Adrian Gonzalez

[southsider2k5]

There isn't a doubt in my mind that Kenny Williams is sniffing around as many young bats as he can right now to try to remake this offensive core. We are losing tons of offense this year and next, and he knows that better than anyone else. At the end of the day, I really get the feeling he will pull someone into Chicago.

[Chisoxfn]

It would only make sense for the Sox to look at Gonzalez. If they acquired him I'd expect other changes to follow (ie, Paulie and some other guys) but he's the type of bad you find a way to get. High impact player.

 

If we could make the deal without giving up any of our every-day parts it would be a tremendous move. I'd even consider a deal built around Alexei Ramirez in the case of Adrian Gonzalez.

 

A Hudson/Ramirez package would work for me. Or a Hudson, Viciedo, Danks package if that is what interests the Pads. I don't know if that is ultimately enough, but we are talking about a legitimate potential MVP bat.

[southsider2k5]

It would only make sense for the Sox to look at Gonzalez. If they acquired him I'd expect other changes to follow (ie, Paulie and some other guys) but he's the type of bad you find a way to get. High impact player.

 

If we could make the deal without giving up any of our every-day parts it would be a tremendous move. I'd even consider a deal built around Alexei Ramirez in the case of Adrian Gonzalez.

 

A Hudson/Ramirez package would work for me. Or a Hudson, Viciedo, Danks package if that is what interests the Pads. I don't know if that is ultimately enough, but we are talking about a legitimate potential MVP bat.

 

Realistically, if they get Gonzalez, Konerko could move to DH for his last year, and you are pretty well set, except for needing one more OF who can lead off. The pen needs some work to, at least to replace Dotel.

[Chisoxfn]

Realistically, if they get Gonzalez, Konerko could move to DH for his last year, and you are pretty well set, except for needing one more OF who can lead off. The pen needs some work to, at least to replace Dotel.

The nice part is Konerko's contract comes off the books at a time where you'll be needing to throw some coin Adrian's way (if you want to keep him), plus Buehrle's would be coming off the books as well. So the Sox would be okay financially, imo. Especially if they could get some cost-certainty in Danks (since they have it in Floyd) and maybe Quentin.

 

I do think they would try to move Konerko though if they got Gonzalez for financial reasons. But with Konerko in the 6th spot of a lineup that isn't a bad thing. I'd rather move Konerko to a team, even if it was for payroll relief and go with a guy like Vladdy as my DH though, cause it might give the Sox just the leftover money they need to work a Danks extension into the budget as well as have the flexibility to pick up a reliever.

[Kalapse]

The nice part is Konerko's contract comes off the books at a time where you'll be needing to throw some coin Adrian's way (if you want to keep him), plus Buehrle's would be coming off the books as well. So the Sox would be okay financially, imo. Especially if they could get some cost-certainty in Danks (since they have it in Floyd) and maybe Quentin.

 

I do think they would try to move Konerko though if they got Gonzalez for financial reasons. But with Konerko in the 6th spot of a lineup that isn't a bad thing. I'd rather move Konerko to a team, even if it was for payroll relief and go with a guy like Vladdy as my DH though, cause it might give the Sox just the leftover money they need to work a Danks extension into the budget as well as have the flexibility to pick up a reliever.

It's not all that realistic but Trading for Gonzalez then turning around and dumping Konerko for little (saving $12M) then signing a Vlad to be the full time DH would be a coup. You'd be paying those two combined less than just Konerko. Now THAT would be a dangerous lineup and allow for some financial flexibility, I just don't think moving Konerko's contract is all that realistic at this point in time.

 

If you get Gonzalez you almost have to move Konerko, he's worth about half of his $12M salary as a designated hitter, it's not very hard to find production similar to Konerko's in the DH spot.

[southsider2k5]

It's not all that realistic but Trading for Gonzalez then turning around and dumping Konerko for little (saving $12M) then signing a Vlad to be the full time DH would be a coup. You'd be paying those two combined less than just Konerko. Now THAT would be a dangerous lineup and allow for some financial flexibility, I just don't think moving Konerko's contract is all that realistic at this point in time.

 

If you get Gonzalez you almost have to move Konerko, he's worth about half of his $12M salary as a designated hitter, it's not very hard to find production similar to Konerko's in the DH spot.

 

I'm with you. I don't see a team really wanting Konerko at 12 million dollars a year, unless we pick up someone else's crappy contract.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I've mentioned this before a couple of times, but if we could get Gonzalez then a Konerko-for-Affeldt swap could make a ton of sense for us. We would shed $8M in such a deal, with Gonzalez taking $4.75, leaving us with $3.25M extra. That extra savings could pay for Jenks in arb, making Affeldt the first lefty out of the pen and keeping Thornton in a setup role, OR we could make Thornton the closer, Affeldt the lefty setup man, bring in a third lefty at the minimum, and then deal Jenks' $7-8M in arb for prospects, which would give us roughly another $10-11M to play with.

[Balta1701]

I'm with you. I don't see a team really wanting Konerko at 12 million dollars a year, unless we pick up someone else's crappy contract.

