Technology catch-all thread

[Y2HH]

iOS7 - implementing things Android users have been enjoying for years while changing the look to make it seem like we did more than we actually did.

 

As have jailbreakers, since about 2008, well before Android users.

 

This comment shows you know little about the Apple mentality.

[Y2HH]

This was the moment that made me go "hmm..."

 

 

There's nothing wrong with taking from a competing product that's better.

 

That's about as dumb as possible.

 

It's a wallpaper.

 

Ooohhhhh, so similar.

 

And, unoriginal, you stole that.

[chw42]

That's about as dumb as possible.

 

It's a wallpaper.

 

Ooohhhhh, so similar.

 

And, unoriginal, you stole that.

 

It does look very similar. And let's not pretend Apple didn't borrow from its competitors. They did and I don't see anything wrong with that if it makes their OS better, because it seriously needed to be made better.

[chw42]

As have jailbreakers, since about 2008, well before Android users.

 

This comment shows you know little about the Apple mentality.

 

And what exactly is the Apple mentality?

[Y2HH]

This was the moment that made me go "hmm..."

 

 

There's nothing wrong with taking from a competing product that's better.

 

Design-wise I like what iOS 7 has to offer. They finally got rid of the awful leather and gloss that was the look of something made in 2007 (you know, back when Vista was considered a pretty UI). Flat design is all the jazz these days.

 

What's disappointing is that iOS still doesn't offer any real user customization like Android without having to jailbreak. They finally did get a better notification center and system toggles (FINALLY). But you could have gotten those things with jailbreak tweaks before.

 

THIS post is a bit better and less fanboyish than your first post, and worthy of an actual response, but the comparison is still reaching.

 

Apple still lacks the customization of Android, but it always will. Apple isn't shooting for this crowd, they never really have. They highlight simplicity over and over, especially with iOS7's key talking points. Adding massive customization, while nice for users like you and I, is NOT their target audience, who don't WANT to deal with anything like that. And despite widespread belief, there are a LOT of users out there like this, hence the money they're CONTINUING to make despite these overblown "declines".

 

As for that lock screen, that's incredibly reaching and fanboyish as a comparison, as it's based entirely off the wallpaper being somewhat similar. What else is the same? The lock isn't the same, hell, nothing else is remotely similar, from the icons across the top, to the images on the bottom. And please, let's not pretend Google/Android invented the f***ing Helectiva font, which is one of the most commonly used/popular in the world. So...other than a somewhat similar but not really similar wallpaper...absolutely nothing is the same on that screen.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Y2HH

[Y2HH]

And what exactly is the Apple mentality?

 

Explained in my post above.

 

Apple's mentality sure as hell isn't massive customization. Nothing they do has much customization involved, from the systems/devices they built, to the software they make. And I think you already know this.

[chw42]

THIS post is a bit better and less fanboyish than your first post, and worthy of an actual response.

 

Apple still lacks the customization of Android, but it always will. Apple isn't shooting for this crowd, they never really have. They highlight simplicity over and over, especially with iOS7's key talking points. Adding massive customization, while nice for users like you and I, is NOT their target audience, who don't WANT to deal with anything like that. And despite widespread belief, there are a LOT of users out there like this, hence the money they're CONTINUING to make despite these overblown "declines".

 

As for that home screen, that's incredibly reaching and fanboyish as a comparison, as it's based entirely off the wallpaper being somewhat similar. The lock isn't the same, hell, nothing else is remotely similar. And please, let's not pretend Google/Android invented the f***ing Helectiva font. That's stupid to a degree I cannot touch.

 

The thing with customization is that you can have it, but still have a simple and intuitive UI. Sure, you don't want a 70 year old grandma wondering what widget she wants on her home screen, but to not have that option period and use the excuse that "it's not our target audience" is just lazy. Because I would imagine it can't be all that hard to come up with a feature that turns customization on and off based on what the user wants.

 

Call the lockscreen thing what you want, but they're both actually live wallpapers too, with the exception that the iOS one moves only when the device moves. I'm actually hoping to get that wallpaper on my phone since the android phase beam is a little dark for my taste and I don't like wasting my battery on live wallpapers.

