Why did we trade Nick Swisher?

[Paulie4Pres]

Look at this way. Are we a better team this year with Swisher, or Podsednik. That's basically what it comes down to, because that's the only guy Swisher could really knock out of the lineup. He wasn't taking Quentin, Dye, or Konerko's position. CF was his only option, and, in my opinion, we're a better team with Podsednik instead of Swisher. Swisher is better in CF defensively, but he can't replace Podsednik's contribution this year at the leadoff spot.

Edited August 1, 2009 by CQMVP

[ThunderBolt]

Look at this way. Are we a better team this year with Swisher, or Podsednik. That's basically what it comes down to, because that's the only guy Swisher could really knock out of the lineup. He wasn't taking Quentin, Dye, or Konerko's position. CF was his only option, and, in my opinion, we're a better team with Podsednik instead of Swisher. Swisher is better in CF defensively, but he can't replace Podsednik's contribution this year at the leadoff spot.

I actually disagree with this. I love Pods, but Swish would get on base more, and get caught stealing less.

[Balta1701]

I actually disagree with this. I love Pods, but Swish would get on base more, and get caught stealing less.

Swisher's OBP this year is .367, Pods's is .354. That agrees with your point, but then I can point out Swisher's .332 OBP last year.

[Chisoxfn]

One thing Swisher hasn't improved on, is hitting in the clutch.

 

He has a BA/RISP of .219 and a clutch factor of -4.0.

 

But this season, he's hitting far less line drives and more flyballs, and that's translating into more power at the new Yankee Stadium.

 

I still think though, if he ever wants to get back to where he was rated a few seasons ago, that average of his needs to get back to around the .270-.280 mark, and I don't know whether he's capable of that anymore.

It is because he's not a good hitter, period.

[Chisoxfn]

Swisher's OBP this year is .367, Pods's is .354. That agrees with your point, but then I can point out Swisher's .332 OBP last year.

Or the fact that he was a loser in the clubhouse and can't hit for any sort of average.

[ThunderBolt]

Swisher's OBP this year is .367, Pods's is .354. That agrees with your point, but then I can point out Swisher's .332 OBP last year.

And I’d point out the statistical aberration thing. Talking Swisher is like talking politics. You’re never going to change the other guys mind.

[Chisoxfn]

And I’d point out the statistical aberration thing. Talking Swisher is like talking politics. You’re never going to change the other guys mind.

Agreed, you have the stat guys and the more old school baseball guys. I side with the baseball guys and I'll never agree with the other side. My eyes don't lie, he stinks. The fact that he was a fan of the powdered sugar is just one of the many reasons I think he's a f***ing loser.

[knightni]

http://content.usatoday.com/topics/quote/P...0bdZfzz1HabO2/1

 

Nick Swisher Quote

"Anybody who gets caught now should be severely punished not for using drugs, but for being stupid enough to get caught."

 

 

[shakes]

What poor stats? Swisher’s had one bad year. That being for the White Sox last year. Including that year, Swisher still averages 28 homeruns, 86 RBI’s, an OBP of .356, and an OPS of .811. You can’t ask for much more from a guy who isn’t terrible at 1b, or any of the OF positions.

 

He's certainly been trending down since his excellent year in 2006. His numbers are nothing special for a 1b/corner outfielder. He's bounced back a bit this year with a couple of really hot stretches, in a good lineup and a great homerun park for a lefty.

 

The biggest problem I have with him is his approach. He is patient to a fault. I don't like seeing him up with risp, he looks at too many good pitches, thinking of drawing a walk instead of driving in runs. It's why he has never been a very good rbi man, and can't be a good middle of the lineup hitter. It's also why his average keeps going down. He sees his best pitches early in the count, often watching them go by, and never changes his approach with two strikes. All this while he seems to have lost a bit of bat speed the last couple of years. He rarely seems to make hard outs. I just think the league has adjusted fairly well to him, without him making the adjustments back.

 

[Paulie4Pres]

I actually disagree with this. I love Pods, but Swish would get on base more, and get caught stealing less.

