Adrian Gonzalez

[Balta1701]

I'm not so sure Danks or Floyd would 'need' to be involved. Danks and Floyd will be getting more and more money each year that passes. I'm pretty sure SD is looking 2-3 years down the road. If thats the case, a deal centered around Hudson and Flowers is a real possibility. How many more years does Bucholz have before he reaches arbitration?

I'm not the expert on the service time issue, he has 1.18 years of service time so far. I think that means he's pre-arb for 2 years.

[sircaffey]

I don't necessarily agree.

If you're Jed Hoyer, you're going to want to fill multiple holes by trading Gonzalez. If we are offering prospects that are closer to filling some gaps in the Padres' lineup card, he may like a deal involving Hudson as the centerpiece more than Bucholz, even though that package includes the better centerpiece.

 

SD's holes are SP, SP, SP, SP, SP, SP, and then offense. They are in desperate need of young impact SP. Regardless of whether Buchholz is involved or not, SD is going to get 3-4 good prospects for Gonzalez. They'll fill holes. Outside of Hudson, we really can't offer much in terms of pitching. If Boston comes in with an offer involving Buchholz and Bowden, I don't see us having much chance.

[GreatScott82]

I'm not the expert on the service time issue, he has 1.18 years of service time so far. I think that means he's pre-arb for 2 years.

Thanks. . should be interesting to see how SD handles this unique situation.

[iamshack]

SD's holes are SP, SP, SP, SP, SP, SP, and then offense. They are in desperate need of young impact SP. Regardless of whether Buchholz is involved or not, SD is going to get 3-4 good prospects for Gonzalez. They'll fill holes. Outside of Hudson, we really can't offer much in terms of pitching. If Boston comes in with an offer involving Buchholz and Bowden, I don't see us having much chance.

They have needs all over the place. I don't know about you, but I'd rather have Hudson and some other pieces that can fill out my lineup card than a slightly upgraded young pitcher. The key for them should be to score as many mlb-ready or near mlb-ready prospects with high ceilings as possible.

 

They're not trading Gonzalez for the salary relief here. They're using him as way of rebuilding their core very quickly.

[GreatScott82]

They have needs all over the place. I don't know about you, but I'd rather have Hudson and some other pieces that can fill out my lineup card than a slightly upgraded young pitcher. The key for them should be to score as many mlb-ready or near mlb-ready prospects with high ceilings as possible.

 

They're not trading Gonzalez for the salary relief here. They're using him as way of rebuilding their core very quickly.

^^^ exactly. If you could bring in a young stud catcher, a potential top of the rotation starting pitcher and perhaps an upper quality OF- your are quickly improving your team in all areas of the game.

[Marky Mark]

Does Boston even have a need for Gonzalez?

[Quin]

So lets say it becomes a Sox Duel, the White variety could offer:

 

Hudson

Torres

Flowers

Viciedo

Retherford

PTBNL (Mitchell)

 

The Pads fill their holes at 2nd, Catcher, 2 pitching spots, a first basemen (fill AGon void), and CF. The reason Mitchell is PTBNL is because I really, really, don't want to give up D2.

 

Red could offer:

 

Bucholz

Bard

and I have no idea who else is in there system

[Balta1701]

IIRC you can't PTBNL Mitchell until Mid-December at the earliest.

[Quin]

IIRC you can't PTBNL Mitchell until Mid-December at the earliest.

 

Dang it.

 

For some reason, I feel he's more enticing then D2, and that they'd love him.

 

Darn this no trading picks till one year later thing.

[Marky Mark]

So lets say it becomes a Sox Duel, the White variety could offer:

 

Hudson

Torres

Flowers

Viciedo

Retherford

PTBNL (Mitchell)

 

The Pads fill their holes at 2nd, Catcher, 2 pitching spots, a first basemen (fill AGon void), and CF. The reason Mitchell is PTBNL is because I really, really, don't want to give up D2.

 

Red could offer:

 

Bucholz

Bard

and I have no idea who else is in there system

 

 

 

If the Sox were at the point where they were allowed to be offering Mitchell and they also gave up the other five guys you named, there will be no other deal out there that would come close to that. However that's too much for Kenny in my opinion.

[SoxAce]

Does Boston even have a need for Gonzalez?

 

It's an interesting question actually. I'm assuming they would move Youk to 3B, and make other moves to help that. And of course Big Pappi ain't gettin any younger, so I'm sure they can "squeeze" Adrian in there somewhere. I do agree with one poster as if it was a farm's game, Boston would crush us. Buchholz, Bowden, Lars Anderson, Bard, Josh Reddick, Kalish, Raymond Fuentes, even a Jed Lowrie, etc.. (though a couple more overrated than others) they are much deeper than we are now. Though of course what shack said.. it depends how much of that talent they want to give up. We might be willing to include a Danks2, Viciedo or possibly even Tyler Flowers whereas they wouldn't.

[Quin]

If the Sox were at the point where they were allowed to be offering Mitchell and they also gave up the other five guys you named, there will be no other deal out there that would come close to that. However that's too much for Kenny in my opinion.

