Blame Game

[T R U]

I'd blame it on everyone except Kenny Williams. Putting any blame on him is quite funny to me actually.

 

Really? He is the one who put this mediocre team together.

 

Im not blaming him, but, to say that he shouldnt be blamed at all and if he is its funny doesn't make sense.

 

If you were going to make a list at who should be held accountable for this teams performance ide prolly have it

 

1. The Players

2. KW

3. Ozzie

[nitetrain8601]

I won't say I'm glad Swisher is gone, but Javy yes which is weird considering I was a much bigger fan of Javy's. Regardless, I think a stronger case has been made for Kenny. The problem is for me that the players seem to play with their heads up their ass. Our good defensive players didn't have enough bat to play. Our offensive players have lapses or flat out suck defensively. Our pitching has looked much worse because of it.

[Rowand44]

Really? He is the one who put this mediocre team together.

 

Im not blaming him, but, to say that he shouldnt be blamed at all and if he is its funny doesn't make sense.

 

If you were going to make a list at who should be held accountable for this teams performance ide prolly have it

 

1. The Players

2. KW

3. Ozzie

Cause on paper it isn't a mediocre team, it's actually a pretty solid one. We have absolutely 0 holes in our lineup yet we can't score runs. Our bullpen looked like one of the best in the league coming into the season and for the first few months it was probably the best. All Kenny has done is add and add and add to this squad and for some reason we're getting worse and it's not because he's bringing in bad players. These assholes(ya, this is how I feel about these guys right now) pretty much quit for some f***in reason and that's on them and the coaching staff. And btw I know it's going to be brought up, but I definitely don't want Ozzie fired this season, I just think he's done a poor job this year.

 

I feel like Kenny is the only one who actually did his job this season, that's why I feel like he doesn't deserve any blame.

[Balta1701]

The fact that he would spend 11 mil or whatever for Rios and not pony up for a guy like Hudson to have the entire year both confuses and infuriates me.

Would you have given up Jared Mitchell for him as well?

 

Would you trade Mitchell for 1 year of Hudson straight up?

[T R U]

Cause on paper it isn't a mediocre team, it's actually a pretty solid one.

 

You're right, that's why the players have to be the number one blame.

 

The fact that they aren't producing, and KW is the person who put it all together, is the reason why he should also be blamed.

 

Like I said though, im not blaming KW right now.. I guess there is still some chance we remove our head from our ass and get back in it but I wont hold my breath for it. I just know that KW put this team together, and even if the players don't perform he shouldn't get a pass. Its his job to bring in players to get the job done, not put together a great looking team on paper.

[fathom]

I never said I thought KW should be fired. All I'm saying is that with all the moves he's made since last season started, he got very little on the field this year to show for them. I'm well aware that Ozzie and KW aren't going anywhere. That's why it would be great if Walker and Cox are let go and see if that can help improve upon some of the major issues we see year in and year out.

[stretchstretch]

I voted Guillen, as I explained in detail in a few other threads. I'm a little stunned how many baseball knowledgeable people blame the 5 varied 40 man rosters we've had from 2005-2009 for collapsing in the final two months of the season, when they've all been driven by the same manager?

 

When a club is underperforming, people say what does a manager do anyway? well if there's one thing he does is right the ship when it veers off course, and that means keeping the athletes focused, confident, hungry and driven. how do they do that? well, the good/great one's know, the lesser ones such as Ozzie clearly don't.

 

in short, if we had the same guys for 5 yrs, that'd be one thing, but too many players from outside organizations have come here and caught White Sox Fever in August/September along with the rest of the club....

 

It's not KW, it simply cannot be the collective 5 x 40 man rosters, that leaves one Venezuelan constant

 

 

[T R U]

I voted Guillen, as I explained in detail in a few other threads. I'm a little stunned how many baseball knowledgeable people blame the 5 varied 40 man rosters we've had from 2005-2009 for collapsing in the final two months of the season, when they've all been driven by the same manager?

 

When a club is underperforming, people say what does a manager do anyway? well if there's one thing he does is right the ship when it veers off course, and that means keeping the athletes focused, confident, hungry and driven. how do they do that? well, the good/great one's know, the lesser ones such as Ozzie clearly don't.

 

in short, if we had the same guys for 5 yrs, that'd be one thing, but too many players from outside organizations have come here and caught White Sox Fever in August/September along with the rest of the club....

 

It's not KW, it simply cannot be the collective 5 x 40 man rosters, that leaves one Venezuelan constant

 

Yes, Ozzie needs to man up and tell Dye to stop hitting in the low .100s

 

That should fix him right up.

