Failed terrorist attack in Detroit

[Balta1701]

Do you know for sure they didn't?

Yes, because otherwise they'd be 100% unable to charge him in civilian courts.

[NorthSideSox72]

Yes, because otherwise they'd be 100% unable to charge him in civilian courts.

Again, you are missing the reality of these heated situations. First, we're not talking about beating a suspect in a locked interview room with a camera. This stuff happens in the in between spaces. Second, the first people to handle this guy are cops and the first available feds - not soldiers or spooks. These people are angry, and human.

 

Now, I am not talking about waterboarding or some such complex, time-consuming exercise here. I am talking about plain old physical abuse, threats to life and limb, etc. And I stand by the idea that those things likely did occur, as they do in such situations, whether or not its logical or sane to do so.

 

One can only hope that if this did happen, it happened somewhere that it wasn't recorded or witnessed by anyone else.

 

[lostfan]

And way too many people who assume that because the rules of torture have changed subtly, that means no one is ever tortured. Or for that matter, that everyone has the same definition of it.

 

I certainly hope you and bmags aren't thinking that Hollywood silliness is what I had in mind when I asked that question. Look again at the scenario I posed. Not only is it possible, I'd even say its likely.

Oh, I was just saying that for the sake of saying it, not talking about you.

[lostfan]

Its not? :

It is, but Santa Claus's real identity is Jack Bauer and I don't think most Americans are ready to accept that reality.

[EvilMonkey]

Again, you are missing the reality of these heated situations. First, we're not talking about beating a suspect in a locked interview room with a camera. This stuff happens in the in between spaces. Second, the first people to handle this guy are cops and the first available feds - not soldiers or spooks. These people are angry, and human.

 

Now, I am not talking about waterboarding or some such complex, time-consuming exercise here. I am talking about plain old physical abuse, threats to life and limb, etc. And I stand by the idea that those things likely did occur, as they do in such situations, whether or not its logical or sane to do so.

 

One can only hope that if this did happen, it happened somewhere that it wasn't recorded or witnessed by anyone else.

You mean like walking the guy thru a door but 'accidently' running him into the wall next to the door? hehehe. Oops!

[lostfan]

You mean like walking the guy thru a door but 'accidently' running him into the wall next to the door? hehehe. Oops!

"Watch your head." lol.

 

My team arrested this guy once (I forget why, for spying I think, among other things) and blindfolded him to take him off for some quick interrogation before he was shipped off to a detention facility... we tried to warn him that he was about to come to a couple of stairs but I guess he was nervous or whatever and didn't listen, so he tripped and hit his face on the door frame. That was kind of awesome because I was pretty pissed at the time and wanted to punch him in the face, but couldn't, and it was like some neutral force heard my frustration and gave me an out. lol.

[kapkomet]

"Watch your head." lol.

 

My team arrested this guy once (I forget why, for spying I think, among other things) and blindfolded him to take him off for some quick interrogation before he was shipped off to a detention facility... we tried to warn him that he was about to come to a couple of stairs but I guess he was nervous or whatever and didn't listen, so he tripped and hit his face on the door frame. That was kind of awesome because I was pretty pissed at the time and wanted to punch him in the face, but couldn't, and it was like some neutral force heard my frustration and gave me an out. lol.

 

 

And if you were a navy seal, you would have been discharged/repremanded for punching him in the face, even if you didn't. You would have no legal recourse, unlike the asshole terrorist.

[NorthSideSox72]

LOLerrific. Poor guy.

 

[kapkomet]

LOLerrific? You've been texting too much.

[Jenksismyhero]

On a related note, I had the pleasure of waiting through a 15 minute line this morning at the Daley Center. Normally it takes me about 5 seconds to get to the elevators (attorneys and court personnel can be added to the security list with an ID to skip through it) . But this morning they decided to up the security and have everyone go through the metal detectors. If anyone has ever been to the Daley Center at 9:30am, you know it's an absolute madhouse with hundreds of people trying to get upstairs for various court calls.

 

So anyway I'm in this indiscernible line that snakes throughout the first floor of the building, when I decide to see how good this "security" really is, because they're literally pushing people through the detectors so as not to have complete chaos (imagine a hundred lawyers complaining about being late for their court calls). So anyways, I'm watching the two "guards" that are supposed to be checking the monitors, and sure enough, neither of them are paying a bit of attention to the screens, but instead they're talking to coworkers about how crazy it is. So, by my estimation, a solid 15-20 people went through without being checked. And that's only the 3-4 minutes where I was close enough to see what they were doing.

 

Yep. Real safe. And a great waste of time for everyone.

Edited January 5, 2010 by Jenksismybitch

[Texsox]

LOLerrific. Poor guy.

 

 

 

Police said they initially were led to believe the man might be a terrorist, until Slovak authorities provided more information about their role in planting the explosive.

