Ozzie explodes

[NorthSideSox72]

Most fans stopped caring about this season months ago......when the fans show apathy towards the team, the team shows apathy towards the game. I don't blame Ozzie for melting down (in fact, I'm glad he did)....however, I can't blame the players for "checking out" when the the majority of the "fan support" did so a few months ago. If we want a winning attitude throughout the organization, it has to exist within the fan base as well.

Did you read the thread before posting? The Sox drew 35k last night, even though the team is out of it (some are DET fans I am sure, but not enough to make up 35k). Your idea of the fans not supporting the team is absurd and patently false.

 

Also, are you seriously saying it is the job of the fans to motivate the players? Because I'm pretty sure it should be the other way around.

 

[South Side Fireworks Man]

Both sides of this are valid, really.

I have no problem with guys checking out other games, other sports, whatever. Big deal.

But, one would have to have been in the clubhouse to understand if being PO'd was warranted.

 

i.e.

After the loss were most of the guys down, PO'd, or even just bewildered?

If so and they just happened to be checking out the games out of interest or escape, fine, Ozzie out of line.

 

Or were they apathetic, looking only to get to the nearest TV, little regard for any post-game reflection or words from the manager?

If such is the case being PO'd is warranted, yet the problem is Ozzie has shot his wad so many times that those who've been around are no longer affected by it, and the youngsters can tell. Not good.

Good post.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Wasn't the Georgia /Arizona St. game ending shortly after the Sox game. Maybe Beckham wanted to watch his alma mater eek out a thrilling victory. I frankly don't have a problem with it. The game is already over. What are the players supposed to do ? Sulk ? Ozzie is from Venezuela and didn't go to college so he can't imagine what it's like being a fan of the school you like or attended. Not only that but the only football he cares about probably isn't played with that funny shaped ball Americans like so much but a white round one you kick around.

 

I read the TV's were already on and maybe some staff members were watching the games and so you come in after a loss and sit down and watch and unwind after yet another bad loss.

Edited September 27, 2009 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[Texsox]

Obviously you paid no money to watch last night's game. The people who did deserve a better effort, and if you are so unmoved by getting embarrassed that you can't wait to watch a college football game, I hope they find the door for you. This is a player's job. I don't know who was watching games and Konerko's quote that the TVs were already on, indicate to me that the players actually had them on during last night's game as many are in the clubhouse during the game.

 

Perhaps its being blown out of proportion a little bit, but Ozzie has every right to be pissed off. I prefer guys that hate to lose myself, not guys who say, well we can't win so who cares. I hope incidents like this help management weed out the riff raff.

 

You make a lot of great points. But I will stand by my thought that I would rather have a guy that plays 100% when there is something to play for then drops to 50% after the team is eliminated, than some guy that plays 80% all the time.

 

And of course we all want guys that play 100% all the time, but I really do not believe there are that many guys like that.

Plus, who knows maybe a few guys in management have bets on the Twin winning the division.

[fathom]

I could understand Ozzie being pissed if some players seem to be more interested in a football game than the Sox game. However, if any of Ozzie's ire is directed at A.J. after the way A.J. has played this season as well as his entire time with the White Sox, then Ozzie is truly out of his mind.

 

Also, if the situation is as bad as Ozzie makes it sound, then it appears as if he has truly lost the clubhouse and the respect of his players. If that is the case, maybe he should consider hanging it up.

 

AJP is the main suspect in this situation, no doubt about it. If Ozzie's actually calling him out for not caring, then Ozzie needs to be shown the door.

[Texsox]

And my opinion could really change based on who was involved. Perhaps someone like AJ should set a better example, but yo question his competitiveness would be crazy.

[sin city sox fan]

Did you read the thread before posting? The Sox drew 35k last night, even though the team is out of it (some are DET fans I am sure, but not enough to make up 35k). Your idea of the fans not supporting the team is absurd and patently false.

 

Also, are you seriously saying it is the job of the fans to motivate the players? Because I'm pretty sure it should be the other way around.

 

I don't know the particulars of last night crowd....therefore, I didn't comment on it at all. What I said was that most fans "checked out" of this season months ago and all one has to do is look at the archives of this board to see it.

 

As for "fans motivating players" vs. "players motivating fans", I think its a mutual relationship and both should motivate each other. You can contend the players haven't done their job this year (and I'd agree), but I think the "fan support" overall this season has been horrendous and absolutely killed our prospects of saving the season.

 

When most fans are saying things like "you suck", "get rid of them all", and "this team has no chance to win", its definitely not motivating to the team you support.

 

I don't care who you are....when you hear something enough, you start to believe it (why do you think a lot of people think people buy snuggies? because they view enough commercials that tell them its a comfortable item to wear while watching TV). Most kids who get bad grades in school do so because peers or teachers label them as "dumb" and they tend to believe so.