Once i looked at the FA 1b, I was able to convince myself otherwise. There is literally 1 starting FA 1b on the market, Laroche. 2 if you think Nick Johnson can stay healthy or you're happy with Abrey Huff, but otherwise, that's it. The rest of them belong at DH. Delgado, Johnson, Thome, and a bunch of people with OPS's that a decent pitcher can beat.

 

There are teams that just flat out need a bat at 1b, and if they don't land Laroche, it's a hole. The Mets. The Braves.

[iamshack]

I'm with you. I don't see a team really wanting Konerko at 12 million dollars a year, unless we pick up someone else's crappy contract.

Was thinking about possibly a deal to San Francisco. They are looking for some bats and Sabean has said they would consider moving Sandoval to third.

 

I was trying to find a bad salary we could take back, but there doesn't appear to be a fit. Their contracts are all pretty fair with the exception of Zito's (really bad) and Rowand's (pretty bad). We don't want any part of those.

[Kalapse]

Once i looked at the FA 1b, I was able to convince myself otherwise. There is literally 1 starting FA 1b on the market, Laroche. 2 if you think Nick Johnson can stay healthy or you're happy with Abrey Huff, but otherwise, that's it. The rest of them belong at DH. Delgado, Johnson, Thome, and a bunch of people with OPS's that a decent pitcher can beat.

 

There are teams that just flat out need a bat at 1b, and if they don't land Laroche, it's a hole. The Mets. The Braves.

Russell Branyan's going to be in demand, he can more than handle his own at 1B. Delgado's also not done at 1B, there's a damn good chance the Mets bring him back.

[iamshack]

I've mentioned this before a couple of times, but if we could get Gonzalez then a Konerko-for-Affeldt swap could make a ton of sense for us. We would shed $8M in such a deal, with Gonzalez taking $4.75, leaving us with $3.25M extra. That extra savings could pay for Jenks in arb, making Affeldt the first lefty out of the pen and keeping Thornton in a setup role, OR we could make Thornton the closer, Affeldt the lefty setup man, bring in a third lefty at the minimum, and then deal Jenks' $7-8M in arb for prospects, which would give us roughly another $10-11M to play with.

I saw Affeldt too, and was going to suggest that. Until I looked at Affeldt's numbers. He led the mlb in holds last year and posted a 1.73 ERA. While $4 million is a bit high for a reliever, he's been damn good. Why would they want to give us Affeldt when they could probably sign someone off the FA market for $7-8 million and keep him?

[Kalapse]

Was thinking about possibly a deal to San Francisco. They are looking for some bats and Sabean has said they would consider moving Sandoval to third.

 

I was trying to find a bad salary we could take back, but there doesn't appear to be a fit. Their contracts are all pretty fair with the exception of Zito's (really bad) and Rowand's (pretty bad). We don't want any part of those.

Renteria's contract is one of worst in baseball. He's guaranteed $9.5M with 1 year left on his contract.

[iamshack]

Renteria's contract is one of worst in baseball. He's guaranteed $9.5M with 1 year left on his contract.

Yeah, forgot to mention that. He obviously doesn't help us in any way. Pass.

[Kalapse]

I saw Affeldt too, and was going to suggest that. Until I looked at Affeldt's numbers. He led the mlb in holds last year and posted a 1.73 ERA. While $4 million is a bit high for a reliever, he's been damn good. Why would they want to give us Affeldt when they could probably sign someone off the FA market for $7-8 million and keep him?

Balta does make a good point; aside from LaRoche and possibly Branyan there are no other good options as full time 1B on the free agent market unless you want to take a chance with Aubrey Huff or Chad Tracy or a litany of old/perpetually injured options.

[iamshack]

Balta does make a good point; aside from LaRoche and possibly Branyan there are no other good options as full time 1B on the free agent market unless you want to take a chance with Aubrey Huff or Chad Tracy.

Well, they can look at 3b too, and play Sandoval at 1st if need be. Hell, my guess is they would try Dye at 1st before they would take PK.

 

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I saw Affeldt too, and was going to suggest that. Until I looked at Affeldt's numbers. He led the mlb in holds last year and posted a 1.73 ERA. While $4 million is a bit high for a reliever, he's been damn good. Why would they want to give us Affeldt when they could probably sign someone off the FA market for $7-8 million and keep him?

The framework would just be Konerko for Affeldt, and you could work from there. For the sake of argument, let's say we send Williams over there. Is the difference between Affeldt + Ishikawa and Williams + Konerko worth an added $8M to the payroll to them? It might be, because they have major problems with their offense. If not, we could throw in a decent 'spect or two, doesn't really matter. What would be important to us more than anything would be clearing that $8M while filling one of our holes.

[iamshack]

The framework would just be Konerko for Affeldt, and you could work from there. For the sake of argument, let's say we send Williams over there. Is the difference between Affeldt + Ishikawa and Williams + Konerko worth an added $8M to the payroll to them? It might be, because they have major problems with their offense. If not, we could throw in a decent 'spect or two, doesn't really matter. What would be important to us more than anything would be clearing that $8M while filling one of our holes.

No, I see how it works for us. I almost made the same suggestion at the very same time as you. Then I changed my mind because I figured Kal would rip me a new one for suggesting it.