[Y2HH]

The thing with customization is that you can have it, but still have a simple and intuitive UI. Sure, you don't want a 70 year old grandma wondering what widget she wants on her home screen, but to not have that option period and use the excuse that "it's not our target audience" is just lazy. Because I would imagine it can't be all that hard to come up with a feature that turns customization on and off based on what the user wants.

 

Call the lockscreen thing what you want, but they're both actually live wallpapers too, with the exception that the iOS one moves only when the device moves. I'm actually hoping to get that wallpaper on my phone since the android phase beam is a little dark for my taste and I don't like wasting my battery on live wallpapers.

 

I agree with you on customization, which is why I jailbreak...but I don't think most users really give a s***...and to be honest, for all the customization I've done, I don't care either. The ONLY thing I'd miss from my jailbreak if I lost it is BiteSMS.

 

But, MOST Apple users do NOT agree with you on customization. They simply do not care that much. They just want their computer/device to work when they try to use it, and they don't want to have to configure anything to do so. It's a different mentality. And believe me, I know where you are coming from...it's a mentality I don't understand either, but it's real. I like to customize and configure EVERYTHING, but it's not the Apple way, and it never has been.

 

The WORST thing Apple could do is make a clone of Android, simply so they can say, "see, we can customize everything, too!" We already have that product. No need for a copy.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Y2HH

[chw42]

I agree with you on customization, which is why I jailbreak...but I don't think most users really give a s***...and to be honest, for all the customization I've done, I don't care either. The ONLY thing I'd miss from my jailbreak if I lost it is BiteSMS.

 

But, MOST Apple users do NOT agree with you on customization. They simply do not care that much. They just want their computer/device to work when they try to use it, and they don't want to have to configure anything to do so. It's a different mentality. And believe me, I know where you are coming from...it's a mentality I don't understand either, but it's real. I like to customize and configure EVERYTHING, but it's not the Apple way, and it never has been.

 

The WORST thing Apple could do is make a clone of Android, simply so they can say, "see, we can customize everything, too!" We already have that product. No need for a copy.

 

What I was alluding to was an on-off switch for customization in iOS. If you don't like it, keep it off. If you want to tinker, switch it on. It's a hell of a lot easier than jailbreaking for the user and Apple doesn't have to worry about users jailbreaking to customize, which might also lead to app piracy.

 

It's like easy mode on the Galaxy phones. Except the "easy" mode is the default Apple UI right now.

 

I know Apple has no real incentive to do this from a profit perspective, but if they are going to keep saying how innovative they are, they might want to keep their word and do it.

[Jake]

Apple will have to be more customizable if they want to keep their market share or start digging into Android's. There will always be people that will buy Apple, but right now they are still living on the reputation of the first gen iPhones. More and more people, myself included, have realized that the new iPhones are just by and by inferior. The nice thing about customizability...it is optional. Your custom can be just a list of apps if you like it that way. Android devices can be every bit as intuitive and simple while killing the current iPhones on hardware.

 

The original iPhone was the most customizable, the most potentially confusing thing ever when it was released; there had never been anything like it. They have gone from the most customizable, most complex to the least customizable, least complex. That isn't "the Apple mindset," that is stagnation.

 

And jailbreaking isn't a real solution for customization. I can do most of what I could do on a jailbroken phone on any maker's version of Android and not be on my own when it comes to getting service or software help.

 

Like chw42 said, they actually have to be innovative. I remember watching a Steve Jobs keynote where he said "Apple isn't always the first to the party" but they always do it best when they get there. Now they are not the first and they do not do it best. They have to innovate or they'll be stuck with people like my parents that just want the simplest, most familiar device possible...and you can't build a business on people that are about to be on Social Security.

[bmags]

and you can't build a business on people that are about to be on Social Security.

What? Of course you can.

[Y2HH]

Apple will have to be more customizable if they want to keep their market share or start digging into Android's. There will always be people that will buy Apple, but right now they are still living on the reputation of the first gen iPhones. More and more people, myself included, have realized that the new iPhones are just by and by inferior. The nice thing about customizability...it is optional. Your custom can be just a list of apps if you like it that way. Android devices can be every bit as intuitive and simple while killing the current iPhones on hardware.