 

Irish Justice Minister Dermot Ahern said Dublin police eventually confirmed that the explosive "was concealed without his knowledge or consent ... as part of an airport security exercise."

 

A major north Dublin intersection was shut down and neighboring apartment buildings were evacuated as a precaution while Irish Army experts inspected the explosive. The man was released without charge after several hours' detention.

 

Do you think if they water boarded him they could have discovered the "truth" that he really worked for a terrorist cell? After a couple hours of torture, what would he have said?

[kapkomet]

Do you think if they water boarded him they could have discovered the "truth" that he really worked for a terrorist cell? After a couple hours of torture, what would he have said?

 

 

Close Gitmo, and read me my rights, b****.

 

[Texsox]

Hell, why lock your car, if someone wants to steal it or what's in it bad enough, they gonna do it anyway. Save the money for the alarm and locks and spend it on something else. Why lock your front door either. If theives want your big screen, they gonna get it anyway.

 

The point is to spend enough to stop the casual assholes, and hopefully most of the committed ones, without breaking the bank. Somewhere there is a 'it costs too much' point, but I don't know where that is. New technology is always gonna cost more at first. So should we stop looking for new ways to stop terrorism?

Basically we all agree on this note. But we each clutch something slightly different. I bolded the part where the rubber meets the road. Dems I suspect will be less willing to spend on this, Reps, more willing. And for airport security, isn't this taking from the poor who fly less and giving to the rich who fly more?

[NorthSideSox72]

LOLerrific? You've been texting too much.

Actually, I almost never text. Or talk on the phone. I hate phones. I have a data phone, work needs me to have it (blackberry), so I just email.

 

[EvilMonkey]

Basically we all agree on this note. But we each clutch something slightly different. I bolded the part where the rubber meets the road. Dems I suspect will be less willing to spend on this, Reps, more willing. And for airport security, isn't this taking from the poor who fly less and giving to the rich who fly more?

But a vital airline industry is important for the economy of the country, including the poor. Tourism, business travel, etc depend on airlines. Hurt those, you hurt all businesses, not just airline travellers.

Edited January 6, 2010 by Alpha Dog

[BigSqwert]

...and read me my rights, b****.

Kind of like the last administration did with Richard Reid and others. But I'm sure that was different.

 

[Texsox]

But a vital airline industry is important for the economy of the country, including the poor. Tourism, business travel, etc depend on airlines. Hurt thoe, you hurt all businesses, not just airline trevellers.

 

Is that an argument for longer delays and higher prices with the extra security, or against?

[Balta1701]

Is that an argument for longer delays and higher prices with the extra security, or against?

Both.

[EvilMonkey]

Is that an argument for longer delays and higher prices with the extra security, or against?

Yeah, I have to say both. Somewhere there is the line where the extra spending and delays are not going to make a difference. I don't know where that is. I already don't fly unless I have to. Is there a point where people who fly for business will choose to drive again? Or take a train? Again, I am sure there is, but I don't know where that will be.

[NorthSideSox72]

Yeah, I have to say both. Somewhere there is the line where the extra spending and delays are not going to make a difference. I don't know where that is. I already don't fly unless I have to. Is there a point where people who fly for business will choose to drive again? Or take a train? Again, I am sure there is, but I don't know where that will be.

If the rail system can improve its infrastructure, and get around the current contention issues with freight rail, you will start to see some of that shifting occur. I don't see driving becoming much more popular, unless gas prices decline notably and sustainably.

 

[Balta1701]

If the rail system can improve its infrastructure, and get around the current contention issues with freight rail, you will start to see some of that shifting occur. I don't see driving becoming much more popular, unless gas prices decline notably and sustainably.

You're forgetting the fact that this country continues to provide huge subsidies for increasing driving.

[EvilMonkey]

You're forgetting the fact that this country continues to provide huge subsidies for increasing driving.

Really? The 17 years I spent driving 110 miles a day on the tri-state and other tollways could have been subsidized? Wish I would have known.

[Balta1701]

Really? The 17 years I spent driving 110 miles a day on the tri-state and other tollways could have been subsidized? Wish I would have known.

Did you drive on roads?

[EvilMonkey]

Did you drive on roads?

Don't I pay gas taxes, income taxes and tolls to the tollway?

[Balta1701]

Don't I pay gas taxes, income taxes and tolls to the tollway?

Yup. That's the government subsidy I'm talking about. You only pay a limited amount (tolls) to use those roads directly, and usually that doesn't even cover the cost of the roads. Furthermore, you're allowed to pollute the air and pump out CO2 and send money to Middle Eastern nations without having to suffer any of the consequences of those actions either.

 

If passenger and freight rail were subsidized at anywhere near the level that driving on roads is, you might have had choices in your transportation methods.