 

If we could, I'd ask for Poreda back (See: Gonzalez, Gio) to help with the lefty situation in the pen.

 

Plus, then we'd have:

 

Poreda

Hynick

D2

Phegley

 

While the farm would take a huge blow, those four could help it recover.

[Chicago White Sox]

If we could, I'd ask for Poreda back (See: Gonzalez, Gio) to help with the lefty situation in the pen.

 

Plus, then we'd have:

 

Poreda

Hynick

D2

Phegley

 

While the farm would take a huge blow, those four could help it recover.

Hynick??? Counting on him for anything but garbage innnings in the majors would be crazy at this point.

[Quin]

Hynick??? Counting on him for anything but garbage innnings in the majors would be crazy at this point.

 

Wouldn't expect him to carry a major load in the majors, but instead be a spot-starter and last BP resort.

[iamshack]

Wouldn't expect him to carry a major load in the majors, but instead be a spot-starter and last BP resort.

Yeah, Hynick actually looks like he maybe able to offer us something. He had some really solid numbers in Colorado Springs last year, if I recall correctly.

[sircaffey]

They have needs all over the place. I don't know about you, but I'd rather have Hudson and some other pieces that can fill out my lineup card than a slightly upgraded young pitcher. The key for them should be to score as many mlb-ready or near mlb-ready prospects with high ceilings as possible.

 

They're not trading Gonzalez for the salary relief here. They're using him as way of rebuilding their core very quickly.

 

It's not like they aren't going to be getting multiple players from the Red Sox w/ Buchholz. Either offer is going to fill multiple holes. The Padres actually have some good offensive prospects. Outside of Latos though, their pitching is absolutely pathetic. You can't trade your franchise player for offense when your pitching is just that horrendous. With quality young pitching being the #1 hardest thing to acquire, the Padres better take advantage of this situation because after Adrian is gone, the only way they'll be able to acquire young pitching is through the draft. And with the current system's pitching talent, they'll be rebuilding for the next decade.

 

I'm not saying they wouldn't like to get a good position player or two, but I can't see them accepting a deal that isn't pitching heavy. It would be a very unwise decision, imo.

[iamshack]

It's not like they aren't going to be getting multiple players from the Red Sox w/ Buchholz. Either offer is going to fill multiple holes. The Padres actually have some good offensive prospects. Outside of Latos though, their pitching is absolutely pathetic. You can't trade your franchise player for offense when your pitching is just that horrendous. With quality young pitching being the #1 hardest thing to acquire, the Padres better take advantage of this situation because after Adrian is gone, the only way they'll be able to acquire young pitching is through the draft. And with the current system's pitching talent, they'll be rebuilding for the next decade.

 

I'm not saying they wouldn't like to get a good position player or two, but I can't see them accepting a deal that isn't pitching heavy. It would be a very unwise decision, imo.

Yeah, fair enough. It just depends on how they view some of the position players we might offer versus those the Red Sox might offer. My guess is we have a few that we are willing to offer that can help them a bit more than those that they are willing to offer. I could obviously be wrong.

[sircaffey]

Yeah, fair enough. It just depends on how they view some of the position players we might offer versus those the Red Sox might offer. My guess is we have a few that we are willing to offer that can help them a bit more than those that they are willing to offer. I could obviously be wrong.

 

If we can somehow obtain a 2nd quality SP prospect to combine with Hudson and Flowers, I think there is no doubt that we have the upper hand. SD has no future C in their system which makes Flowers the most attractive position player that either the Red Sox or us have. I just think we need that 2nd SP prospect which quite possibly could come from a Jenks trade.

[SoxAce]

If we can somehow obtain a 2nd quality SP prospect to combine with Hudson and Flowers, I think there is no doubt that we have the upper hand. SD has no future C in their system which makes Flowers the most attractive position player that either the Red Sox or us have. I just think we need that 2nd SP prospect which quite possibly could come from a Jenks trade.

 

Meh.. they have Luis Exposito down there who looks very promising for them not to mention Kotteras, though he might be a throw in at this point though a pretty damn good throw in.. though you can say he was in the overrated category. That's why I said earlier the Sawks could probably crush us in a deal if it came down to a farm's race, but of course.. it also depends who they'd want to give up. Buchholz and Bowden is already a very attractive offer. Just for comparison's sake, you could say Hudson=Bowden in terms of upside/potential with giving Huddy a bit of an edge perhaps. We don't have a Clay Buchholz in our system. Now.. would the red sox want to actually give up that much for Adrian and if that's a need for them? That remains to be seen, but I'm sure they are definitely considering it, not to mention SD and Boston front office have alot of connections.

Edited November 12, 2009 by SoxAce

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

If we can somehow obtain a 2nd quality SP prospect to combine with Hudson and Flowers, I think there is no doubt that we have the upper hand. SD has no future C in their system which makes Flowers the most attractive position player that either the Red Sox or us have. I just think we need that 2nd SP prospect which quite possibly could come from a Jenks trade.