 

The original iPhone was the most customizable, the most potentially confusing thing ever when it was released; there had never been anything like it. They have gone from the most customizable, most complex to the least customizable, least complex. That isn't "the Apple mindset," that is stagnation.

 

And jailbreaking isn't a real solution for customization. I can do most of what I could do on a jailbroken phone on any maker's version of Android and not be on my own when it comes to getting service or software help.

 

Like chw42 said, they actually have to be innovative. I remember watching a Steve Jobs keynote where he said "Apple isn't always the first to the party" but they always do it best when they get there. Now they are not the first and they do not do it best. They have to innovate or they'll be stuck with people like my parents that just want the simplest, most familiar device possible...and you can't build a business on people that are about to be on Social Security.

 

There is no innovation left in the current smartphone market, there hasn't been from Android manufactures, and there isn't from Apple, either, so stop tossing out that innovate line. It's nothing more than a modern day buzzword, akin to saying cloud a lot.

 

Oh, and when you say things like "the original iPhone was the most customizable phone at that point", you become hard to listen too further. WHAT in the holy f*** are you talking about?! No, it wasn't. The original iPhone, which I not only bought on day one, but still have, had almost NO customization or any options at all. And to call it confusing...are you f***ing crazy? At this point I have to believe you don't know what you're talking about. Did you ever use Windows Mobile 4.x, 5.x or 6.x device, which were all available well in advance of iOS? Infinitely more customizable, way more options, and way more confusing. So, for you to say what you just said...is just...out there. iOS 1.0 had no folders, no app store, and about 8 pre-installed apps with almost NO options to configure. Yes, that sounds super customizable and confusing to me. *roll of the eyes* Hell, it was easier to use than most base feature phones at the time.

 

As for Android customization, it has to be, since every manufacturers version of Android looks and feels completely different. This is yet another case of opinions being spewed without thought. Android users also jailbreak, only they call it unlocking and bootloading. Why do they do that if they can "already customize".

 

Look, if you want to have a conversation about this, let's have one, but what you're doing here...this is complete nonsense, uninformed fanboy banter at best. This is the problem with coming here in the tech thread. I'm made to look like some sort of Apple zealot when I have to defend them against nonsense like this entire post.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Y2HH

[Y2HH]

What I was alluding to was an on-off switch for customization in iOS. If you don't like it, keep it off. If you want to tinker, switch it on. It's a hell of a lot easier than jailbreaking for the user and Apple doesn't have to worry about users jailbreaking to customize, which might also lead to app piracy.

 

It's like easy mode on the Galaxy phones. Except the "easy" mode is the default Apple UI right now.

 

I know Apple has no real incentive to do this from a profit perspective, but if they are going to keep saying how innovative they are, they might want to keep their word and do it.

 

Apple can say their innovative as much as anyone else, and in this particular market, they're not. There is no innovation left based on the technology available in smartphones, until some great yet-unseen software idea emerges, there is no hardware that can be used at the moment to "innovate". They can all say they're innovating, but they're not, they're merely evolving at this point, and yes, that includes Apple. At this point, increasing screen size, resolution, or decreasing weight, or using aluminum, while all nice, isn't innovation.

 

Innovate is the latest in the string of company buzzwords, like cloud, or streaming. The first person to stream data was innovating, the rest of them are just streaming. Adding streaming to their products isn't innovating at that point, either, it's catching up. That's evolving. That's where the ENTIRE cell phone industry is right now, it's in an evolutionary state.

 

The on/off switch is a good idea, and something I think they should implement, HOWEVER, I'm the user they're catering too, and I understand that. Also, I accept that as a user of their product. The good news is, if/when I want that sort of customization, there are options available, such as Android. I have a jailbroken iPhone now, and the ONLY thing about my jailbreak I'd miss if I lost it is BiteSMS. The rest of it, the customization, while nice, it can also be a pain in the ass at times if something goes wrong, etc...but I'd really miss the functionality of BiteSMS. In the end, it's not THAT important to me, so long as my device does what I need it to do, and while I can do all of that right now, it's not necessary, either.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Y2HH

[chw42]

The Verge usually loves Apple, so this article was surprising to see: http://www.theverge.com/apple/2013/6/10/44...imply-confusing

 

 

I have to agree that those navigation icons aren't all that intuitive.

