greg775 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 I disagree. The turf makes a big difference. Ask any doctor. Joe Crede is a great great baseball player and I will forever owe him a debt of gratitude for the title in 05. Go Joe!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 8, 2009 -> 02:00 PM) I disagree. The turf makes a big difference. Ask any doctor. Joe Crede is a great great baseball player and I will forever owe him a debt of gratitude for the title in 05. Go Joe!!! greg, what part arent you understanding. He played his entire career on grass, and he screwed up his back. Heck, you could argue the grass doesnt make a difference for him because no matter what, he is playing on hard dirt wherever he goes, wether it be Minnesota or Chicago. The likelihood of him incurring a back injury this year was pretty good, no matter what he did, his back injury wasnt Boras' fault. His swing, his all out diving style are not conducive to him staying healthy. He is just one of those players who cant stay healthy at the position he excels. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Sep 8, 2009 -> 12:33 PM) greg, what part arent you understanding. He played his entire career on grass, and he screwed up his back. Heck, you could argue the grass doesnt make a difference for him because no matter what, he is playing on hard dirt wherever he goes, wether it be Minnesota or Chicago. The likelihood of him incurring a back injury this year was pretty good, no matter what he did, his back injury wasnt Boras' fault. His swing, his all out diving style are not conducive to him staying healthy. He is just one of those players who cant stay healthy at the position he excels. End of story. How about we say it this way...the turf probably didn't help, but there's no reason to think that if he wasn't playing on turf his problems wouldn't have cropped back up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 8, 2009 -> 02:40 PM) How about we say it this way...the turf probably didn't help, but there's no reason to think that if he wasn't playing on turf his problems wouldn't have cropped back up? Couldn't have said it any better. Joe Crede could have played 3B on a jumphouse, and most likely his back would have still given out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 How about we say it this way...the turf probably didn't help, but there's no reason to think that if he wasn't playing on turf his problems wouldn't have cropped back up? Well said. I could agree with that. Wow Squert, one of the worst players in Sox history? He was one of the MVPs of our postseason run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 7, 2009 -> 04:41 PM) The one nice thing that would come out of Crede retiting is the end of the damned threads. Well that just sounds painful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 09:04 AM) His popout to bunt ratio is 3 points lower than most 3B in the league. Totally unacceptable. Stop it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Did Scott Boras screw Joe Crede by not attempting to sign him long term? After 2005 he could have gotten a great long term deal based on his post season heroics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (Jenks Heat @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 09:02 AM) Did Scott Boras screw Joe Crede by not attempting to sign him long term? After 2005 he could have gotten a great long term deal based on his post season heroics. Joe Crede was a full participant in those decisions. Every indication was the team wanted him to dump Boras and they'd have been thrilled to negotiate. Joe wouldn't do it. The team seemed to get more and more pissed with Boras with time as well, esp. when Boras's medical advice started differing from the advice of the team after 2006. Joe could probably have gotten quite a bit more money out of us after 2005 than what he earned in his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 The artificial turf is what screwed Joe Crede. If he retires I wish him the best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 03:47 AM) Well said. I could agree with that. Wow Squert, one of the worst players in Sox history? He was one of the MVPs of our postseason run. The Sqwert has a tendency to get carried away with his negativism. He knows Joe is/was good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 8, 2009 -> 08:00 PM) I disagree. The turf makes a big difference. Ask any doctor. Joe Crede is a great great baseball player and I will forever owe him a debt of gratitude for the title in 05. Go Joe!!! You and me both Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 01:02 PM) The Sqwert has a tendency to get carried away with his negativism. He knows Joe is/was good QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 01:03 PM) You and me both He knows Crede is/was injured. Look, he was a decent player for us who had a great postseason in 2005 and was an integral part of the World Series run and for that I thank him and he will always be remembered for that. But lets not exaggerate how good or bad he was, for he was a mediocre player who really didnt live up to his hype with the bat throughout his career and his back problems ruined that chance and are now ruining his career. He did some things very well, including his clutch hits and defense, but he was not a GOOD player, he was average with great moments and terrible moments. I appreciate Joe Crede for what he was, but lets not get carried away by saying he was an alltime great because of one postseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 01:00 PM) The artificial turf is what screwed Joe Crede. If he retires I wish him the best no it's not. He missed time in 2005 due to his back, he faded down the stretch in 2006 because of his back, he missed almost the entire 2007 season because of his back, and he missed 3 