 

It's hard to get caught stealing when you NEVER attempt to steal, isn't it? Swisher is not a threat on the basepaths at all. He has pretty poor speed. He sucks not because of any stats you decide to pull out, but because the guy would rather walk than get a hit. That would be great if, once he walked, he could at least bother the pitcher or steal some bases, but he can't. He has 7 stolen bases in 15 attemps in FIVE YEARS of MLB play. He's basically a poor offensive version of Jim Thome, that can play corner OF and 1B. His power numbers aren't good enought to bump 90% of the corner OFs or 1Bs in the MLB out of their starting job. He's not an RBI guy because his BA with RISP is poor, and he'd rather walk than get a hit, as was already pointed out. He's afraid to swing the bat. So, he pretty much sucks, as he doesn't really have a role on a team whose starting 1B, RF, and LF put up good power numbers and RBIs. He makes a ton of money, and is probably one of the most overrated guys that I've ever seen wear the Sox uniform. He sucks, period, and I am SO glad he's not on this team anymore. Stats be damned. Watch the guy play for f***'s sake.

Edited August 2, 2009 by CQMVP

[Felix]

It's hard to get caught stealing when you NEVER attempt to steal, isn't it? Swisher is not a threat on the basepaths at all. He has pretty poor speed. He sucks not because of any stats you decide to pull out, but because the guy would rather walk than get a hit. That would be great if, once he walked, he could at least bother the pitcher or steal some bases, but he can't. He has 7 stolen bases in 15 attemps in FIVE YEARS of MLB play. He's basically a poor offensive version of Jim Thome, that can play corner OF and 1B. His power numbers aren't good enought to bump 90% of the corner OFs or 1Bs in the MLB out of their starting job. He's not an RBI guy because his BA with RISP is poor, and he'd rather walk than get a hit, as was already pointed out. He's afraid to swing the bat. So, he pretty much sucks, as he doesn't really have a role on a team whose starting 1B, RF, and LF put up good power numbers and RBIs. He makes a ton of money, and is probably one of the most overrated guys that I've ever seen wear the Sox uniform. He sucks, period, and I am SO glad he's not on this team anymore. Stats be damned. Watch the guy play for f***'s sake.

I believe the point he's making is that Podsednik actually hurts the team on the basepaths because he doesn't steal at a high rate, meaning by not stealing, Swisher doesn't cost the team outs (and ultimately runs). I'd rather have Pods not steal when he's on, because he's only stealing bases at a 64% clip (a number that I don't think includes his multiple pickoffs this year), which really defeats the purpose of stealing in the first place.

 

But yes, this goes back to the whole statistical people vs old school baseball guys. Personally, I like stats and people telling me their opinion of a player just from watching isn't going to change my mind if the numbers don't agree.

Edited August 2, 2009 by Felix

[Paulie4Pres]

Pods may get caught stealing here and there, but he's putting pressure on their pitcher when he's on base. The pitcher isn't just thinking about the batter in that situation, he's trying to keep Pods close, they're pitching out here and there, etc. He's also scoring on hits that Swisher wouldn't score on. Swisher just doesn't have a niche that he fills, especially not on the Sox. He's not a better power hitter or RBI guy than Quentin, Konerko, Thome, or Dye, so where does he fit? He just doesn't. He's not the CF of the future for us, and he wasn't taking a corner OF or 1B job any time soon. You replace Podsednik with Swisher this year, and we're even MORE of a station to station team in the middle of the lineup, and, of course, who is our leadoff hitter then?

[southsider2k5]

Jhonny Nunez says hello. Coming to a bullpen near you soon.

 

Seriously I've seen the guy pitch, he's got a great arm.

 

http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/st...&pid=471919

 

Very soon as it turns out...

[ThunderBolt]

I believe the point he's making is that Podsednik actually hurts the team on the basepaths because he doesn't steal at a high rate, meaning by not stealing, Swisher doesn't cost the team outs (and ultimately runs).

My point exactly. Thanks for the assist, Felix.

[ThunderBolt]

More salt in the wound. How Swish got his groove back: http://www.nj.com/yankees/index.ssf/2009/0..._his_groov.html

[greg775]

And I’d point out the statistical aberration thing. Talking Swisher is like talking politics. You’re never going to change the other guys mind.

 

Great point. And my political view of him will never change. One of my least favorite Sox of all time. Hate everything about what he did in his time in Chicago.

[CanOfCorn]

He had his chance, he didn't do well, he was pulled, he pouted, buh-bye.