[chw42]

Apple can say their innovative as much as anyone else, and in this particular market, they're not. There is no innovation left based on the technology available in smartphones, until some great yet-unseen software idea emerges, there is no hardware that can be used at the moment to "innovate". They can all say they're innovating, but they're not, they're merely evolving at this point, and yes, that includes Apple. At this point, increasing screen size, resolution, or decreasing weight, or using aluminum, while all nice, isn't innovation.

 

Innovate is the latest in the string of company buzzwords, like cloud, or streaming. The first person to stream data was innovating, the rest of them are just streaming. Adding streaming to their products isn't innovating at that point, either, it's catching up. That's evolving. That's where the ENTIRE cell phone industry is right now, it's in an evolutionary state.

 

The on/off switch is a good idea, and something I think they should implement, HOWEVER, I'm the user they're catering too, and I understand that. Also, I accept that as a user of their product. The good news is, if/when I want that sort of customization, there are options available, such as Android. I have a jailbroken iPhone now, and the ONLY thing about my jailbreak I'd miss if I lost it is BiteSMS. The rest of it, the customization, while nice, it can also be a pain in the ass at times if something goes wrong, etc...but I'd really miss the functionality of BiteSMS. In the end, it's not THAT important to me, so long as my device does what I need it to do, and while I can do all of that right now, it's not necessary, either.

 

Google Glass and wearable tech is the next big thing in mobile and I'd call something like Glass innovative. You're right in that you won't get pure innovation out of a smartphone anymore (unless they make a transparent Iron Man phone or something). Most of the stuff that we see are just subtle add-ons that can also be extremely useful.

[chw42]

There is no innovation left in the current smartphone market, there hasn't been from Android manufactures, and there isn't from Apple, either, so stop tossing out that innovate line. It's nothing more than a modern day buzzword, akin to saying cloud a lot.

 

Oh, and when you say things like "the original iPhone was the most customizable phone at that point", you become hard to listen too further. WHAT in the holy f*** are you talking about?! No, it wasn't. The original iPhone, which I not only bought on day one, but still have, had almost NO customization or any options at all. And to call it confusing...are you f***ing crazy? At this point I have to believe you don't know what you're talking about. Did you ever use Windows Mobile 4.x, 5.x or 6.x device, which were all available well in advance of iOS? Infinitely more customizable, way more options, and way more confusing. So, for you to say what you just said...is just...out there. iOS 1.0 had no folders, no app store, and about 8 pre-installed apps with almost NO options to configure. Yes, that sounds super customizable and confusing to me. *roll of the eyes* Hell, it was easier to use than most base feature phones at the time.

 

As for Android customization, it has to be, since every manufacturers version of Android looks and feels completely different. This is yet another case of opinions being spewed without thought. Android users also jailbreak, only they call it unlocking and bootloading. Why do they do that if they can "already customize".

 

Look, if you want to have a conversation about this, let's have one, but what you're doing here...this is complete nonsense, uninformed fanboy banter at best. This is the problem with coming here in the tech thread. I'm made to look like some sort of Apple zealot when I have to defend them against nonsense like this entire post.

 

The original iPhone was pretty much a glorified feature phone. It didn't really become a "smartphone" by today's standards until the App Store launched a year later.

Edited June 11, 2013 by chw42

[Y2HH]

Google Glass and wearable tech is the next big thing in mobile and I'd call something like Glass innovative. You're right in that you won't get pure innovation out of a smartphone anymore (unless they make a transparent Iron Man phone or something). Most of the stuff that we see are just subtle add-ons that can also be extremely useful.

 

Agreed. This is the next step in mobile innovation, but I think it's going to be a while before society accepts it. Going to be banned in most places.

[Y2HH]

The Verge usually loves Apple, so this article was surprising to see: http://www.theverge.com/apple/2013/6/10/44...imply-confusing

 

 

I have to agree that those navigation icons aren't all that intuitive.