 

Maybe if he gives Linebrink a special massage he will start pitching better too.

 

OR, do you think the problem is that these 40 man rosters over the past 5 years have had the same problems every season that weren't properly addressed?

[Disco72]

Yes, Ozzie needs to man up and tell Dye to stop hitting in the low .100s

 

That should fix him right up.

 

Maybe if he gives Linebrink a special massage he will start pitching better too.

 

OR, do you think the problem is that these 40 man rosters over the past 5 years have had the same problems every season that weren't properly addressed?

 

At least something involving Linebrink would have a happy ending...

[T R U]

Is it Ozzies fault we trade Rowand for Thome and then had nothing but Brian Anderson for years holding out hope he would one day turn the light on? We had a CF problem for years, has nothing to do with Ozzie.

 

 

 

[LVSoxFan]

Guys I'm trying to remain objective here, and as far as blame goes... I'd say the team.

 

KW, as much as we like to bash him, made two HUGE moves this year; unfortunately, Peavy might not have been in time.

 

But after our awful April, I thought we'd be in the cellar. The fact that we're not is almost a miracle to me. Who knew that Jenks would start fading, or that Linebrink would be the 2009 version of McDougal?

 

Our offense, I believe, is the #1 culprit, followed closely by the insane amount of errors in the infield. Don't know how you fix that. All in all I'm happy with the infield, I have no idea why they keep doing this kind of stuff.

 

As for Contreras, what can you do? We were anchored to him--nobody else would take him.

 

Maybe we have one last big streak in us that can put us in the last-minute situation we saw last year. If not, I'm pretty confident about next year. But definitely: Dye, Konerko or Thome have GOT TO GO. We need some fire in this lineup, personality-wise.

[MiddleCoastBias]

At least something involving Linebrink would have a happy ending...

 

Simply awesome.

 

On the topic of getting rid of Javy and Swish, can someone remind me: did we have an opportunity to not bring Jose back this past off-season?

[Disco72]

Simply awesome.

 

On the topic of getting rid of Javy and Swish, can someone remind me: did we have an opportunity to not bring Jose back this past off-season?

 

No. Jose was under contract. He would have to have been traded or released.

[greg775]

The fact that he would spend 11 mil or whatever for Rios and not pony up for a guy like Hudson to have the entire year both confuses and infuriates me.

 

Excellent post; I feel this is the post of the thread.

 

My blame:

1.) Players: Simply maddeningly bad baseball for much of the season, especially against teams in our division (this horrid roadtrip notwithstanding).

2.) KW. He's the guy who put the team together, a team with a s*** bullpen and one that started the season with many holes. Time will tell on Rios. True we gave up nothing to get him, but I'm assuming his contract will limit what we can do with other players in the future. I don't see the logic in picking up Peavy during the season. Why not in the offseason? We're so far out, his presence doesn't matter a bit.

3.) Oz. I don't blame him for putting relievers not named Thornton or Jenks or Carrasco in the game. He has to use some of those other sorry excuses for MLB pitchers, or Thornton's arm would fall off. But the team this year shows no ability to rally late in games and has lost in some of the most bizarre ways. The s***ty play of his team falls on his shoulders as well. Lots of dumb mistakes. And he's also ultimately responsible for his coaching staff and we've had some horrible decisions made by Cox. Also many on this board think there's a problem in hitting philosophy. If so, that falls on Oz as well as Walk.

I'd have no problem giving Oz and KW a tie for second.

The players, however, are the true goats. They've played some bad baseball this year.

 

[kjshoe04]

I voted for the players. However, Ozzie has been just awful this year. Especially recently. There have been two situations late in games in the past week where he could have pinch ran and got us a tying or go ahead run but didn't. He's been real bad.

[Dick Allen]

The fact that he would spend 11 mil or whatever for Rios and not pony up for a guy like Hudson to have the entire year both confuses and infuriates me.

I totally agree with this. Hudson was there for the taking, and the only way you had to pay him $8 million this year was he had to perform. The Sox had no money, started crying about the Dodgers series attendance, then go on a spending spree. Somewhere, someone was BSing. While I love the Peavy trade, for this year, the Sox are going to pay him $4 million for nothing, and Rios, while not nearly as bad of player as he has shown since acquired, he's actually a pretty nice player, is no $60 million guy. So the Sox are locked into him. It could be worse, they could owe Soriano $90 million more.