The Sox can offer any 4 or 5 of Hudson, Flowers, Jordan Danks ,Viciedo. Torres, Retherford, Morel ,Kyle Bellamy C. Santeliz (who's having a pretty good season in the Venezuelan Winter League) or any other Sox prospect they find projectable. I love following the Sox minor leaguers but they're just that, minor leaguers and Gonzalez adds so much to the offense and defense he just can't be passed up. But I might only do it if we can extend his contract at least another year.

Edited November 12, 2009 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[simba43]

Well maybe you are a true genius and none of us here know it...

yeah whatever

 

[simba43]

Well maybe you are a true genius and none of us here know it...

Hey question for you ? Why is it your telling others to tone it down and to watch there language but its ok for you to be a smart as- to me ? I read your profile its says your 12yrs old well if that is true until you accomplished half of what i have done in life . YOU my friend should tone it down . Edited November 12, 2009 by 1977 sox fan

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

It's an interesting question actually. I'm assuming they would move Youk to 3B, and make other moves to help that. And of course Big Pappi ain't gettin any younger, so I'm sure they can "squeeze" Adrian in there somewhere. I do agree with one poster as if it was a farm's game, Boston would crush us. Buchholz, Bowden, Lars Anderson, Bard, Josh Reddick, Kalish, Raymond Fuentes, even a Jed Lowrie, etc.. (though a couple more overrated than others) they are much deeper than we are now. Though of course what shack said.. it depends how much of that talent they want to give up. We might be willing to include a Danks2, Viciedo or possibly even Tyler Flowers whereas they wouldn't.

In terms of overall depth Boston has us beat IMO, but in terms of impact prospects who are ready now I think we may have the edge, and if Boston doesn't want to include Buchholz, then we beat the s*** out of Boston there.

 

Casey Kelly and Tazawa are in there too for them. But again, the Padres should be looking primarily at who is ready now.

 

It also needs to be said that SP is an area of need for Boston more than Gonzalez would be, especially if Bay comes back, and I think they want King Felix a bit more. They may have reservations about dealing a ton of pitching for Adrian when they could deal pitching for a true ace.

 

The Sox can offer something like this:

Dan Hudson - slots in as their #2 behind Latos, right now

Tyler Flowers - starting catcher, right now

Dayan Viciedo - starting 3B, maybe even right now because they'll trade Kouzmanoff, but probably by midseason

Jordan Danks - midseason 2010 starting CF, possibly earlier

Nathan Jones - possible future closer candidate, would likely be up sometime in 2010

 

Then give them 2-3 of the following:

Clevelan Santeliz - could compete for a 2010 spot

Lucas Harrell - could compete for a 2010 spot

Jon Link - could compete for a 2010 spot

Johnny Nunez - could compete for a 2010 spot

CJ Retherford - could start at 2B if they ditched Eckstein

Charlie Shirek - could compete for a 2010 spot

John Shelby - could compete for a 2010 spot

Stefan Gartrell - could compete for a 2010 spot

Christian Marrero - could compete for a 2010 spot

Brent Lillibridge - could compete for a 2010 spot

Carlos Torres - could compete for a 2010 spot

Brent Morel

Jon Gilmore

Santos Rodriguez

Miguel Gonzalez

Charlie Leesman

Steven Upchurch

Nevin Griffith

Gregory Infante

etc.

 

At this point I would want Heath Bell in the deal too, which would make a great deal of sense for us anyway, even if we don't trade Jenks. But the point is, the Sox can offer quite a bit, and certainly nothing that other teams would sneeze at. And I still believe that draining the farm for a bat like Gonzalez is acceptable, because you're draining it in exchange for a shot at a World Series title for two consecutive years.

 

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Hey question for you ? Why is it your telling others to tone it down and to watch there language but its ok for you to be a smart as- to me ? I read your profile its says your 12yrs old well if that is true until you accomplished half of what i have done in life . YOU my friend should tone it down .

LOL, he's not really 12.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Meh.. they have Luis Exposito down there who looks very promising for them not to mention Kotteras, though he might be a throw in at this point though a pretty damn good throw in.. though you can say he was in the overrated category. That's why I said earlier the Sawks could probably crush us in a deal if it came down to a farm's race, but of course.. it also depends who they'd want to give up. Buchholz and Bowden is already a very attractive offer. Just for comparison's sake, you could say Hudson=Bowden in terms of upside/potential with giving Huddy a bit of an edge perhaps. We don't have a Clay Buchholz in our system. Now.. would the red sox want to actually give up that much for Adrian and if that's a need for them? That remains to be seen, but I'm sure they are definitely considering it, not to mention SD and Boston front office have alot of connections.

Disagree on Bowden being close to Hudson. Hudson is definitely better than that. Agree Buchholz is probably more attractive to the Padres than anything we could offer, but I still think Adrian is going to be a back-up plan for Boston, with King Felix being the #1 target. I do believe Boston has a great chance of winding up with one of these two.

 

I mentioned this in another thread about suitors for Gonzalez, but watch out for Baltimore and Tampa Bay if they get involved. They could beat either us or the Red Sox, even without Baltimore including Jones/Wieters/Tillman, etc. Baltimore has the cash for an extension and they have been wanting to make a splash for a while.