in while you have him.

 

Which means Thome is up - let him go or replace him with a big bat? I'd explore my options to find a 2nd baseman and even bullpen help.

 

With all that said - I think we have a chance to land him if theyre interested. The teams with deep farms can't afford him or arent contending. The ones who can afford him tend not to have the prospects available or claim they arent so we should have a shot.

 

Naturally the BoSox and Yankees scare me but the team I wouldnt be surprised to get him would be like Milwaukee. I know they claim their top prospects arent available but if JP is sitting there looking at a package revolving around Poreda and Allen or a package around Gamel and Hardy or Escobar + Salome and stuff...He'll gladly take Milwaukee's offer. And theyre in need of an arm.

 

Who knows but I certainly hope Kenny has that Peavy offer on Toronto's doorstep. Halladay only has a few good years left IMO and even that scares me when you factor in our park. I'm all for going out and winning it this year though and then revamping in the future.

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Put Jose in the pen, but I'd have him ready just in case Floyd or Danks falter early.

Gavin = Mental midget. See last year's playoff performance. If Jose keeps pitching the way (don't forget 2005! he has, that's better than Floyd (who hopefully won't return back to being a pumpkin.)

I'm nervous on buying high on Rolen.

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QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 11:37 AM)
Adding Rolen and Halladay would easily make us favorites in the central. Move Slayer to 2B, we got the return of Q. Look at that lineup:

 

1. Pods, CF

2. Ramirez, SS

3. Dye, RF

4. Thome, DH

5. Konerko, 1B

6. Rolen, 3B

7. Quentin, LF

8. Pierzynski, C

9. Beckham, 2B

 

Plus, we'd have one of Halladay, Buehrle, Danks, Floyd, or Contreras on the mound. Awesomeness.

That team would immediately become a World Series favorite, in my opinion.

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I should point out... The Jays could use an MLB ready 1B, and Allen is pretty near MLB ready. They seem to be getting frustrated with Overbay because they want more power out of the 1B spot, and Overbay just isn't a power hitter. Allen makes a lot of sense for them.

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QUOTE (santo=dorf @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:25 PM)
Gavin = Mental midget. See last year's playoff performance. If Jose keeps pitching the way (don't forget 2005! he has, that's better than Floyd (who hopefully won't return back to being a pumpkin.)

I'm nervous on buying high on Rolen.

 

It'd be close to unrealistic to expect Rolen to keep doing what he's doing, but I'll take good D at 3B, a .260 average, and a veteran bat in the bottom half of the lineup for the next year and a half while we wait for Viciedo to develop. The thing that worries me is injuries, will he hold up.

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QUOTE (santo=dorf @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:25 PM)
Gavin = Mental midget. See last year's playoff performance. If Jose keeps pitching the way (don't forget 2005! he has, that's better than Floyd (who hopefully won't return back to being a pumpkin.)

I'm nervous on buying high on Rolen.

 

Wasnt he pitching on short rest then? He seemed to be fine in the week leading up to the playoffs, when the Sox had to win pretty much every game

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QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:19 PM)
Rolen has 1 more year left on his deal for 11 million. We'd either have to get some cash in return or get the Blue Jays to take on one of our bad contracts, and the only one that comes to mind is Linebrink.

Seems doable since Contreras, Dye, Thome and Dotel are off the books next season. (However, i still think Dye will be brought back next season for less to be our new DH)

 

After Next season you would then have Rolen, Konerko and AJ potentially coming off the books. So even if we do trade Poreda, Getz, Flowers, Allen etc. . we are still getting younger as Viciedo and Danks should be ready by no later than 2011. We still have the capability of getting younger on the fly.

 

I could totally see a 2011 team being this:

 

Figgins LF (Signs to a 3 year deal this offseason)

Beckham 2B

Dye DH

CQ RF

Konerko 1B(resigns for a resonable deal to end his career with the Sox)

Ramirez SS

AJ C (re-signs to a 3 year deal, lets face it- we are the only team that loves him)

Viciedo 3B

Danks CF

 

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I want no part of AJ after 2010, at least not as a starter. He'll be 35-36 at that time, and he has already shown signs of slowing down behind the plate. Maybe as a backup catcher, pinch hitter, etc., fine. But no way do I want to see him starting at C after 2010.