 

My friend is installing it on how wife's iPhone so we can test it, neither of us want to lose our jailbreak at the moment so she has to be our tester. . At first glance it seems a bit unfinished/lazy, kind of like Microsoft crap, but that's basing everything on the boot screen, so take that with a grain of salt for now.

[chw42]

Agreed. This is the next step in mobile innovation, but I think it's going to be a while before society accepts it. Going to be banned in most places.

 

And that's fine. I wouldn't want anyone carrying a on-demand recording device on my private property either. As long as it can be used without restriction in most public forums, I'm fine with it.

[chw42]

My friend is installing it on how wife's iPhone so we can test it, neither of us want to lose our jailbreak at the moment so she has to be our tester. . At first glance it seems a bit unfinished/lazy, kind of like Microsoft crap, but that's basing everything on the boot screen, so take that with a grain of salt for now.

 

I'll install it on my iPad when they do release a jailbreak for it.

 

And it looks like they're almost done with the jailbreak? http://www.ifans.com/blog/83873/

Edited June 11, 2013 by chw42

[Y2HH]

I'll install it on my iPad when they do release a jailbreak for it.

 

And it looks like they're almost done with the jailbreak? http://www.ifans.com/blog/83873/

 

They probably won't release it, or they risk Apple fixing it before the official release. So it'll probably be a while before they release a jailbreak.

 

Edit: I'd take this with a grain of salt. I think this is the guy that says he's able to jailbreak 6.1.3 but never does, and now he can break 7 a few hours after the beta is released. Highly unprobable this is anything more than talk.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Y2HH

[Y2HH]

And that's fine. I wouldn't want anyone carrying a on-demand recording device on my private property either. As long as it can be used without restriction in most public forums, I'm fine with it.

 

Agreed. I just seriously hope the final product doesn't look stupid. Looks great on the models I've seen but every time I see a regular person wearing it I want to flying leg kick them like Capt. Kirk. So I hope they make it look a bit sleeker than it looks now.

[Y2HH]

I'll install it on my iPad when they do release a jailbreak for it.

 

And it looks like they're almost done with the jailbreak? http://www.ifans.com/blog/83873/

 

I'm more interested in some of the APIs they opened in ios7, I'm sure ill read more about that in the days to come. The new icons and layout actually look pretty fresh, but that doesn't really add anything of substance. A few of the changes they've made replace a few jailbreak apps like sbsettings, the notification center seems more useful, too. Safari is exactly like Chrome for iOS, probably not a bad choice of browser to copy, though. The multitasking screen is like WebOS, which is nice.

 

One nice one that replaces jailbreak app lets you block numbers from calling or texting you, which is nice.

[chw42]

I'm more interested in some of the APIs they opened in ios7, I'm sure ill read more about that in the days to come. The new icons and layout actually look pretty fresh, but that doesn't really add anything of substance. A few of the changes they've made replace a few jailbreak apps like sbsettings, the notification center seems more useful, too. Safari is exactly like Chrome for iOS, probably not a bad choice of browser to copy, though. The multitasking screen is like WebOS, which is nice.

 

One nice one that replaces jailbreak app lets you block numbers from calling or texting you, which is nice.

 

NCSettings is a great utility IMO. Looks way better than SBSettings and fits right into the notification center. I'm hoping the new iOS command center lets you customize the toggles. Otherwise, it won't be as useful as it seems.

[Y2HH]

NCSettings is a great utility IMO. Looks way better than SBSettings and fits right into the notification center. I'm hoping the new iOS command center lets you customize the toggles. Otherwise, it won't be as useful as it seems.

 

It looks like ncsettings, I only used sbsettings as the comparison because more people would know what it is.

 

No ability to customize those buttons yet, but it has all the ones I currently use via Auxo, so it's not bad. Airplane mode, bluetooth, wifi, brightness, flashlight, music controls. It has some decent defaults, but I'm sure options will be added since the option screen for the command center is almost empty/looks unfinished.

 

It's nice but I still want BiteSMS over the default messaging app, but it did fix quite a few missing things I felt iOS needed, especially the app switcher and command center, some of the popup overlays are quite nice, too.

 

I'd love to get my hands on a HTC One Google edition, I'd love to use it for a week or two in everyday life.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Y2HH