Something to consider on the potential trade front.

[southsider2k5]

This could be a big indicator at which teams dump salary in this off-season. Of course we know that San Diego and Cleveland have already done large dumps. Toronto lost Rios, but that might still not be enough.

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...,3417296.column

 

Empty seats: The final numbers are in, and MLB was down almost 6.7 percent in total attendance. The relative lack of playoff races was the final blow in a season in which the down economy made life challenging for marketing directors and advertising salesmen.

 

The biggest total decreases were in New York, where smaller stadium capacities contributed to drops of 22 percent for the Mets and 12.7 percent for the Yankees. On a percentage basis, nine teams were down at least 15 percent, including the Blue Jays (21.8), Nationals (21.7), Padres (20.8), Tigers (19.8), Indians (18.6), A's (15.4), Reds (15.1) and Diamondbacks (15.0).

[son of a rude]

Here's to hoping the Nats trade Adam Dunn so they can sign their next first rounder.

[kitekrazy]

This could be a big indicator at which teams dump salary in this off-season. Of course we know that San Diego and Cleveland have already done large dumps. Toronto lost Rios, but that might still not be enough.

 

I don't want the Sox to be one of them when it comes to good players. Spend the money Jerry.

 

[southsider2k5]

I don't want the Sox to be one of them when it comes to good players. Spend the money Jerry.

 

Looking at what 2010's payroll projection looks to be like, they are spending money.

[son of a rude]

Looking at what 2010's payroll projection looks to be like, they are spending money.

Yeah, I'm liking that number. Does anybody have any rough estimate on what it will be after we offer arb to danks, quentin, DJ, and pena? (hoping we dont offer it to bobby) I'm not good with the arb numbers.

[chunk23]

Yeah, I'm liking that number. Does anybody have any rough estimate on what it will be after we offer arb to danks, quentin, DJ, and pena? (hoping we dont offer it to bobby) I'm not good with the arb numbers.

 

Don't forget that the Sox loathe going to arbitration and will do anything they can to avoid going that route. Obviously there will be pay raises but I don't think it will be through arb.

[joeynach]

I don't want the Sox to be one of them when it comes to good players. Spend the money Jerry.

 

Yay another insightful quote completing ignoring the factor which drives every entity in this country, economics.

 

[southsider2k5]

Yeah, I'm liking that number. Does anybody have any rough estimate on what it will be after we offer arb to danks, quentin, DJ, and pena? (hoping we dont offer it to bobby) I'm not good with the arb numbers.

 

Read the payroll thread, pinned up above.

[joeynach]

Yeah, I'm liking that number. Does anybody have any rough estimate on what it will be after we offer arb to danks, quentin, DJ, and pena? (hoping we dont offer it to bobby) I'm not good with the arb numbers.

 

I have preliminary numbers that show the sox at $75 Mil right now. That number does not include arbitration raises to Danks, Jenks, Carrasco, Pena, Betemit (if not non-tendered), and Quentin. It also does not include anything for Pods who could be resigned soon. So basically if we all figure the sox payroll to be between $90 and $95 Mil it looks the sox are going to have very little if anything to spend this offseason. That is, unless they can move some expensive pieces like Konerko, Linebrink, or Jenks. But as of right now I dont see it possible to add any player this is going to make more than a few mil; no Figgins, no Nick Jonhson, no trade for Dunn.

[GreatScott82]

90-95 million is a pretty good estimate at where the payroll is after arbitration. That being said- I could see JR increasing payroll to about 110-120 million. JR is 70 years old and knows the team has a great chance in 2010 to go for it all if he allows KW to fill in the necessary holes. If the current economic state doesn't allow that, i expect some trades this winter. However, another 18 million is off the books after 2010 when PK and AJ head into free agency.

[Balta1701]

I doubt $110 will be reached. I could see us potentially topping $100 if KW can talk JR in to one decent signing, but otherwise, he's going to be scouring the trade market.

[Kalapse]

I have preliminary numbers that show the sox at $75 Mil right now. That number does not include arbitration raises to Danks, Jenks, Carrasco, Pena, Betemit (if not non-tendered), and Quentin. It also does not include anything for Pods who could be resigned soon.

So what does that $75M include? If it's just the 11 players under contract for next year then I'm curious as to how you arrived at that number.

 

Buehrle, Floyd, Garcia, Konerko, Linebrink, Peavy, Pierzynski, Ramirez, Rios, Thornton, Viciedo = $70.3M

 

Danks, Jenks, Carrasco, Pena, Quentin = ~$15M - $16M

 

16 players = ~$85M - $86M

 

Then there's the extra million to buyout Dye's contract.