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QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:15 PM)
LOL, yeah why would we need a perennial Cy Young contender when we can experience growing pains and career uncertainty instead?

I'd just like to point out how awesome and truthful this post is.

 

If we keep every one of these kids it's not likely they'll come up and be Alexei or Beckham and produce right away. And knowing Ozzie, the Sox, and us hardcore Sox fans, we are due for tons more "Why is Ozzie playing (insert random career minor leaguer's name) over (insert former top prospect's name)?" threads in the future.

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QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 06:28 PM)
Wasnt he pitching on short rest then? He seemed to be fine in the week leading up to the playoffs, when the Sox had to win pretty much every game

 

 

Yeah, he was abused down the stretch (though not totally great either). He pitched great during our first one game play-off (162), throwing something like 120 pitches on 3 days rest. Mental midget? No...

 

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:10 PM)
If they include those two teams, the possiblity exists of a Miguel Cabrera type trade where they take on Wells or Rios contract, as well as Halladay. It would be win/win for Toronto.

Yeah I could definitely see the Jays dealing with them in that case. Rios is one thing because his contract is at least reasonable if not a bargain should he return to form, and it carries him through his physical prime, but Wells is a different story altogether. If someone offered to take on Wells they could probably get Halladay plus for basically nothing. That contract is horrific. Just look at what carrying around Helton's contract has done for the Rockies all these years. That's your future Toronto Blue Jays, although unfortunately for them they play in a division that is about 1000X tougher.

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QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 11:19 AM)
How old was Pedro when his stuff took a nose dive...particularly his fastball?

 

Pedro was a power pitcher who weighed 175 pounds soaking wet.

 

Same reason I wouldn't sign Lincecum to any 8 year deals.

 

Roy is a horse. Not much of a comparison.

 

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QUOTE (santo=dorf @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 12:25 PM)
Gavin = Mental midget. See last year's playoff performance.

lol. What happened when he pitched in the make up game against the Tigers last year to keep our season alive again?

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The reason that the Jays would SAY they're entertaining offers from the Yanks/BoSox is to scare everyone else into upping their bids. It's posturing.

 

I'd be shocked if Roy stays in the AL East, if he does get traded.

 

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QUOTE (dbaho @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 09:30 AM)
But even with him, would we be able to win a world series with him? I'd have serious doubts

You go into the playoffs with a rotation of: Halladay, Buehrle, Danks, Floyd and you have a legit shot to win the World Series, period.

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lol. What happened when he pitched in the make up game against the Tigers last year to keep our season alive again?

I seem to recall him crapping his pants in the 6th before getting bailed out by Alexei. The playoff teams are more likely to represent the 2008 Rays, certainly not the last place 2008 Tigers.

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QUOTE (santo=dorf @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 01:07 PM)
I seem to recall him crapping his pants in the 6th before getting bailed out by Alexei. The playoff teams are more likely to represent the 2008 Rays, certainly not the last place 2008 Tigers.

Yeah, pitching against last-place teams is easy, especially if names in the lineup include Curtis Granderson, Placido Polanco, Magglio Ordonez, Miguel Cabrera, Carlos Guillen, etc. Piece of cake.

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QUOTE (santo=dorf @ Jul 7, 2009 -> 01:07 PM)
I seem to recall him crapping his pants in the 6th before getting bailed out by Alexei. The playoff teams are more likely to represent the 2008 Rays, certainly not the last place 2008 Tigers.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/...p&year=2008

 

hmmm, 6 innings, 5 hits, 2 runs(1 earned) and 8 Ks and 2 walks. on 3 days rest. Sure looks like he crapped his pants to me

Edited by KyYlE23
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