 

I just don't really see SF wanting to give up their best bullpen arm to add PK, unless the pickings get REAL thin and none of these hitters want to sign there because it's where hitters go to die.

[Kalapse]

No, I see how it works for us. I almost made the same suggestion at the very same time as you. Then I changed my mind because I figured Kal would rip me a new one for suggesting it.

 

I just don't really see SF wanting to give up their best bullpen arm to add PK, unless the pickings get REAL thin and none of these hitters want to sign there because it's where hitters go to die.

Hey now, I'm not that bad. Sure I agree that it's probably not all that realistic but it's at least creative and I appreciate creativity. It's better than the "s***ty prospects for great players" trade proposals you regularly see on the interent. If Jeremy Affeldt were coming off a bad season I could see it happening.

[Chisoxfn]

It's not all that realistic but Trading for Gonzalez then turning around and dumping Konerko for little (saving $12M) then signing a Vlad to be the full time DH would be a coup. You'd be paying those two combined less than just Konerko. Now THAT would be a dangerous lineup and allow for some financial flexibility, I just don't think moving Konerko's contract is all that realistic at this point in time.

 

If you get Gonzalez you almost have to move Konerko, he's worth about half of his $12M salary as a designated hitter, it's not very hard to find production similar to Konerko's in the DH spot.

I know it is not 100% likely that we'd be able to move Paulie, but I still think teams value his overall package enough to be willing to make a move for Konerko. I could be 1000% wrong though, but even if the Sox had to throw in some cash, it would make a whole hell of a lot of sense.

 

Getting Gonzalez would give the Sox so many options. I realize we'd lack a true-leadoff hitter, but could you imagine a middle part of the order with Beckham/Gonzalez/Quentin/Vladdy. I'd actually consider having Quentin in the #2 spot for his OBP ability with Beckham leading off followed by Gonzalez/Vladdy/AJ/Teahen/etc

 

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

No, I see how it works for us. I almost made the same suggestion at the very same time as you. Then I changed my mind because I figured Kal would rip me a new one for suggesting it.

 

I just don't really see SF wanting to give up their best bullpen arm to add PK, unless the pickings get REAL thin and none of these hitters want to sign there because it's where hitters go to die.

Affeldt's career numbers. He had an astounding season last year that will in all probability not be replicated. It would not be all that surprising if in his second full season, Randy Williams had a year that is in line with Affeldt's career line of 4.27 ERA, 1.45 WHIP, 9.0 H/9, 4.0 BB/9, 6.9 K/9. So the difference here might not be as stark as it currently looks when just comparing their 2009 seasons. Affeldt IMO is still a bad contract.

[Chisoxfn]

Once i looked at the FA 1b, I was able to convince myself otherwise. There is literally 1 starting FA 1b on the market, Laroche. 2 if you think Nick Johnson can stay healthy or you're happy with Abrey Huff, but otherwise, that's it. The rest of them belong at DH. Delgado, Johnson, Thome, and a bunch of people with OPS's that a decent pitcher can beat.

 

There are teams that just flat out need a bat at 1b, and if they don't land Laroche, it's a hole. The Mets. The Braves.

Exactly. The Sox could have to put another piece in the deal (player or cash) to make it more attractive and ultimately allow them to get something back. But I could even see a Jenks/Konerko package working for a team that has a need at both positions.

[Kalapse]

Affeldt's career numbers. He had an astounding season last year that will in all probability not be replicated. It would not be all that surprising if in his second full season, Randy Williams had a year that is in line with Affeldt's career line of 4.27 ERA, 1.45 WHIP, 9.0 H/9, 4.0 BB/9, 6.9 K/9. So the difference here might not be as stark as it currently looks when just comparing their 2009 seasons. Affeldt IMO is still a bad contract.

His ERA as a starter is about 5.40 with a 1.67 WHIP in 216 IP.

 

His career numbers as a reliever: 3.66 ERA, 1.35 WHIP, 7.8 K/9, 1.94 SO/BB, .244 BAA, .694 OPSA, very good. He also posted a 3.41 ERA, 1.33 WHIP and 8.3 K/9 the 2 years prior to landing in San Francisco. He's a real good bet out of the pen.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

His ERA as a starter is about 5.40 with a 1.67 WHIP in 216 IP.

 

His career numbers as a reliever: 3.66 ERA, 1.35 WHIP, 7.8 K/9, 1.94 SO/BB, .244 BAA, .694 OPSA, very good. He also posted a 3.41 ERA, 1.33 WHIP and 8.3 K/9 the 2 years prior to landing in San Francisco. He's a real good bet out of the pen.

So he's better as a reliever then, but those numbers last year are still an aberration until he proves they're not by actually repeating them. If you predict Affeldt to put up those same 2009 numbers in 2010, then he's more than worth his contract even in this economy. If he keeps with his career relief line then it's still an overpayment for a reliever IMO, although not a major one.

[Chisoxfn]

I can't get the idea of the possibilities a duo of Quentin/Gonzalez could be.

[Steve9347]

I can't get the idea of the possibilities a duo of Quentin/Gonzalez could be.

It'd be good.