caulfield12 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 http://www.rotoauthority.com/2009/07/pitch...use-points.html Not surprising to see Verlander and Edwin Jackson so high on the list, is it? You never see any Twins' pitchers either, which is why they tend to play better in the 2nd half of the season (and this year, the schedule for the Twinkies is more favorable). Another issue for the Tigers is trying to delicately avoid Magglio Ordonez's $18 million vesting option for 2010 based on plate appearances...and Carlos Guillen's balky shoulder. All things considered, unless Quentin comes back and is anywhere near a shadow of his former self or the White Sox acquire another starting pitcher without giving up Beckham/Ramirez/Floyd, then the Twins would look to have a 75% chance to win the division, especially if either Verlander or Jackson are injured...not to mention they really need to be careful with PORCELLO as well, so those are 3 pitchers to watch closely/carefully. The Tigers, reportedly, have nixed trading Porcello/Perry for Halladay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 Out of 112: Danks 55th Buehrle 75th Floyd 79th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 Boras is going to push the Tigers to trade him so that option gets vested, that guy freaks out when this stuff happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 16, 2009 -> 10:23 PM) Boras is going to push the Tigers to trade him so that option gets vested, that guy freaks out when this stuff happens Who is going to trade for Maggs right now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 16, 2009 -> 10:26 PM) Who is going to trade for Maggs right now? Cinci? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 Porcello might hit the "wall" by late August. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSoxfan1986 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 16, 2009 -> 09:01 PM) The Tigers, reportedly, have nixed trading Porcello/Perry for Halladay. I wouldn't even do that if I were the Jays. I think Porcello has a chance to be a good pitcher, but I don't think he'll ever be great. IMO he's a #2 at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 Leveraging plenty of good innings out of starters without risking their health is definitely one of Ozzie's strong points. That said, thankfully, the league as a whole has drastically curtailed the stress pitchers are subjected to compared to a decade ago, so even the guys towards the top of that list aren't at risk too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (WhiteSoxfan1986 @ Jul 16, 2009 -> 10:48 PM) I wouldn't even do that if I were the Jays. I think Porcello has a chance to be a good pitcher, but I don't think he'll ever be great. IMO he's a #2 at best. But is he going to be something like $15 million per year better than Porcello? That is a very important part of the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenksycat Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 16, 2009 -> 10:23 PM) Boras is going to push the Tigers to trade him so that option gets vested, that guy freaks out when this stuff happens No idea why they don't just cut his ass at this point. They cut Shef...with 499 homers....really? You couldn't wait a week for him to hit 500? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan101 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 (edited) Good thread. To be perfectly honest, I think the Tigers may eventually take a significant tumble and finish in 3rd place, and the main reason I believe this is they have abused their starting pitching. To be fair, they kind of have to do that in order to keep winning ballgames so I can't blame them, but it's going to catch up with them eventually, and in a big way. I actually think the Twins are going to end up winning the division due to them probably being the most predictable, consistent squad at the end of the day (consistently mediocre, but that might be enough in the AL Central), but obviously I hope I'm wrong. Edited July 17, 2009 by whitesoxfan101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 02:25 PM) No idea why they don't just cut his ass at this point. They cut Shef...with 499 homers....really? You couldn't wait a week for him to hit 500? Dont they assume the remainder of the contract if they cut him? Sheff did not have near the contract Maggs has going for him right now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenksycat Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 02:34 PM) Dont they assume the remainder of the contract if they cut him? Sheff did not have near the contract Maggs has going for him right now Ah maybe, I assumed if they cut him then his vesting option doesn't kick in but knowing Boras, there is probably a clause where it automatically does if he's cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 02:36 PM) Ah maybe, I assumed if they cut him then his vesting option doesn't kick in but knowing Boras, there is probably a clause where it automatically does if he's cut. We both know Boras would be covering his ass any which way, so I bet that clause is in there somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 The only time where Ozzie went to the extreme with his starters was the 05 playoffs...and for good reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 17, 2009 Author Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 01:33 PM) Good thread. To be perfectly honest, I think the Tigers may eventually take a significant tumble and finish in 3rd place, and the main reason I believe this is they have abused