[southsider2k5]

So what does that $75M include? If it's just the 11 players under contract for next year then I'm curious as to how you arrived at that number.

 

Buehrle, Floyd, Garcia, Konerko, Linebrink, Peavy, Pierzynski, Ramirez, Rios, Thornton, Viciedo = $70.3M

 

Danks, Jenks, Carrasco, Pena, Quentin = ~$15M - $16M

 

16 players = ~$85M - $86M

 

Then there's the extra million to buyout Dye's contract.

 

So even if we filled the roster with nine guys between 400,000 and 500,000 dollars, we are sitting at $90,000,000ish, with zero free agents signed.

[dmbjeff]

So even if we filled the roster with nine guys between 400,000 and 500,000 dollars, we are sitting at $90,000,000ish, with zero free agents signed.

 

I have us at about $88 million. Thats why Jenks must be traded if we want to retool the offense. If we have another $100 mil payroll, $12 million won't retool the offense with 2 hitters and get another bullpen arm. If Jenks is due about $7mil, if we trade that, we will have a payroll of $81 and you can add much more with $19 mil. I also think if we need bullpen help come mid season 2010, we can easily trade for that and JR won't mind adding another million or 2 for a setup guy as long as we are truly in the race.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

90-95 million is a pretty good estimate at where the payroll is after arbitration. That being said- I could see JR increasing payroll to about 110-120 million. JR is 70 years old and knows the team has a great chance in 2010 to go for it all if he allows KW to fill in the necessary holes. If the current economic state doesn't allow that, i expect some trades this winter. However, another 18 million is off the books after 2010 when PK and AJ head into free agency.

Reinsdorf doesn't exactly own the whole team by himself. He'd need approval for such a raise. Also, Reinsdorf was the one to okay the Peavy and Rios deals, but the only reason he was able to do that is because of such little salary we had on the books at that point for 2010 and beyond. Reinsdorf allowing Kenny to make those acquisitions doesn't mean that the Sox are going to be raising payroll considerably. It just means that the Sox will have to continue being frugal when it comes to putting together teams around those contracts over their durations.

 

I expect the Sox to be somewhere around $95-100M next year because they'll be going for it in 2010. But expect to see Kenny heavily shopping Jenks and Paulie in order to pay for improvements in other areas.

[Lemon_44]

Just because attendance was down doesn't necessarily mean revenue was down. New York, they said was the most accountable for the attendance drop but their tickets prices were also out of this world. I'd guess their revenue was up. The Sox raised prices last year as well so,while it may an indicator of a potential revenue drop down the road,i don't think that's the case right now. Who knows what the actual numbers are.

[Dick Allen]

The more I think about it, the more I think the Sox should at least see what the market is for Buerhle. He faded down the stretch, and if the Sox do make the playoffs, they way they have been talking brings up 2 questions: A. Would he be ready to pitch in the playoffs effectively? B. If the Sox had a decent playoff run, how would that affect him the following season? If you remember he horrid second half of 2006 was blamed on the playoff run. 4 years older, you would have to believe the effect would be at least the same. You then add that to the talk he will now be a #4 starter, his salary, and the little nugget that he threw out last year about retiring when his contract is up, so he may only pitch 2 more seasons anyway, it seems like a good time to at least listen to offers.

 

As far as payroll, its going to be lower than last year IMO. Last year they dropped it while increasing prices with a 95% renewal rate and 3 extra home dates. Chevy is supposedly exiting the sponsor race, so that will probably make some dent, although how much does Chevy throw at the White Sox anyway? Can it be more than $2 million a year? I heard and the source isn't all that reliable, that the $90-95 million mark estimated above is pretty accurate.

[iamshack]

The more I think about it, the more I think the Sox should at least see what the market is for Buerhle. He faded down the stretch, and if the Sox do make the playoffs, they way they have been talking brings up 2 questions: A. Would he be ready to pitch in the playoffs effectively? B. If the Sox had a decent playoff run, how would that affect him the following season? If you remember he horrid second half of 2006 was blamed on the playoff run. 4 years older, you would have to believe the effect would be at least the same. You then add that to the talk he will now be a #4 starter, his salary, and the little nugget that he threw out last year about retiring when his contract is up, so he may only pitch 2 more seasons anyway, it seems like a good time to at least listen to offers.