 

I know Ozzie does a lot to try and motivate this team and get them to believe in their abilities. However, when its the voice of 1 vs. an entire fan base, he's fighting a losing battle.

 

Losing sucks....but as Ozzie said in his post game comments its part of the game. However, if the fan base accepts it, the players will too. If you want change, than motivate them to do so.....don't tear down the morale of the team and infiltrate the organization with more of the "we suck" attitude.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

AJP is the main suspect in this situation, no doubt about it. If Ozzie's actually calling him out for not caring, then Ozzie needs to be shown the door.

Agreed.

[bobryansson]

My wife and son and 2 friends were 4 of the 35k fans. They said the place was rocking with support, at least until it was out of hand. Stone said on TV that the fan support was great. Don't blame the fans. They paid good, hard earned $$$ to see the Sox play a kid's game that many of us play for fun and for which the athletes are paid extremely well. Players are pretty full of themselves when they forget the debt they owe to the people who ultimately pay their outrageous salaries.

I can get a clue even on TV whether a player cares or is just going through the motions. I am sure that Ozzie was able to tell about who cared and who didn't, and that those who didn't care were watching TV.

TV's were "already on." Highly paid prima donnas feel it is below them to turn them off? Hard to know, because it is really unlikely I'll ever play in MLB, but I think I would be so pissed about going from 5-0 up to lose 12-5 that I'd say something to the effect of, "I don't want to hear that football "stuff,"" and turn it off myself.

They owe it to the game, the fans, the coaches and owners, and even themselves to work their hardest and care about winning every game. I, personally, believe that Ozzie does. I may not agree with all his managing decisions, but I never doubt his love of, and respect for, the game.

[fathom]

Ozzie confirmed before the game today that it was a veteran who he was calling out, and not one of Ramirez/Quentin/Beckham/Getz/Flowers

[Soxbadger]

Did you read the thread before posting? The Sox drew 35k last night, even though the team is out of it (some are DET fans I am sure, but not enough to make up 35k). Your idea of the fans not supporting the team is absurd and patently false.

 

I was at the game last night, id say 50% were Tiger fans.

 

This tirade was about Ozzie trying to cover up his antics during the game. When the Sox were up 5-0 he started getting in a fight with a Tigers fan. I swear that he didnt pull Garcia because he was trying to show the fan up. The move backfired horrendously and the Sox gave the game away.

 

The best way to deflect your own mistakes is to blame other people.

 

Im sorry but watching football games didnt lose last nights game, Ozzie's use of the pitching staff did.

 

Man up Ozzie and admit that yelling at a fan for 15 minutes wasnt what you should be doing. Just for once take responsibility for your own bulls***.

Edited September 27, 2009 by Soxbadger

[ThunderBolt]

Ozzie confirmed before the game today that it was a veteran who he was calling out, and not one of Ramirez/Quentin/Beckham/Getz/Flowers

I think AJ really is the most likely candidate.

Paulie was drafted out of High school from Arizona

Dye was drafted out of High School from a California HS.

Brinkey went to Texas State University

Peavy was drafted out of HS in Alabama

Buehrle went to Jefferson College in Missouri

Kotsay went to Cal-Fullerton

Randy Williams went to Lamar

DJ Carrasco was drafted out of HS in Arizona

Thornton went to Grand Valley State in Michigan

And AJ is an unabashed huge Florida guy who had signed a letter of intent to Tennessee, but chose to go pro.

None of the other guys had their teams on that night, did they? We can’t rule out the possibility that one of them, like, AJ likes a team that doesn’t really add up logically from where they were born, but it’s not a huge leap to assume that the man in question is AJ.

 

[greg775]

As for "fans motivating players" vs. "players motivating fans", I think its a mutual relationship and both should motivate each other. You can contend the players haven't done their job this year (and I'd agree), but I think the "fan support" overall this season has been horrendous and absolutely killed our prospects of saving the season.

 

Hasn't attendance been great? There weren't 50 percent Tiger fans there last night. No way. Tiger fans don't travel that well. Fan support has been great. Some of the Sox worst pathetic performances have been at home before big crowds.

Edited September 27, 2009 by greg775

[SoxAce]

Hasn't attendance been great? There weren't 50 percent Tiger fans there last night. No way. Tiger fans don't travel that well. Fan support has been great.

 

Meh.. all year. And I'd trust someone who was actually at the game last night then someone who speculates. I can believe it, but then again it was a Saturday night.

[Soxbadger]

You obviously werent at the game last night then. At least 1/3 were Tigers fans in the lower box seats and I didnt get a chance to go to the upper deck, but judging by previous games ive been to recently (upper deck barely having fans) my guess is that they were mainly Tigers fans.

