Insider Rumor Mill

[rockren]

From ESPN Insider-

 

The Chicago Daily Herald's Scot Gregor writes that the Chicago White Sox will target better athletes and hitters with better on-base skills this winter, suggesting that Los Angeles Angels outfielder Bobby Abreu might be the perfect fit.

 

The Sox have given indications that right fielder Jermaine Dye will not be back, and Abreu certainly knows how to work counts and get on base. But he may be a better fit as the designated hitter replacement for Jim Thome, also a free agent, due to Abreu's decline in defensive value as he's aged the past four seasons.

 

The market for Abreu, who signed a one-year deal with the Angels last winter, may be strong, as he's not likely to require a mulit-year guaranteed contract in order to sign.

 

Also information on Jenks...

 

A sign of the end of Jenks?

 

The Chicago Sun-Times reports that the White Sox have a decision to make on closer Bobby Jenks. He's under club control for two more years as an arbitration eligible, but the club needs to fix their offense and trading Jenks could potentially add a useful piece and give some flexibility in payroll that would allow them to focus on the lineup.

 

With today's news that the club has picked up the option on left-hander Matt Thornton, Jenks' days in Chicago may be numbered, as Thornton is thought to be the natural successor.

 

Jenks' trade value may not be sky high based on his arbitration status, and yet a guy like Trevor Hoffman landed $8 million for one year with an option yesterday, which doesn't seem to say closers around the league are going to struggle this offseason. We asked our own Jayson Stark about the potential return on Jenks.

 

Jenks a tough sell

"Bobby Jenks is going to be as hard to trade as anybody on the White Sox roster. You have a half-dozen closers on the free-agent market. You have a guy who is already making $5.6 million and still arbitration-eligible. His velocity is down. His conditioning is suspect. His numbers have declined. He might be a better non-tender candidate than a trade candidate." - Jayson Stark

[ThunderBolt]

Abreu would be a nice add to the team. Very well-rounded player, i'd be happy to have him here.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Jenks a tough sell

"Bobby Jenks is going to be as hard to trade as anybody on the White Sox roster. You have a half-dozen closers on the free-agent market. You have a guy who is already making $5.6 million and still arbitration-eligible. His velocity is down. His conditioning is suspect. His numbers have declined. He might be a better non-tender candidate than a trade candidate." - Jayson Stark

I strongly disagree with this part. Jenks will be easy to move. The hard part is getting good talent back in the deal. The Sox will have to target MLB role players, probably ones already making pretty good chunks of money, or else they'll have to go after either prospects who aren't all that great or reclamation projects.

 

But make no mistake: Bobby Jenks at around $7M on a one-year commitment is A s*** TON better than Jose Valverde at $8-10 per year for several years or 2-3 years to constantly injured Mike Gonzalez.

Edited October 8, 2009 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[rockren]

I strongly disagree with this part. Jenks will be easy to move. The hard part is getting good talent back in the deal. The Sox will have to target MLB role players, probably ones already making pretty good chunks of money, or else they'll have to go after either prospects who aren't all that great or reclamation projects.

 

But make no mistake: Bobby Jenks at around $7M on a one-year commitment is A s*** TON better than Jose Valverde at $8-10 per year for several years or 2-3 years to constantly injured Mike Gonzalez.

 

In all honesty...I was hoping the Brewers would have interest in Jenks this off-season. But that obviously is moot with Hoffman re-signing.

[rangercal]

is espn insider ever right?

[chetkincaid]

is espn insider ever right?

 

I doubt it. I don't know anyone who would ever PAY for ESPN Insider. I'm slowly but surely starting to hate ESPN. Mike and Mike and "The Herd" are unbearable....

[joeynach]

I strongly disagree with this part. Jenks will be easy to move. The hard part is getting good talent back in the deal. The Sox will have to target MLB role players, probably ones already making pretty good chunks of money, or else they'll have to go after either prospects who aren't all that great or reclamation projects.

 

But make no mistake: Bobby Jenks at around $7M on a one-year commitment is A s*** TON better than Jose Valverde at $8-10 per year for several years or 2-3 years to constantly injured Mike Gonzalez.

 

If you could trade Jenks to get some nice young players in here I would ok with that only if we make another addition to the pen. The only scenarios I could see would be acquiring Wuertz to set up and moving Thornton to close or signing Rafael Soriano to close and keeping thornton at set up.

[Jordan4life_2007]

If you could trade Jenks to get some nice young players in here I would ok with that only if we make another addition to the pen. The only scenarios I could see would be acquiring Wuertz to set up and moving Thornton to close or signing Rafael Soriano to close and keeping thornton at set up.

 

I wouldn't touch Wuertz with a 10 foot pole. And Soriano has filthy good stuff, but he's too injury prone.

