The Highlights of 2009

[danman31]

FutureSox: The Highlights of 2009

The minor league season has been over for a couple weeks and the Major League regular season is in its final week. Let’s take a look at the best of the White Sox minors in 2009.

[ThunderBolt]

Were their really no highlights below AA ball? Outside of Morel that is.

Edited October 1, 2009 by Thunderbolt

[danman31]

Were their really no highlights below AA ball? Outside of Morel that is.

Honestly, not that many. Nathan Jones showing some control, but seeing his K rate turn mediocre at Winston-Salem. I thought about mentioning Griffin just because he was healthy, but he's not the same yet. I could have mentioned Bellamy's dominance, but I was trying to focus on guys not drafted in 2009.

[NorthSideSox72]

Honestly, not that many. Nathan Jones showing some control, but seeing his K rate turn mediocre at Winston-Salem. I thought about mentioning Griffin just because he was healthy, but he's not the same yet. I could have mentioned Bellamy's dominance, but I was trying to focus on guys not drafted in 2009.

I don't agree - Kanny had a phenomenal pitching staff this year, and to me that is worth mentioning. Look up and down at the pitchers who were on Kanny's opening day roster, and see how their seasons went - guys like Hudson, Leesman, Infante (though he faded), Jones, Sauer, Dex Carter, Remenowsky, Burdie, Corley, O'Neill... then picked up Bellamy, Serafin and Griffith later... that pitching is what got Kanny to their postseason berth, and that is a lot of talent there.

 

[danman31]

I don't agree - Kanny had a phenomenal pitching staff this year, and to me that is worth mentioning. Look up and down at the pitchers who were on Kanny's opening day roster, and see how their seasons went - guys like Hudson, Leesman, Infante (though he faded), Jones, Sauer, Dex Carter, Remenowsky, Burdie, Corley, O'Neill... then picked up Bellamy, Serafin and Griffith later... that pitching is what got Kanny to their postseason berth, and that is a lot of talent there.

Hudson I mentioned.

I wanted to avoid 09 draft picks (no Serafin or Bellamy).

Infante's 2nd half took him off a mention.

Jones and Griffin I admit were close, but I didn't want to have the piece be too long.

Leesman had a mediocre 2:1 K:BB ratio as a 22 year-old in Low-A. He's marginal right now.

Carter got traded away so he's hardly a highlight.

I like Sauer and a few of the relievers you mentioned, but it's a wait and see approach.

 

The only guy I thought about mentioning and really should have is Remenowsky because his stats are eye popping. For the most part though, I didn't want to write about a dozen guys and lose everyone's interest half way in.

[NorthSideSox72]

Hudson I mentioned.

I wanted to avoid 09 draft picks (no Serafin or Bellamy).

Infante's 2nd half took him off a mention.

Jones and Griffin I admit were close, but I didn't want to have the piece be too long.

Leesman had a mediocre 2:1 K:BB ratio as a 22 year-old in Low-A. He's marginal right now.

Carter got traded away so he's hardly a highlight.

I like Sauer and a few of the relievers you mentioned, but it's a wait and see approach.

 

The only guy I thought about mentioning and really should have is Remenowsky because his stats are eye popping. For the most part though, I didn't want to write about a dozen guys and lose everyone's interest half way in.

Yeah, I can see that the article really emphasized individuals, which makes sense for prospects. I think if you were to mention it, you'd talk about Kanny's staff as a whole, as an interesting note. I agree it would be too polluted and distracting to get into all those people individually in any detail.

 

Actually, if I were to put my money where my mouth was, I could write a seperate FS piece specifically on that.

 

[danman31]

Actually, if I were to put my money where my mouth was, I could write a seperate FS piece specifically on that.

Go for it. We have a long offseason to fill up.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Hudson I mentioned.

I wanted to avoid 09 draft picks (no Serafin or Bellamy).

Infante's 2nd half took him off a mention.

Jones and Griffin I admit were close, but I didn't want to have the piece be too long.

Leesman had a mediocre 2:1 K:BB ratio as a 22 year-old in Low-A. He's marginal right now.

Carter got traded away so he's hardly a highlight.

I like Sauer and a few of the relievers you mentioned, but it's a wait and see approach.

 

The only guy I thought about mentioning and really should have is Remenowsky because his stats are eye popping. For the most part though, I didn't want to write about a dozen guys and lose everyone's interest half way in.

