Miguel Cabrera could be traded?

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I believe Detroit is in alot of financial trouble with their organization and their city itself in the very near future, so I believe they are probably forced to have a payroll in a year or two in those effects. (Cincy as well) Thats why said players like Miggy and Granderson will probably become "dangled" by them to see what they can possibly net.

 

 

 

No doubt about it. It's a shame though.. it would probably take a Beckham, Danks, etc.. crazy like that to make Dombroski even think of moving Miggy to us in the division. Miggy is a hellova talent and would just be a nightmare especially in this park. He is very much worth what he makes, but we are tied ourselves with 2 big contracts. I've made my Miggy love known with that Adrian thread from pages 17-19 a while back. Scary to think he will probably be much better this comming season improving from making the AL jump.

I don't think Boston would have to give up Clay or really anything close to that. IMO, the Tigers aren't going to trade Cabrera unless ownership wants payroll basically cut in half between 2009 and 2010 (going from $129M+ down to the $70M or less range), and if that does become the case, there aren't many teams that will be willing or able to take on that deal. The Angels and Dodgers don't even look like they'd be able to take that on, so it's pretty much Red Sox vs. Yankees vs. Mets. Not a lot of leverage for Detroit. I don't think Cabrera will be moved, but if he is, it'll be kind of like the Peavy deal: a grossly low cost paid in talent for a truly elite player in his prime.

[SoxAce]

I don't think Cabrera will be moved, but if he is, it'll be kind of like the Peavy deal: a grossly low cost paid in talent for a truly elite player in his prime.

 

Now this part.. I agree 100% actually and you are probably right.

[Bonderman38]

And let's not forget that the dude got himself s***faced and jailed the last weekend of the season while his team was fighting for its playoff life; not that that's any kind of red flag or anything.

 

DOUBLE YUCK

 

First of all, this is incorrect. Cabrera was not arrested.

 

http://www.freep.com/article/20091007/SPOR...e--big-mistake-

Rosangel Cabrera told police the two were fighting. Both Cabreras had injuries to their faces, but police determined "both were aggressors" and did not arrest anybody.

 

Second of all, this won't happen. It's just talk that Lynn Henning started.

[Balta1701]

First of all, this is incorrect. Cabrera was not arrested.

He didn't say arrested, he said Jailed. That is actually correct; Dombrowski had to get him out of jail at 6:00 a.m.

[SoxAce]

He didn't say arrested, he said Jailed. That is actually correct; Dombrowski had to get him out of jail at 6:00 a.m.

 

Either way you slice it, it was still "not a bright" comment IMO for that one incident to not want a guy like that on your team, (unless you don't like him personally like Quinarvy, which I can respect) especially with Ozzie's relationship with him. Hell if it wasn't for Ozzie getting in his face about his weight the prior offseason, Miggy probably wouldn't have been as good of shape as he was in the Tigers ST camp. (though I'm sure he would still hit at a stud level)

Edited November 25, 2009 by SoxAce

[southsider2k5]

I don't think Boston would have to give up Clay or really anything close to that. IMO, the Tigers aren't going to trade Cabrera unless ownership wants payroll basically cut in half between 2009 and 2010 (going from $129M+ down to the $70M or less range), and if that does become the case, there aren't many teams that will be willing or able to take on that deal. The Angels and Dodgers don't even look like they'd be able to take that on, so it's pretty much Red Sox vs. Yankees vs. Mets. Not a lot of leverage for Detroit. I don't think Cabrera will be moved, but if he is, it'll be kind of like the Peavy deal: a grossly low cost paid in talent for a truly elite player in his prime.

 

$20,000,000 is a massive cost for any player, considering only 4 player made that in 2009, and three of them played in the same place.

[iamshack]

I really don't think the contract is anything to shy away from. MCab will most likely outperform what he is slated to make every year, barring some sort of injury problems or some sort of catastrophic event that somehow derails his career. While it is hard to conceive a huge package of players coming back to Detroit in return for taking on the contract, it isn't out of the realm of possibilities that they could receive a package of young talent in excess of what the Padres received for Jake Peavy.

 

Anyone who wanted us to acquire MCab from the Marlins (and briefly we were seeing published reports that we had acquired him) should have expected him to demand this type of extension. I'm not really sure why the contract is looked at so negatively here. Certainly it is a lot of money, but from what I understand, it's still not an annual figure he won't outperform by posting his current career averages.

 

If we were to acquire AGon, I imagine any extension he might demand will probably use the MCab deal as a primer by his agent.

[Texsox]

[Chicago White Sox]

Needs more green, please.

I'm afraid he might be serious.

[southsider2k5]

I really don't think the contract is anything to shy away from. MCab will most likely outperform what he is slated to make every year, barring some sort of injury problems or some sort of catastrophic event that somehow derails his career. While it is hard to conceive a huge package of players coming back to Detroit in return for taking on the contract, it isn't out of the realm of possibilities that they could receive a package of young talent in excess of what the Padres received for Jake Peavy.