months in 2008 because of his back. He didn't hurt his back in the 10 games he played at the dome, 3 he played in Toronto, and 3 he played in Tampa each year. He hurt his back because he has an all-out swing, and he plays all-out defense. The artificial turf didn't do anything to help or hurt his back that Joe Crede had not already done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 01:02 PM) The Sqwert has a tendency to get carried away with his negativism. He knows Joe is/was good I was just goofin'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 7, 2009 -> 07:28 PM) Wow. It's not like he isn't a tough player. Have you known anybody with back problems? There's no way you can play baseball effectively with back problems. None. His ass of an agent was stupid getting him a deal with a team that plays on turf. This was a year he should have signed with a team that plays on grass, any team that plays on grass. It's funny seeing you say this because it's been said over and over and over that this is the reason Crede was losing effectiveness and wasn't likely to be effective anymore and as such wasn't a good fit for the Sox going forward, and yet it still got resistance. I guess it's just ironic. I thank Crede for all the good he's done for the Sox. I also recognize reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 7, 2009 -> 05:41 PM) The one nice thing that would come out of Crede retiting is the end of the damned threads. Amen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (lostfan @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 01:51 PM) It's funny seeing you say this because it's been said over and over and over that this is the reason Crede was losing effectiveness and wasn't likely to be effective anymore and as such wasn't a good fit for the Sox going forward, and yet it still got resistance. I guess it's just ironic. I thank Crede for all the good he's done for the Sox. I also recognize reality. Good point. Great post. Did we really want to flush 5 million dollars down the drain this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 01:56 PM) Good point. Great post. Did we really want to flush 5 million dollars down the drain this year? Plus, we didn't have to, we had Fields Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Perusing this thread I laughed, cringed, frowned, and even belched. If we were to boil down all of the comments and then run the residue through a colander we would come up with this: Joe has always played hard, was above average defensively, below average offensively, and has been plagued by back problems. But the thing that will rise to the top for most of us was that he did some magical things for us in 2005. And for that, we are eternally grateful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (hogan873 @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 02:08 PM) Perusing this thread I laughed, cringed, frowned, and even belched. If we were to boil down all of the comments and then run the residue through a colander we would come up with this: Joe has always played hard, was above average defensively, below average offensively, and has been plagued by back problems. But the thing that will rise to the top for most of us was that he did some magical things for us in 2005. And for that, we are eternally grateful. I mostly belched. But I always belch, so I'm not sure if it reflects on this discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (The Critic @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 03:29 PM) I mostly belched. But I always belch, so I'm not sure if it reflects on this discussion. I'm at work, so my belching was limited, but if I were at home enjoying a frothy Sam Adams I may belch more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 9, 2009 -> 11:09 AM) Joe Crede was a full participant in those decisions. Every indication was the team wanted him to dump Boras and they'd have been thrilled to negotiate. Joe wouldn't do it. The team seemed to get more and more pissed with Boras with time as well, esp. when Boras's medical advice started differing from the advice of the team after 2006. Joe could probably have gotten quite a bit more money out of us after 2005 than what he earned in his career. I was not solely blaming Boras it is always the players fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 He did some things very well, including his clutch hits and defense, but he was not a GOOD player, he was average with great moments and terrible moments. I appreciate Joe Crede for what he was, but lets not get carried away by saying he was an alltime great because of one postseason. I just don't agree with you sayinghe was not a GOOD player. What are your standards? The guy was a good player at the minimum. I would say he was a great fielder, no question and at the very least a good hitter. And by all accounts a good to great teammate. It's not his fault his back has ended his career prematurely. I don't understand you saying he was not a good player. I disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 I just don't agree with you sayinghe was not a GOOD player. What are your standards? The guy was a good player at the minimum. I would say he was a great fielder, no question and at the very least a good hitter. And by all accounts a good to great teammate. It's not his fault his back has ended his career prematurely. I don't understand you saying he was not a good player. I disagree. Greg, I have a really hard time calling a guy, who by the numbers, was a below average offensive player (compared to every hitter in the leage) at a corner position anything more than a "good" player. How can a player with a career 93 OPS+ (100 is the line for the "average" hitter) be a "good" hitter without question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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