their starting pitching. To be fair, they kind of have to do that in order to keep winning ballgames so I can't blame them, but it's going to catch up with them eventually, and in a big way. I actually think the Twins are going to end up winning the division due to them probably being the most predictable, consistent squad at the end of the day (consistently mediocre, but that might be enough in the AL Central), but obviously I hope I'm wrong. With Seay, Zumaya, Dolsi, Lyon, Rodney and Perry, they have perhaps a better or at least comparable bullpen with the White Sox in terms of ability/potential. Maybe our lefties (Richard/Poreda/Thornton) give us the advantage overall, but those five righties all have pretty nasty stuff, or had in in the not so distant past. You throw in Zach Miner as the long man, they're not bad. At any rate, I can understand with how well Jackson (all year) and Verlander (since the middle of May) have been going and with their middle relief struggles last year, but it's going to come back to bite them, surely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 03:09 PM) With Seay, Zumaya, Dolsi, Lyon, Rodney and Perry, they have perhaps a better or at least comparable bullpen with the White Sox in terms of ability/potential. Maybe our lefties (Richard/Poreda/Thornton) give us the advantage overall, but those five righties all have pretty nasty stuff, or had in in the not so distant past. You throw in Zach Miner as the long man, they're not bad. At any rate, I can understand with how well Jackson (all year) and Verlander (since the middle of May) have been going and with their middle relief struggles last year, but it's going to come back to bite them, surely. They also have a risk that about half of those guys could be injured tomorrow and it would shock no one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 12:33 PM) Good thread. To be perfectly honest, I think the Tigers may eventually take a significant tumble and finish in 3rd place, and the main reason I believe this is they have abused their starting pitching. To be fair, they kind of have to do that in order to keep winning ballgames so I can't blame them, but it's going to catch up with them eventually, and in a big way. I actually think the Twins are going to end up winning the division due to them probably being the most predictable, consistent squad at the end of the day (consistently mediocre, but that might be enough in the AL Central), but obviously I hope I'm wrong. I think a bigger concern is the fact that there hitting is falling off a ledge too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 17, 2009 Author Share Posted July 17, 2009 (edited) http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009906200344 Older article, but interesting take defending Ordonez's benching. Is Ordonez done? PEDS? At 35, I would like to see him try to make a comeback with the White Sox as a DH against lefties (I think we have to get a LH DH to replace Thome) and 4th outfielder, but that will never happen with KW and Ozzie running the team. But it's more Boras hate than anything personally I ever had against Magglio. He wasn't really a leader, but he certainly wasn't the WORST guy on the team or in the clubhouse, either. Not Herbert Perry or Jose Valentin, though. Edited July 17, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 18, 2009 Share Posted July 18, 2009 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 03:09 PM) With Seay, Zumaya, Dolsi, Lyon, Rodney and Perry, they have perhaps a better or at least comparable bullpen with the White Sox in terms of ability/potential. Maybe our lefties (Richard/Poreda/Thornton) give us the advantage overall, but those five righties all have pretty nasty stuff, or had in in the not so distant past. You throw in Zach Miner as the long man, they're not bad. At any rate, I can understand with how well Jackson (all year) and Verlander (since the middle of May) have been going and with their middle relief struggles last year, but it's going to come back to bite them, surely. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 17, 2009 -> 06:28 PM) They also have a risk that about half of those guys could be injured tomorrow and it would shock no one. That didn't take long Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 18, 2009 Author Share Posted July 18, 2009 (edited) I don't know what's going on (Linebrink with a dead arm or just not 100%?) with our pen recently, but I'm sure glad KW picked up Pena to give us an additional option in the pen and also someone that could replace Linebrink in the 7th and 8th innings. Linebrink gave up another hit today and Ozzie is going with the quick hook now, whereas he had a lot of patience with him against the Cubs with that 5-1 lead. Edited July 18, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 21, 2009 Author Share Posted July 21, 2009 (edited) http://blogs2.startribune.com/blogs/neal/2...L7PQLanchO7DiUr 175 posts about the Twins' Front Office, GM and "bad" manager Ron Gardenhire after last night's horrific loss... How many of you would "trade" Ozzie for Gardenhire, straight-up, to be our manager for the rest of the season? Or for Jim Leyland, who abuses almost all of his best starters and runs their arms into the ground historically? Yeah, the Cubs' loss was a tough one to take, but Ozzie really had a lot of faith in Liney up until that game, based on the 2008 season when he was healthy (like Hermanson the first half of 2005). Edited July 21, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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