 

As far as payroll, its going to be lower than last year IMO. Last year they dropped it while increasing prices with a 95% renewal rate and 3 extra home dates. Chevy is supposedly exiting the sponsor race, so that will probably make some dent, although how much does Chevy throw at the White Sox anyway? Can it be more than $2 million a year? I heard and the source isn't all that reliable, that the $90-95 million mark estimated above is pretty accurate.

I agree with all of this. I think not only should Buerhle be shopped, but Konerko as well. I just don't see it happening.

[simba43]

I agree with all of this. I think not only should Buerhle be shopped, but Konerko as well. I just don't see it happening.

i agree especially about trading burhrle im sure we could get someone good from st louis for him

 

[simba43]

how about this possible trade we get juan pierre for linebrink and a prospect so after we woul;d be paying about 5 mil for pierre with the subraction of say 5 mil of linebrinks salary . the dodgers want to move pierre as his 10 mil a year is alot for a 4th outfielder . plus linebrink will help the dodgers pen next year an is a better pitcher in the NL i think pierre is a better and cheaper option then figgins and is a upgrade to pods and would be a good LF for us

[kitekrazy]

i agree especially about trading burhrle im sure we could get someone good from st louis for him

 

It's still a business. Just because he's a Cards fan doesn't mean the Cards GM is a M.B. fan. Then you have to ask what the Cards will give up then Kenny thinks is best for the team. The Card have a lot of decision to make now and it involves keeping players.

 

[kitekrazy]

how about this possible trade we get juan pierre for linebrink and a prospect so after we woul;d be paying about 5 mil for pierre with the subraction of say 5 mil of linebrinks salary . the dodgers want to move pierre as his 10 mil a year is alot for a 4th outfielder . plus linebrink will help the dodgers pen next year an is a better pitcher in the NL i think pierre is a better and cheaper option then figgins and is a upgrade to pods and would be a good LF for us

 

 

Pierre is a dumb ball player. Too many mental mistakes.

 

[simba43]

if we are really serious to win the world series not just winning the division then we have to get alittle bold to really compete with the angels and yankees and dodgers phils etc . so trading a starting pitcher say floyd or hudson along with flowers danks viecido or whatever the padres want in our farm system to get adrain gonzales i say do it we need a difference maker in our order not just a good bat we need a a major threat like a texiera and what pretty much all the top teams have . alot of you here want this great 5 man rotation but when playoff time comes your relying on 3 starters sometimes 4 so a good lineup and bullpen is whats needed . look at the red sox lester beckett maksuzaka or st louis carpenter wainwright pinerio were sweeped and to be honest i take those guys over our top 3 of peavy danks floyd or buehrle . so having 5 very good starters is great but in the playoffs just might not be enough so trade a starter kenny package a deal a get gonzales then make other deals to fill out our pen and lineup . if were going to make a trade people lets go for it big not for guys like hawpe ross adkins hermidia or whoever there nice pieces but not the threat we need in our lineup .

[kitekrazy]

if we are really serious to win the world series not just winning the division then we have to get alittle bold to really compete with the angels and yankees and dodgers phils etc . so trading a starting pitcher say floyd or hudson along with flowers danks viecido or whatever the padres want in our farm system to get adrain gonzales i say do it we need a difference maker in our order not just a good bat we need a a major threat like a texiera and what pretty much all the top teams have . alot of you here want this great 5 man rotation but when playoff time comes your relying on 3 starters sometimes 4 so a good lineup and bullpen is whats needed . look at the red sox lester beckett maksuzaka or st louis carpenter wainwright pinerio were sweeped and to be honest i take those guys over our top 3 of peavy danks floyd or buehrle . so having 5 very good starters is great but in the playoffs just might not be enough so trade a starter kenny package a deal a get gonzales then make other deals to fill out our pen and lineup . if were going to make a trade people lets go for it big not for guys like hawpe ross adkins hermidia or whoever there nice pieces but not the threat we need in our lineup .

 

I say increase the payroll. Rule #1-you can never have enough pitching.

 

There was this team in 2005 that won the World Series with four starters having complete games. They also had a lights out pen. So their goes your theory.

 

Keep in mind the new Sox ace has been on the DL. With health issues I wouldn't trade one and hope the 5th starter spot will be around .500.

 

BTW, capitalize the beginning of your sentences and space them so people don't blow off your posts.

Edited October 14, 2009 by kitekrazy

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

The Sox should trade Buerhle and AJ right away. That way we can weaken our team AND piss off just about every Sox fan sans a few here at SoxTalk all at the same time. What a great idea.