 

Anyone who wanted us to acquire MCab from the Marlins (and briefly we were seeing published reports that we had acquired him) should have expected him to demand this type of extension. I'm not really sure why the contract is looked at so negatively here. Certainly it is a lot of money, but from what I understand, it's still not an annual figure he won't outperform by posting his current career averages.

 

If we were to acquire AGon, I imagine any extension he might demand will probably use the MCab deal as a primer by his agent.

 

In this economy? I think you are underestimating the seriousness facing ownership groups this season.

[clyons]

Either way you slice it, it was still "not a bright" comment IMO for that one incident to not want a guy like that on your team, (unless you don't like him personally like Quinarvy, which I can respect) especially with Ozzie's relationship with him. Hell if it wasn't for Ozzie getting in his face about his weight the prior offseason, Miggy probably wouldn't have been as good of shape as he was in the Tigers ST camp. (though I'm sure he would still hit at a stud level)

 

It may have been just "one incident," but its outrageously inappropriate timing is strongly indicative of a potential alcohol problem. I have no idea whether Cabrera in fact has such a problem or not, but my "not bright" comment was merely meant to suggest that the incident raised an additional red flag to consider in light of the huge contract. This isn't Cedric Benson who's problems occurred offseason and could be picked up for a song. Furthermore, and maybe I'm being too defensive here, but IMO a post that compares somebody's drunken spousal abuse to their weight issues and suggests that the former could be cured by a manager "getting in his face" shouldn't be labelling other's comments as "not bright."

[Quin]

If we were to acquire AGon, I imagine any extension he might demand will probably use the MCab deal as a primer by his agent.

 

Hey, they aren't using Texeira as a barometer at least...

 

Plus, even though I'm 80% sure we'd deal out that contract, I'd be more open to giving it to Gonzalez since he has good defense on top of his bat, and no character/weight issues.

[southsider2k5]

It may have been just "one incident," but its outrageously inappropriate timing is strongly indicative of a potential alcohol problem. I have no idea whether Cabrera in fact has such a problem or not, but my "not bright" comment was merely meant to suggest that the incident raised an additional red flag to consider in light of the huge contract. This isn't Cedric Benson who's problems occurred offseason and could be picked up for a song. Furthermore, and maybe I'm being too defensive here, but IMO a post that compares somebody's drunken spousal abuse to their weight issues and suggests that the former could be cured by a manager "getting in his face" shouldn't be labelling other's comments as "not bright."

 

Actually it wasn't even one incident. There are at least two instances at the same place, at least.

[chetkincaid]

No thanks. I hope the tigers aren't able to unload him. That way they'll be stuck with that contract and it'll hamper their ability to field a good team.

[2nd_city_saint787]

I'm afraid he might be serious.

 

 

sure was, too much??

[iamshack]

In this economy? I think you are underestimating the seriousness facing ownership groups this season.

I think you are overestimating the same.

If we were to acquire AGon, we'd have to give him the same type of extension were we to keep him around. Would you be viewing that extension the same way?

[Balta1701]

I think you are overestimating the same.

If we were to acquire AGon, we'd have to give him the same type of extension were we to keep him around. Would you be viewing that extension the same way?

Frankly, yeah. Unless we have a ton of young guys coming up to take over 6-7 positions, giving AGon $20 million means that we'll have bargain basement guys filling other positions. And he wouldn't be the only one around then getting expensive: Quentin, Danks, $10 million already for Rios, Floyd, Beckham would be hitting arbitration. You could do it if you had a lot of young guys coming up...but you'd have just traded away all your young guys for Gonzalez! So basically, you're going for everything in the next 2 years, and you're expecing that you're going to have to blow it up once AGon hits FA unless you nail a draft or two

[iamshack]

Frankly, yeah. Unless we have a ton of young guys coming up to take over 6-7 positions, giving AGon $20 million means that we'll have bargain basement guys filling other positions. And he wouldn't be the only one around then getting expensive: Quentin, Danks, $10 million already for Rios, Floyd, Beckham would be hitting arbitration. You could do it if you had a lot of young guys coming up...but you'd have just traded away all your young guys for Gonzalez! So basically, you're going for everything in the next 2 years, and you're expecing that you're going to have to blow it up once AGon hits FA unless you nail a draft or two

I absolutely know what you're saying here. And you make a lot of good points. But some points that KHP has made a lot recently, and that I tried to make 2-3 years ago is that the rest of the roster is not static. Higher salaried players can be traded for lower salaried players that you project well. Veterans can be traded for prospects. Certainly you would have to make adjustments to allow for such a large percentage of salary coming from one player.

 

But I don't think you should call a contract a bad one simply because it is a high dollar amount.

 

Kenny (with the help of our scouts) has been extremely good (and perhaps lucky) at switching out more expensive players for talented low-salaried players throughout the years, and I have no doubt he would again rise to the challenge. You'd probably be looking at dealing one of Danks or Floyd, letting Flowers take over for AJ, dealing Jenks, etc.,. But if you are getting the production out of the players you are paying, then you definitely can have success.

[Chicago White Sox]

sure was, too much??

