5th Starter in 2010?

[Balta1701]

IIRC, a $1M option for next year with another $1M in incentives.

Up to $ 2million in incentives based on innings pitched.

[flavum]

Not knowing he had a $1 mil option, yeah, he'll be back.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Torres, Nunez, Hernandez, Link, Egbert have 24 major league innings combined between them. What gives anyone the right to just write them off immediately?

I don't think Torres really have a spot on this team next year unless someone gets hurt. Freddy should be back in the rotation, and if not, it'll probably be Hudson. Carrasco has the LR spot on lockdown, and Torres doesn't exactly have the stuff to pitch out of the pen unless it's a LR role, especially as a righty. If Torres was a lefty it would be a different story because we have ziltch as far as lefties go.

 

Nunez should have a chance to compete for a one-inning job in the pen, same with Link, but Nunez looks like he's passed Link on the depth chart. I'd say the same about DRod too. Both Link and DRod could be gone after the year.

 

Hernandez is supposed to have a very nice change, but he lacks the velocity to really interest the Sox as a righty. Kenny loves the harder throwers with sink and Fernando is probably out of the picture for next year, and I think there's a very good chance Fernando is with another team in ST next year.

 

Egbert probably had his shot too, as brief as it was. There would have to be several injuries or the complete implosions of several veterans in the pen for Egbert to get another shot. With Peavy back he'd be no better than 8th on the starting depth chart, and he could easily be behind Harrell, Hynick, Cassell, and Ely as well, and possibly even Whisler. Egbert could easily be the 14th starter right now, and as a long man he's in about the same situation because the others in front of him in the rotation pecking order are probably ahead of him in the LR pecking order also. Egbert being moved back to the rotation after the failed relief experiment is very telling when it comes to his future here. I'd bet on the Sox waiving Egbert over the offseason to clear a 40-man roster spot to protect a couple guys from the Rule-5.

 

IMO, this is how it should shake out if we keep Jenks and don't bring in another veteran:

 

5th starter "competition": Freddy, Hudson, Torres, Hynick with Freddy having to be HORRIBLE to lose the job. Torres and Hynick will just be there to push Freddy and Hudson a bit.

 

One 6th inning RHP spot in the pen: Hudson (first crack), Nunez (second crack), with Omogrosso, Harrell, Santeliz, and Nathan Jones making up the majority of the competition. Link, DRod, and Hernandez could bring up the rear, but all could be gone by next spring. Link IMO has the best shot of the 3 at staying in the organization.

 

Secondary lefty competition: Kenny will bring in a bunch of nobodies, maybe he picks up a couple guys with legit arms. Randy Williams could return on a minor league contract, but he probably gets dropped from the 40-man. Whisler might be off the roster too, it depends on how many guys the Sox have to protect and what other moves they make, but if Whisler is dropped he could also sign a minor league deal and compete for the spot. If this competition is full of a bunch of sorry asses then Charlie Leesman and Santos Rodriguez will be brought in to push whoever is there. The odds are very long against either of those guys making the team, but if the lefties Kenny brings in are as bad as they were in 2006, there's always that chance.

 

As the season moves along, if Hudson starts in the pen, the Sox will slowly groom him for a regular late inning role. If Hudson gets comfortable there and does very well, then Torres/Hynick/Ely/Shirek/Harrell could be the main options if we need a spot start or if a starter goes down.

[caulfield12]

Has anyone actually seen Santos Rodriguez pitch in person?

 

Does he throw a legit mid-90's from the LH side? Perhaps Jones or Rodriguez become the next Scott Radinsky or Boone Logan to basically jump from A ball to the bigs.

[greg775]

Hudson/Freddy will battle it out. The loser should be middle relief.

Torres loves to pitch from the stretch, anyway, so he might as well be added to our relief corps.

[ILMOU]

Has anyone actually seen Santos Rodriguez pitch in person?

 

Does he throw a legit mid-90's from the LH side? Perhaps Jones or Rodriguez become the next Scott Radinsky or Boone Logan to basically jump from A ball to the bigs.

 

This is what I want to know as well. I saw a tweet on FutureSox describing him as a "power arm", so I'm encouraged. I'm hoping he'll be in B'Ham soon enough next year to get some feedback from JPN, and until then, maybe we'll get some input from Mr. Collari at W-S.

 

Or even better, as you suggest, I'd love it if he made the BIG jump. These power lefty relievers aren't easy to come by, and they're expensive to acquire, to say the least.

 

[elrockinMT]

Freddy's been very impressive in his last three starts against two great offensive teams. I'd say he's the front-runner right now with Hudson being behind him.

 

 

I say Garcia because of his experience. He can make the most of what he has left and it appears he is healthy again. I still have issues with Hudson and Torres as far as their consistency. One real good outing and that is followed by a bad one. Rokies might need more seasoning where as Freddie is ready.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Has anyone actually seen Santos Rodriguez pitch in person?

 

Does he throw a legit mid-90's from the LH side? Perhaps Jones or Rodriguez become the next Scott Radinsky or Boone Logan to basically jump from A ball to the bigs.

There were reports of him hitting 100 coming over from the Braves organization.

 

It's unlikely Jones makes the jump in spring and extremely unlikely Santos does it, but those are our two biggest relief arms from each side. If Jones comes out firing, throwing strikes, making everyone look stupid, then it's hard to deny an arm like that. If the Sox' best lefties in the competition happen to be trash like Randy Williams and Wes Whisler, then a guy like Santos is also going to be hard to deny if he is throwing good strikes.

 

Hopefully Kenny brings in a legit lefty who is ready though. Nate Jones, if he keeps throwing strikes like he has been, should at least be a September callup next year.