[greg775]

Badger, we've averaged 30,000 or so fans haven't we. Before the WS title we had real attendance problems some years. The fans have shown up in huge numbers again this year.

[Texsox]

but I think I would be so pissed about going from 5-0 up to lose 12-5 that I'd say something to the effect of, "I don't want to hear that football "stuff,"" and turn it off myself.

 

I agree with almost your entire post and I agree with others that believe the players on the field owe it to the fans to play hard the entire game. I disagree that a player has to be pissed for very long after the game. It is a long, 162 game season, and even in the best of times, there will be 70 loses. Imagine coming home pissed from work 125 days out of the year? (I'm comparing 50 weeks of work to a baseball season). That is probably not how to remain confident and focused for a season or a career.

[greg775]

Oz hasn't gone off in the clubhouse much at all this stinky season. It was about time he went crazy.

AJ probably screwed up here in racing to the TV for the Florida game before eating, showering, letting Ozzie shut his door.

If it's AJ, I think we've read enough that Ozzie respects AJ, so it'll blow over quickly.

[Soxbadger]

Greg,

 

The numbers are usually inflated. Ive seen them put up 29k on the scoreboard (last week) and I felt that it was closer to 20k. Last night it was legitimately filled and unfortunately there were a lot of Tigers fans (more Lets go Tigers chants than Lets go Sox). Generally when one of those chants starts the whole crowd starts to boo and shout down the visitor fans. Last night it never happened.

 

Sox fans started leaving early and there were still a ton of Tigers fans in the seats. I saw them in the first row, places you never see opposing fans. A lot of season ticket holders did not show last night.

 

(Edit)

 

Ozzie was yelling at a Tiger fan in the first row during the inning where the Sox gave up the lead.

 

How is that not more distracting than a player watching football before or after a game?

 

Ozzie needs to take responsibility it was insane.

Edited September 27, 2009 by Soxbadger

[sin city sox fan]

Hasn't attendance been great? There weren't 50 percent Tiger fans there last night. No way. Tiger fans don't travel that well. Fan support has been great. Some of the Sox worst pathetic performances have been at home before big crowds.

 

Attendance has been down about 2000 per game compared to last year....but I'm not even talking about numbers. Its attitude and actions that prevail. There are a lot of "White Sox fans" (and I use that term loosely) that I wish would convert to the "other team" in town. I'd rather have 50% of the fans and have them give 100% support to the team than to have 100% of our current fans who only deliver 50% support (if we're lucky). Attitudes prevail upon an organization....I don't care if the environment is an office or a ballpark. If you're a real fan of this organization, you are planning for the 2010 World Series now (although I've already seen people on this board dismissing our chances next season before a game is ever played).

 

[scenario]

The more I think about it, the more I believe Ozzie's little outburst was simply him venting after a bad game at the end of a disappointing season.

 

I don't think the fact that there were TVs on and people watching football had much to do with anything.

 

If it wasn't this, he would have found something else to blow up about.

Edited September 27, 2009 by scenario

[lostfan]

Attendance has been down about 2000 per game compared to last year....but I'm not even talking about numbers. Its attitude and actions that prevail. There are a lot of "White Sox fans" (and I use that term loosely) that I wish would convert to the "other team" in town. I'd rather have 50% of the fans and have them give 100% support to the team than to have 100% of our current fans who only deliver 50% support (if we're lucky). Attitudes prevail upon an organization....I don't care if the environment is an office or a ballpark. If you're a real fan of this organization, you are planning for the 2010 World Series now (although I've already seen people on this board dismissing our chances next season before a game is ever played).

Yeah I mean it must be pretty bad for the Pirates, all those fans saying the team sucks causing them to play like they're a bad team or something.

 

I'm sorry but I don't accept this line of logic at all. If what I see looks like s*** I'm not going to pretend it's not s***. I'm still going to watch games (I am now, even) but I'm not going to delude myself into thinking I shouldn't be pissed off as a fan. That doesn't make any sense at all.

[Soxbadger]

His vent was so that no one asked the question:

 

"During the 7th inning, why were you busy yelling at a Tigers fan in the front row and didnt pull out Garcia?"

[Texsox]

The more I think about it, the more I believe Ozzie's little outburst was simply him venting after a bad game at the end of a disappointing season.

 

I don't think the fact that there were TVs on and people watching football had much to do with anything.

 

If it wasn't this, he would have found something else to blow up about.

 

ding ding ding! Great point.

[Soxbadger]

People who werent at the game dont even know about the Ozzie outburst in the 7th.

 

Have any newspaper articles even talked about it?