Giving the Tigers (a division rival nonetheless) a top-notch starter, an above-average shortstop, our top three prospects, and basically $12 - $15 million to throw around for a replacement for Cabrera would be about as bad as it gets. Why in god's name would you want to pay that steep of a price to take on a $100 million plus financial burden? Would I take him off their hands for minimal talent? Most likely, but I would never give up that much talent for a guy locked into that kind of contract. Might as well wait one year and give Adrian Gonzalez $20 million a year and save all your talent.

[Texsox]

Generally speaking, what you are paying for is consistent production without much risk. If you can afford it, that is nice. But most teams cannot, so they look for the less expensive and hope they come through, and some will.

[iamshack]

Generally speaking, what you are paying for is consistent production without much risk. If you can afford it, that is nice. But most teams cannot, so they look for the less expensive and hope they come through, and some will.

Don't you think that is a bit of an understatement?

 

"consistent production without much risk?"

 

I'm thinking more like HOF caliber numbers year in and year out...

[2nd_city_saint787]

Giving the Tigers (a division rival nonetheless) a top-notch starter, an above-average shortstop, our top three prospects, and basically $12 - $15 million to throw around for a replacement for Cabrera would be about as bad as it gets. Why in god's name would you want to pay that steep of a price to take on a $100 million plus financial burden? Would I take him off their hands for minimal talent? Most likely, but I would never give up that much talent for a guy locked into that kind of contract. Might as well wait one year and give Adrian Gonzalez $20 million a year and save all your talent.

 

First and foremost maybe it was a bit much maybe take out hudson or lexi but as the previous poster said you'd be getting a guy that consistently puts up HoF numbers, arguably the best right handed hitter not named albert pujols in baseball (aside from the walks and Ks if you take him out of pitcher friendly comerica and into the cell he can put up pujols numbers) and if you can put together a package to get him you do it esp. if your left with enough pieces around him to compete for a championship which we def would.

 

think about it. you would have (lets say we take hudson out and leave lexi in)

 

1. Becks 2B (if we dont acquire a lead off guy)

2. Omar SS (he can do the little things a 2 hole hitter should do)

3. TCQ RF

4. MCab 1B/DH

5. PK 1B/DH

6. AJ C

7. Rios CF

8. Teahen 3B

9. Kotsay LF

 

Peavy

MB

Floyd

Garcia

Hudson

 

Danks/D2/Lexi/Flowers for a serious title contender....i do it in a second

 

 

oh and whos to say we dont get out bid on adrian next year so why wait till next year for just a chance?

 

 

i will go on record saying 2 things 1. I dont think it will happen because were in the same division and 2. i would rather get adrian in a trade and would offer the same package.

 

 

 

 

[southsider2k5]

I think you are overestimating the same.

If we were to acquire AGon, we'd have to give him the same type of extension were we to keep him around. Would you be viewing that extension the same way?

 

While we are in a better financial position than many franchises, and we wouldn't be paying him that in 2010, which is going to be most likely the roughest year for sports franchises, as the recession is now a year old, and many of the advertising deals are starting to expire. If I understand correctly, we wouldn't actually have to pony up for Gonzalez until '12. That gives us two years for the economy to recover.

 

Could we acquire a $20,000,000 player in 2010? No. There is a zero chance we could/would do that without moving an equal amount of money in bad contracts out of the door.

 

[Texsox]

Don't you think that is a bit of an understatement?

 

"consistent production without much risk?"

 

I'm thinking more like HOF caliber numbers year in and year out...

 

I was more speaking to a point why some guys earn $$ and others guys earn $$$$$$$. For the extra few $, there is usually less speculation and more consistent production. Thank you for giving me a chance to clarify. I can see how that was really unclear.

[iamshack]

While we are in a better financial position than many franchises, and we wouldn't be paying him that in 2010, which is going to be most likely the roughest year for sports franchises, as the recession is now a year old, and many of the advertising deals are starting to expire. If I understand correctly, we wouldn't actually have to pony up for Gonzalez until '12. That gives us two years for the economy to recover.

 

Could we acquire a $20,000,000 player in 2010? No. There is a zero chance we could/would do that without moving an equal amount of money in bad contracts out of the door.

 

Agreed. However, if you could acquire MCab for a massive discount in players surrendered because of the economic position the Tigers find themselves in, wouldn't you look into moving other contracts? I'd certainly consider moving Jenks and Konerko, which, if you could do so, would come pretty close to making the MCab addition an even swap financially.

 

I understand the point you're making in that we don't have the payroll to continuously add $20 m players. However, when you have a chance at adding HoF caliber players, for little other than the financial commitment, I think it's got to be something you look closely at.

 

Were we to acquire MCab, we'd have roughly $65 million or so tied up in 4 players (Peavy, MCab, Mark, Rios). But if you could deal Jenks and Konerko, even without very much return, I think you could field a younger team with the remaining $35-40 million if you drafted well and transitioned well from some of your veteran players to younger players in your system. Having Flowers, Hudson, Beckham, Danks, Mitchell, Viciedo and Morel could do a lot towards fielding an athletic, competitive team into the future led by Peavy, MCab, Danksy, Floyd, Q and Alexei.

 

It's definitely interesting to think about, and I definitely respect what you're saying here 2k5.