[witesoxfan]

Pods may get caught stealing here and there, but he's putting pressure on their pitcher when he's on base. The pitcher isn't just thinking about the batter in that situation, he's trying to keep Pods close, they're pitching out here and there, etc. He's also scoring on hits that Swisher wouldn't score on. Swisher just doesn't have a niche that he fills, especially not on the Sox. He's not a better power hitter or RBI guy than Quentin, Konerko, Thome, or Dye, so where does he fit? He just doesn't. He's not the CF of the future for us, and he wasn't taking a corner OF or 1B job any time soon. You replace Podsednik with Swisher this year, and we're even MORE of a station to station team in the middle of the lineup, and, of course, who is our leadoff hitter then?

 

will ypu please, pretty please, prove that to me statistically? Not that they are the end all, be all, but when a guy is stealing at around a 68% on the year and has been picked off atleast 6 times, it wouldn't appear that he's putting much pressure on anyone but his own team.

[santo=dorf]

I'd also like to know how much pressure a prancer on first is putting on the hitter at the plate. The saying is that the hitter will get more fastballs, but I have to believe the percentage of players swinging at junk and striking out goes way up when there's a guy taking off for second. Isn't that why Dye and Cabrera had to be separated last year?

[southsider2k5]

will ypu please, pretty please, prove that to me statistically? Not that they are the end all, be all, but when a guy is stealing at around a 68% on the year and has been picked off atleast 6 times, it wouldn't appear that he's putting much pressure on anyone but his own team.

 

How about the pick off throw that went into right field the other day?

[elrockinMT]

I'd also like to know how much pressure a prancer on first is putting on the hitter at the plate. The saying is that the hitter will get more fastballs, but I have to believe the percentage of players swinging at junk and striking out goes way up when there's a guy taking off for second. Isn't that why Dye and Cabrera had to be separated last year?

 

 

Well that was what Hawkeroo says isn't it? And Hawk has been around baseball forever. Just ask him. Ity always helps though if the batter at the plate is a contact hitter and not a free swinger or home run hitter

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Our biggest weakness this year IMO was our defense and Swisher was not going to help us there. He sucks in CF and he'd have never gotten playing time from Dye or CQ to start the year.

 

Injuries would have forced Swisher to become more of a regular player had we kept him, but that means we wouldn't have picked up Pods, and Pods' bat has helped us a ton. I can't say I'd expect Swisher to do the same since Pods makes contact with the baseball and finds holes while Swisher stands there like an asshole.

 

As far as 2009 goes, at best I can't see Swisher giving us more than one game or two as an improvement, but I'd bet on us actually having a worse record if we had kept him.

 

As for the future, we may have found a solid middle reliever in Jhonny Nunez, and Dayan Viciedo being in our system is a great thing. I'd take those two over Swisher any day. Plus, Swisher's money in 2010 would have eaten away at our chances to further improve the team. Swisher is not the type of player Kenny and Ozzie are targeting for their next window of contention so it makes no sense to pay him to be a square peg in a round hole.

Edited September 11, 2009 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[southsideirish71]

Why did KW trade Nick Swisher this offseason

 

 

 

[son of a rude]

Well that was what Hawkeroo says isn't it? And Hawk has been around baseball forever. Just ask him. Ity always helps though if the batter at the plate is a contact hitter and not a free swinger or home run hitter

Hawk's a moron.

[SoxFan562004]

It's so awesome when people compare an injury prone veteran's 2nd best career season with a younger player's career worse year (and many of Swisher's numbers aren't that much worse than Pods this year) For instance, Swisher had somewhere around a .332 OBP last year and Pods this year is .358, but their BAIP was about 100 points different!!! Pods roughly 30 points over his career average and Swisher 30 points under his. Also, Swisher was playing a new position full time. Over their careers Swisher doesn't make an out .18 more times than Pods does per plate appearance. So you can break down swinging, contact, walks, etc... but he makes less outs than Pods per plate appearance and he slugs .80 higher than him over his career!!! Pods does not nearly have a high enough SB% to overcome those.

 

Hey, it's great Pods has given the Sox a good year FOR HIM, and as I have posted earlier and gotten yelled at because I dared looked to next year, I have zero problem with bringing Pods back as a 4th OF on a one year dealer, but counting on him to contribute at this high level FOR HIM would be a mistake IMO.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/...ar=2008&t=b

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/...ar=2009&t=b

 

Who hits leadoff next year then? Beckham does. He's cheap he'll get on base and provide some pop at the top of the lineup.

 

Now, the argument I can buy is Swisher was too expensive and the Sox wanted to free payroll. That one I buy because obviously the cost between him and Pods is huge... now going forward it may be paying Rios over Swisher for a few years.

Edited September 11, 2009 by SoxFan562004