From the draft:

SCOUTING REPORT (3/1): Leesman has a live arm from a high three-quarters slot with a fastball that is a consistent 88-90 mph and peaked at 93 last summer in the Great Lakes League. He may need to throw more strikes with the pitch as he progresses, but scouts say he is effectively wild and has a chance to be a solid big league starter. He complements his fastball with a slurvy slider that he is able to throw more consistently for strikes, and he gets good sinking action on his changeup. He went 2-1, 2.61 for the Cincinnati Steam last summer, with 13 walks and 28 strikeouts in 31 innings. He limited opponents to a .190 average. As a sophomore at Xavier, he went 4-3, 4.22 with only 47 strikeouts in 81 innings. Leesman, a 40th-round draft pick of the Minnesota Twins out of high school, had labrum surgery on his shoulder in September 2005 but never took a red-shirt and shows no lingering effects from the injury.—ALLAN SIMPSON

 

His velocity has reportedly been up a bit in our system as well. I remember hearing an interview with Cooper during a game in spring and someone (Hawk? Stone?) asked him to name which pitchers he had been most impressed by, and out of all the big arms we had in there, Charlie Leesman was the guy he named and raved about. That immediately put him on the map for me. His first full season with us has gone very well and I'm sure he's still making improvements on his command which is why he wasn't moved up. But as long as he's making progress with it that's all that is important, and Leesman has already bettered all of his peripherals at Xavier in our farm system. Also interesting when you look at his splits is that his GB% is 52.4% which is very nice out of a lefty and, having started 27 games, he has thrown 22 double plays. Also very nice out of a lefty.

 

Leesman is definitely not marginal. I'd say currently our three best LHP prospects are Leesman, Holmberg, and Rodriguez, and right now I'd rank Leesman highest.

[danman31]

Marginal may have been harsh, but I'm not buying into Leesman yet. His peripherals may be better, but they certainly aren't good yet.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

IMO, K/BB ratio is the worst peripheral to evaluate a prospect by so I just throw that one out whenever I see it. You don't always need a high K-rate to pitch in the Majors but you do usually need a low BB rate so it's better to look at things individually. K/BB can be extremely deceiving especially at the lower levels, because at the lower levels it is easy for players to pick up a high K/BB rate simply by having good control of fringe stuff (and this even works at all levels of the minors but won't work at all in the Majors), since K's are generally more a function of control + deception than stuff. Also K/BB makes guys with great stuff but who are wild in the zone look bad. The better stuff a guy has, and the more it moves, the harder it's going to be in most cases to control it and the higher that K/BB ratio will be. But when talking about MLB pitching prospects, movement is a very, very important thing, so you don't want to discount that. Plus K/BB rate seems to hurt guys who pitch to contact (like Leesman) and sides more with strikeout pitchers, and again, a lot of those MiLB "strikeout" pitchers aren't really strikeout pitchers, they're just control guys with varying levels of stuff.

 

In Leesman's case, the K/9 rate could be higher and with improved command it will become higher, but he's not a 8.0+ K/9 type pitcher anyway, even in the minors, and he probably never will be a 7.0+ K/9 guy in the Majors if he gets there, but he doesn't have to be either, because he pitches to contact and gets groundballs.

 

The BB/9 rate needs to come down, but it's good for a guy in Kanny and represents a nice improvement from his control in college. This is only Leesman's first full season.

 

The H/9 rate is high, but again that comes down to command and developing his change and slider, especially his slider vs. LH because he'll need that to become an effective MLB reliever. And as a lefty who can work in the low-90's with sink, he should definitely get a chance to make it happen as a reliever if nothing else. Also, I doubt his defense in Kanny did him a whole lot of favors when it comes to his H/9.

 

The WHIP being high is again all due to command.

 

HR/9 is excellent.

 

The groundball rate is very good, and in his case, aside from stuff and command, that's the most important thing for him IMO.

 

The only thing I see is a talented guy who is doing well and needs to continue developing his command and secondary stuff like pretty much everyone else we have. IMO, his peripherals shouldn't have to be amazing for him to be considered one of our top pitching prospects now that DCarter and Poreda are gone and Danny Hudson will probably never see the minors again. I wouldn't rank him as THE top guy, but as far as starting prospects go, he would be right there in the mix for me.

[danman31]

Strikeouts may not be a priority for him because he's a groundball pitcher, but I'm still concerned about his walks. We are talking about a 22 year-old that has a long way to go with his control to be a Major League starter. Granted, he has a few years, but I don't see him as a top tier pitching prospect, even in our system. The Sox don't have a lot of lefties so, yes, he is arguably the best lefty pitching prospect in the system.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Strikeouts may not be a priority for him because he's a groundball pitcher, but I'm still concerned about his walks. We are talking about a 22 year-old that has a long way to go with his control to be a Major League starter. Granted, he has a few years, but I don't see him as a top tier pitching prospect, even in our system. The Sox don't have a lot of lefties so, yes, he is arguably the best lefty pitching prospect in the system.

I agree that his walks (and hits) are a problem, and I agree that he has a ways to go. But, so does everyone else we have. As far as starters go, we have Shirek, Harrell, and Ely all pretty close, but Shirek and Harrell are the only guys I could see putting ahead of the Leesman/Griffith/Infante/Upchurch/Holmberg/Heidenreich/etc. group and those guys are all far away too, and of course there will be some who don't see either Shirek or Harrell as starters anyway. Is Leesman a top-tier SP prospect in general? No, but we don't have one of those anyway. I'd definitely have him in my top-5 as a SP prospect in our system since its so weak in that area.