 

Overall, we've been talking about the window for this team for years. We have been on borrowed time for years. The middle of the line-up, the heart is made up of streaky power guys who are station to station. Until that is changed, the White Sox are going to be inconsistant scoring runs. The White Sox also need to place a premium on catching the ball. KW is talking now of knowing the defense would be poor. Well, if you knew that and expected that, your expectations about winning a WS are ridiculous. The White Sox are a below average team. Peavy next year is a big improvement, but the bullpen has turned into a disaster. Do you pay Jenks his arb number? Pena, Linebrink, whoever else is out there in 2010 has to step up, or it will be the same thing all over again. If they were in the AL East and had to play 18 or 19 games against Boston, and Tampa and New York and even Toronto, they would easily be a 90 loss team. You couldn't say that in 2005 or 2006 or 2008. Its been a failure from JR to KW to OG to the coaching staff to the players. They have failed. All of the above would be my choice in the poll.

[WCSox]

Overall, we've been talking about the window for this team for years. We have been on borrowed time for years. The middle of the line-up, the heart is made up of streaky power guys who are station to station. Until that is changed, the White Sox are going to be inconsistant scoring runs.

 

^^^

 

This

 

[santo=dorf]

Would you have given up Jared Mitchell for him as well?

 

Would you trade Mitchell for 1 year of Hudson straight up?

Yes, who cares about Mitchell specifically? I'm guessing there will be at least two players drafted after Mitchell that will do well in the MLB and people will complain about not drafting them instead.

 

Want that first round pick back? Offer Hudson arbitration after the season. There's a possibility it won't be a first round pick, but you get a sandwich pick on top of it too.

[santo=dorf]

Is it Ozzies fault we trade Rowand for Thome and then had nothing but Brian Anderson for years holding out hope he would one day turn the light on? We had a CF problem for years, has nothing to do with Ozzie.

Ozzie's handling of Brian was terrible, and there's a great chance Konerko doesn't come back after 2005 without the Thome trade. With the exception of 2007, which was a lost year for the Sox, Rowand's numbers have been very pedestrian.

 

I'm also wondering at what point should we start expecting results from our minor leagues under the watch of the losingest manager in MLB history (I keep hearing so much about how he's going to help.) We've traded 3 former 1st round picks this year. 1 for a premium pitcher, 1 for a backup catcher, and 1 for a washed up backup OF and 1B. Another 1st round pick is rotting in the minors and might not be with the team next year.

[Reddy]

I blame Soxtalk for getting too emotionally attatched to this team. They couldn't handle the insane amount of pressure we put on them.

 

In reality I think blame goes around to everyone. You win and lose as a team. Everyone is to blame for a loss and everyone is to be cheered for a win. Obviously it's not always black and white like that. But you do win and lose as a team. Changes need to be done throughout a season and besides trades, not many changes have happend with this team. They've been terrible on defense all year, overall the pitching hasn't been good, the batting average has been low all year, the way the team approaches situations with baserunners has been terrible too. We're two games under .500, meaning we're basically an average team.

 

thank you. from the moment this season started i assumed we'd be mediocre. We've been mediocre. I'm not disappointed. I mean sure it'd be great to win, but honestly, I don't wanna be the 83 win Cardinals from ... 07? (don't rember).

 

[EvilJester99]

I say you blame the players... they are the ones not getting it done when it counts.

[FlaSoxxJim]

I say you blame the players... they are the ones not getting it done when it counts.

 

This exercise is a needed way for us to vent, but it is as simple as the players not playing to their potential for the entire year.

[kjshoe04]

thank you. from the moment this season started i assumed we'd be mediocre. We've been mediocre. I'm not disappointed. I mean sure it'd be great to win, but honestly, I don't wanna be the 83 win Cardinals from ... 07? (don't rember).

Rember made me laugh pretty hard.

[whitesoxfan101]

I don't quite understand how so many people blame the players when the team is not really all that close to a playoff team. If you just barely miss the playoffs, it's because either the manager screwed it up and was the culprit behind a few losses, or the players just didn't perform down the stretch. However, in a season like this, when the team is below .500 and not very close to a playoff team, it's because you don't have good enough players. And if you don't have good enough players, it's the general managers fault, period. I still think we have a bright future, but this year not so much.

[Balta1701]

I don't quite understand how so many people blame the players when the team is not really all that close to a playoff team. If you just barely miss the playoffs, it's because either the manager screwed it up and was the culprit behind a few losses, or the players just didn't perform down the stretch. However, in a season like this, when the team is below .500 and not very close to a playoff team, it's because you don't have good enough players. And if you don't have good enough players, it's the general managers fault, period. I still think we have a bright future, but this year not so much.

Because a number of the players flat out should be doing better than they currently are.