[witesoxfan]

Knowing Williams and Guillen's disregard for outfield defense over their entire tenure (outside of Rowand and Anderson for a shortwhile), signing Abreu and a big left handed bat to DH (for instance, Jim Thome), would not surprise me in the least, and would help the offense. Preferably Beckham would leadoff, and the lineup you'd be left with would be potent as hell

 

Beckham - 3B

Abreu - RF

Quentin - LF

Thome - DH

Konerko - 1B

Pierzynski - C

Ramirez - SS

Rios - CF

Getz/Nix - 2B

 

 

[iamshack]

Where is the $10 million to sign Abreu going to come from?

 

My guess is we are already starting off 2010 about $5-8 million in the red...

[nickofypres]

Abreu would be a nice add to the team. Very well-rounded player, i'd be happy to have him here.

 

Agreed.

[lostfan]

I doubt it. I don't know anyone who would ever PAY for ESPN Insider. I'm slowly but surely starting to hate ESPN. Mike and Mike and "The Herd" are unbearable....

I don't understand how anyone couldn't have already started hating ESPN.

[hogan873]

Knowing Williams and Guillen's disregard for outfield defense over their entire tenure (outside of Rowand and Anderson for a shortwhile), signing Abreu and a big left handed bat to DH (for instance, Jim Thome), would not surprise me in the least, and would help the offense. Preferably Beckham would leadoff, and the lineup you'd be left with would be potent as hell

 

Beckham - 3B

Abreu - RF

Quentin - LF

Thome - DH

Konerko - 1B

Pierzynski - C

Ramirez - SS

Rios - CF

Getz/Nix - 2B

 

That certainly would be a potent lineup. I for one would like to see Thome return, and Abreu would be a great addition. Realistically, though, I only see one of those guys (or players similar) playing for the Sox in 2010.

[hogan873]

I don't understand how anyone couldn't have already started hating ESPN.

 

Yeah, until the Yankees are eliminated from the playoffs (or win the World Series), you're not going to see coverage of much else on that channel.

[NorthSideSox72]

I strongly disagree with this part. Jenks will be easy to move. The hard part is getting good talent back in the deal. The Sox will have to target MLB role players, probably ones already making pretty good chunks of money, or else they'll have to go after either prospects who aren't all that great or reclamation projects.

You don't strongly disagree, you actually agree with it 100%. When someone says that a player is "hard to move", they mean exactly what you said in the second bolded above. Any player is easy to move if you don't care what you get back. This is like your realtor telling you its going to be hard to sell your house, and you say "no its not, we'll just set the price at two dollars".

 

[LittleHurt05]

Where is the $10 million to sign Abreu going to come from?

 

My guess is we are already starting off 2010 about $5-8 million in the red...

 

after how much hes helped the Halos this year, hes not gonna come cheap, and I think chances the Sox can spend the $$$ to sign him are slim to none

[Kyyle23]

after how much hes helped the Halos this year, hes not gonna come cheap, and I think chances the Sox can spend the $$$ to sign him are slim to none

 

 

If you take "Halos" and replace it with "Yankees", then this is the same reasoning everyone used last year for why he would not come cheap

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

You don't strongly disagree, you actually agree with it 100%. When someone says that a player is "hard to move", they mean exactly what you said in the second bolded above. Any player is easy to move if you don't care what you get back. This is like your realtor telling you its going to be hard to sell your house, and you say "no its not, we'll just set the price at two dollars".

No, I meant exactly what I said. He'll be easy to move but it will be hard to get what people will probably expect out of him, i.e. a good return/good value, which means no top-5 prospects, no productive pre-arb MLB players, etc. Calling Jenks a non-tender candidate implies he has zero value. That will not be the case and if he's traded Jenks will still bring in pieces that will either deepen the farm or help the MLB club. There's a difference here between good value and no value.

 

And no, it isn't true that any player is easy to move if you don't care what you get back. Salary is just as much an issue as talent and many players are immovable because of their contracts. Jenks however has not hit that point because FA closers are still going to make more in FA than he'll cost in arb, and they will command more years which adds greater risk to the package whereas Jenks isn't on the hook for anything beyond 2010 after he's offered arbitration. There will still be demand for Jenks, but because of the number of available arms and the limited financial flexibility of several clubs, Kenny has a lot less negotiating power than he would have had last year.

 

Your real estate scenario is also a terrible comparison, in fact I couldn't even think of a worse one if I tried to. If you need to sell a home then you need to sell a home. You can't just waive off all responsibility and "release" yourself from the entire situation the way the Sox can release Jenks. If the Sox trade Jenks they will do it to recommit funds to other areas while improving the farm system and/or the big club at the same time, meaning worst case scenario they still add some value to the organization. In other words, there is no minimum amount of compensation that the Sox need to recoup in order to make the investment in Jenks during prior years worthwhile, and there is nothing 2010-related hinging on Jenks' return either. You're comparing a homeowner in a desperate situation who has everything to lose to a baseball club with nothing to worry about and only room for gain.