[danman31]

How do you compare Leesman to another groundball guy in Sauer? Better K rate, much better BB rate, slightly better groundball rate. Granted, Sauer turned 23 in August, so you wonder how much better he can get. He's also not a lefty which makes a big difference, but Leesman is a guy you had in your top 15 rankings in the postseason list and Sauer outside the top 30.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

How do you compare Leesman to another groundball guy in Sauer? Better K rate, much better BB rate, slightly better groundball rate. Granted, Sauer turned 23 in August, so you wonder how much better he can get. He's also not a lefty which makes a big difference, but Leesman is a guy you had in your top 15 rankings in the postseason list and Sauer outside the top 30.

Age isn't a huge factor with me when it comes to pitchers. I'm pretty sure I saw Sauer pitch before we drafted him (or maybe right after?) and if I'm thinking of the right guy, he throws that sinker from a low 3/4 and I do like that a lot out of righty relief prospects because if they have control then they've got a decent chance of becoming righty specialists. I like Kyle Bellamy too, also Drew O'Neill (probably my favorite as he reportedly can touch 95 and is another heavy sinkerballer from the same arm angle) but I don't think I ranked them either. I'm guessing the majority of Sauer's K's are off deception and control (.260BAA, 8.3 K/9 vs. RH; .338, 5.8K/9 vs. LH) and his groundball rate is very good which shows he can do enough to be viewed as a good righty specialist prospect. But I don't see him as a starter. O'Neill is a little more of a power arm and of the 3 IMO O'Neill would be the likeliest to get a chance as a result. I wouldn't say I'm really down on Sauer or anything, but I just see Sauer as possibly another Wassermann in the sense that he may be able to thrive in a righty specialist role somewhere (I still do like Ehren BTW), but most organizations want guys who can do well versus lefties too, and those organizations that are bad enough to take on guys who have been in the minors for quite a while always seem to want reclamation project power arms. I've suggested before about Wassermann being a good fit for the A's or Rays because they like those kinds of guys, but it remains to be seen if Ehren gets another chance. And I just see Sauer in the same boat one day.

 

Leesman being the lefty is the main difference and it's a huge difference. Lefties don't need to be quite as good as righties to stick around and no matter what organization they're in they don't ever seem to have the mountains to climb that righties do. I also like what I've read about his changeup and as we all know, righties in general often have a lot of trouble with lefties with good changeups. Leesman IMO is the better bet to remain a starter for longer and the better bet to get a long look in a bullpen if he can't make it as a starter. Plus the fact that Coop likes him enough to single him out for compliments makes me think he's on Kenny's board somewhere. Leesman as far as I know can't touch 96 or anything like Clayton Richard can, but supposedly he's been consistently in the low-90's and for a lefty with sink and the potential for an above-average change that's good enough to shoot up our list of SP prospects. If I had to bet though I'd say Leesman ends up in a bullpen somewhere, but he should be considered a starter until they move him.

 

Right now our system is really, really lacking starter prospects and of the guys we got, IMO after Hudson there's no one that jumps right out as a definite, sure-fire #3+ starting prospect right now. I still like Upchurch the most but he got crushed this year and he needs to put together a better campaign than that. Infante has potential but has a very long way to go with his secondary stuff, and Holmberg and Heidenreich are still too young and raw although they have the potential to be pretty good ones. I like Shirek's chances as a reliever and I still really like Harrell's arm, but he's probably always going to struggle with his control and as a result I don't think it'll work out for him as a reliever at all. IMO he's either going to suddenly get it and become a #3 or he'll be a 5-6 inning pitcher/spot starter who struggles in the first couple of innings and runs up his pitch count before finding it later. Griffith might be our best one but I'd like to see how it goes for him next year and hear more about what his stuff is like now after coming back from surgery. They took away his slider so that should help extend his career, although the slider was his strikeout pitch. I'd like to know where his velocity is at next season and how his curve is coming along. But there's just not a lot there right now so that's why I put Leesman so high. You could probably make an argument for a lot of guys.

 

In general I don't rank relievers or guys I see as relievers high unless they are serious power arms and/or are very close to being ready. I've been ranking Nathan Jones as our best pitching prospect outside of Hudson because he has closers stuff and is throwing strikes, and as a result he could be up here very soon, even if he was in W-S this year. Behind him I have trouble deciding.

[Chisoxfn]

Hudson I mentioned.

I wanted to avoid 09 draft picks (no Serafin or Bellamy).

Infante's 2nd half took him off a mention.

Jones and Griffin I admit were close, but I didn't want to have the piece be too long.

Leesman had a mediocre 2:1 K:BB ratio as a 22 year-old in Low-A. He's marginal right now.

Carter got traded away so he's hardly a highlight.

I like Sauer and a few of the relievers you mentioned, but it's a wait and see approach.

 

The only guy I thought about mentioning and really should have is Remenowsky because his stats are eye popping. For the most part though, I didn't want to write about a dozen guys and lose everyone's interest half way in.

Leesman also pitches into the mid 90's and has a pretty fluid delivery. He's a better prospect than most in the Sox system.

[SoxAce]

I'm a big fan of Leesman myself. In fact, I'm higher on him than most of the pitchers in the sox system now, not named Nathan Jones. (also not counting the H.S. kids just drafted)