 

Edit: also, my guess is both are still pretty wild in the zone, so both need something else aside from the fastball. Jones has a hammer curve, but Santos I think is still developing a secondary pitch and doesn't have much to work off of. The Sox will probably take it slow with Santos, but Nate seems to be coming along well.

Edited September 9, 2009 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[Balta1701]

Hopefully Kenny brings in a legit lefty who is ready though. Nate Jones, if he keeps throwing strikes like he has been, should at least be a September callup next year.

I've got to believe KW will attempt to do that on the FA market. There's enough guys out there who can be decent situational lefties who will accept a 1-2 year deal for a couple million dollars that it wouldn't make sense to leave that as a hole.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I say Garcia because of his experience. He can make the most of what he has left and it appears he is healthy again. I still have issues with Hudson and Torres as far as their consistency. One real good outing and that is followed by a bad one. Rokies might need more seasoning where as Freddie is ready.

Hudson has looked very consistent IMO. He's throwing strikes and hitting the corners. I was mad at Ozzie yesterday because he cost Huddy an earned run by sending out the garbage truck with just one man on.

 

Torres OTOH has no business being in a Major League rotation for a team which has playoff aspirations. As a long reliever he might one day end up somewhere, but probably not. I love his attitude and confidence and balls, but he's not any good at all.

[Balta1701]

Torres OTOH has no business being in a Major League rotation for a team which has playoff aspirations. As a long reliever he might one day end up somewhere, but probably not. I love his attitude and confidence and balls, but he's not any good at all.

Why do you say that? From what we've seen it looks like he has a good low 90's fastball with some movement, some non-terrible offspeed stuff, does need to work on his control but has already shown flashes. Am I wrong on any of that? It's not like he's getting outs entirely by trickery. If he doesn't have good control on a day right now he gets shelled, but that's what happens with most kids.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I've got to believe KW will attempt to do that on the FA market. There's enough guys out there who can be decent situational lefties who will accept a 1-2 year deal for a couple million dollars that it wouldn't make sense to leave that as a hole.

I hope so. Bring in a Will Ohman or something. I'm just planning for the worst however.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Why do you say that? From what we've seen it looks like he has a good low 90's fastball with some movement, some non-terrible offspeed stuff, does need to work on his control but has already shown flashes. Am I wrong on any of that? It's not like he's getting outs entirely by trickery. If he doesn't have good control on a day right now he gets shelled, but that's what happens with most kids.

He's got that tight little curve and slider he throws with next to nothing on his fastball and he finds the middle of the plate far too often. He doesn't just need control, he needs basically impeccable control, and probably an over-anxious offense like the Cubs were. DJ Carrasco has much better stuff IMO and I wouldn't want DJ starting. I wouldn't call Torres a finesse guy like Carrasco though, I'd call Torres a balls guy who goes out there and makes the opposition swing the bat. Unfortunately, Major League hitters aren't going to miss him too much.

[WCSox]

He's got that tight little curve and slider he throws with next to nothing on his fastball and he finds the middle of the plate far too often. He doesn't just need control, he needs basically impeccable control, and probably an over-anxious offense like the Cubs were. DJ Carrasco has much better stuff IMO and I wouldn't want DJ starting. I wouldn't call Torres a finesse guy like Carrasco though, I'd call Torres a balls guy who goes out there and makes the opposition swing the bat. Unfortunately, Major League hitters aren't going to miss him too much.

 

I agree with this to an extent. I like Torres' aggressiveness, but in the two starts of his that I've seen him pitch this year, he was constantly missing his spots. That doesn't necessarily sentence him to being a career minor-leaguer, but he's probably not going to make it into the rotation with Garcia and Hudson as options, and I don't see him displacing Carrasco in long relief.

 

[Balta1701]

I agree with this to an extent. I like Torres' aggressiveness, but in the two starts of his that I've seen him pitch this year, he was constantly missing his spots. That doesn't necessarily sentence him to being a career minor-leaguer, but he's probably not going to make it into the rotation with Garcia and Hudson as options, and I don't see him displacing Carrasco in long relief.

If we carry a 7 man bullpen like we have most of this season I believe...he doesn't exactly have to replace Carrasco, just give you another option.

[WCSox]

If we carry a 7 man bullpen like we have most of this season I believe...he doesn't exactly have to replace Carrasco, just give you another option.

 

If we have room for him, I don't have a problem with him on the roster. That said, I see him doing much more than mop-up duty or possibly an occasional spot-start/injury replacement.

 

[Balta1701]

If we have room for him, I don't have a problem with him on the roster. That said, I see him doing much more than mop-up duty or possibly an occasional spot-start/injury replacement.

Of course he will do more than that, that's how Ozzie uses his pen. If he's at all effective, doesn't really matter. Moving Carrasco to the 6th-7th inning role could give us a clear benefit too.

[Ozzie Ball]

Has anyone actually seen Santos Rodriguez pitch in person?

 

Does he throw a legit mid-90's from the LH side? Perhaps Jones or Rodriguez become the next Scott Radinsky or Boone Logan to basically jump from A ball to the bigs.

Baseball America say he has a low-90’s sinking fastball and promising slider. I know there were some rumours about him moving to the rotation and I was hoping he'd make the transition since relievers only have so much value, obviously he'd need a third pitch for that... maybe next year.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Baseball America say he has a low-90’s sinking fastball and promising slider. I know there were some rumours about him moving to the rotation and I was hoping he'd make the transition since relievers only have so much value, obviously he'd need a third pitch for that... maybe next year.

That sucks. I could have sworn I read that he was a guy who could touch 100, so I looked for that but could only find obscure references to him being a power arm and having a lot of potential and all that stuff. Ugh.