[NorthSideSox72]

No, I meant exactly what I said. He'll be easy to move but it will be hard to get what people will probably expect out of him, i.e. a good return/good value, which means no top-5 prospects, no productive pre-arb MLB players, etc. Calling Jenks a non-tender candidate implies he has zero value. That will not be the case and if he's traded Jenks will still bring in pieces that will either deepen the farm or help the MLB club. There's a difference here between good value and no value.

 

And no, it isn't true that any player is easy to move if you don't care what you get back. Salary is just as much an issue as talent and many players are immovable because of their contracts. Jenks however has not hit that point because FA closers are still going to make more in FA than he'll cost in arb, and they will command more years which adds greater risk to the package whereas Jenks isn't on the hook for anything beyond 2010 after he's offered arbitration. There will still be demand for Jenks, but because of the number of available arms and the limited financial flexibility of several clubs, Kenny has a lot less negotiating power than he would have had last year.

 

Your real estate scenario is also a terrible comparison, in fact I couldn't even think of a worse one if I tried to. If you need to sell a home then you need to sell a home. You can't just waive off all responsibility and "release" yourself from the entire situation the way the Sox can release Jenks. If the Sox trade Jenks they will do it to recommit funds to other areas while improving the farm system and/or the big club at the same time, meaning worst case scenario they still add some value to the organization. In other words, there is no minimum amount of compensation that the Sox need to recoup in order to make the investment in Jenks during prior years worthwhile, and there is nothing 2010-related hinging on Jenks' return either. You're comparing a homeowner in a desperate situation who has everything to lose to a baseball club with nothing to worry about and only room for gain.

 

OK then. You still actually agreed with the writer, yet said you disagreed, which seems odd to me. Just pointing out that the argument you made, that he's easy to move but you won't get back what you want, is exactly what the writer meant, so you are in agreement. I think you simply misunderstood what the writer was saying.

 

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

OK then. You still actually agreed with the writer, yet said you disagreed, which seems odd to me. Just pointing out that the argument you made, that he's easy to move but you won't get back what you want, is exactly what the writer meant, so you are in agreement. I think you simply misunderstood what the writer was saying.

What was posted initially has two different writers giving their perspectives. The first one is:

Jenks' trade value may not be sky high based on his arbitration status, and yet a guy like Trevor Hoffman landed $8 million for one year with an option yesterday, which doesn't seem to say closers around the league are going to struggle this offseason. We asked our own Jayson Stark about the potential return on Jenks.

He admits Jenks' value will be down, and earlier in the article he mentions that Jenks could be traded and still bring in useful pieces. I would agree with all that.

 

What I was responding to was not the first part, it was this second part where Jayson Stark gave his opinion:

"Bobby Jenks is going to be as hard to trade as anybody on the White Sox roster. You have a half-dozen closers on the free-agent market. You have a guy who is already making $5.6 million and still arbitration-eligible. His velocity is down. His conditioning is suspect. His numbers have declined. He might be a better non-tender candidate than a trade candidate." - Jayson Stark

He's suggesting Jenks might be non-tendered, meaning he has *zero* value. I disagree with this entirely. Jenks will bring us something decent if we deal him. He won't bring in a haul but he's not worthless either.

[ThunderBolt]

I wouldn't touch Wuertz with a 10 foot pole. And Soriano has filthy good stuff, but he's too injury prone.

Wuertz had the best pitch in all of baseball last year. His slider was almost literally unhittable.

[RockRaines]

I guess I dont understand why Thornton is perceived as the closer in waiting. I just dont see him translating well to the closers role, why mess with success of where he is today?

[GREEDY]

Abreu is a bad RF.

 

His bat is NOT good enough at a corner outfield position to outweight his horrible defense, that can only be getting worse.

 

I was chastised here for implying that I believed anyone wanted him for any other postion than DH: http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?sh...p;#entry2018331

 

Clearly people here want him to play RF.

 

As far as Abreu being our DH, great.... but I can't imagine we have 10 million+ (more likely 2 for 20), for a DH. When Thome/Giambi/Johnson etc can be had for a fraction of that money.

 

If Kenny brings in Bobby to play RF I will severely dissapointed; every chance he gets to speak to the media he stresses the importance of defense, and the way the game is changing.

 

To bring in yet another butcher would be a mistake.

 

[JorgeFabregas]

When Thome/Giambi/Johnson etc can be had for a fraction of that money.

One of these things is not like the other.

[bmags]

probably because in that thread, where you talked down to people, he wasn't mentioned as an RF once.

 

BUT YOU ARE SUPERIOR, I BOW IN YOUR DIRECTION