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WhiteSox @ Brewers - 3:05pmC

scenario

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in 2010 Season in Review

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scenario Grand Master

scenario

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Posted (edited)

Looks like a classic Ozzie 'Sunday lineup' today...

 

Alexei leading off

D2 batting second and playing left

Kotsay at 1B

Jones in CF

Rios in RF

Castro catching

Nix at 3B

Lillibridge at 2B

Garcia pitching

 

Edited by scenario
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Balta1701 Grand Master

Balta1701

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 03:31 PM)
Ugh, Nix at 3B? Come on Teahen, get it together!

Nix is either your first or second backup at 3b, and if he's the 2nd backup there, it's worth noting that the first backup is 44 years old.

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Balta1701 Grand Master

Balta1701

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QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 04:05 PM)
Jones in CF again. Should we look into this? Is it just me or will we see Jones in CF, Rios in RF, and Pierre in LF with Q at DH a lot this summer?

If Jones keeps his bat hot and is as good defensively in CF as we're being told he is...yes, we'll see that.

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Princess Dye Grand Master

Princess Dye

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QUOTE (jphat007 @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 03:26 PM)
Kotsay is having one of the best Springs of any Sox player that will be on the 25. Doesn't mean anything but better than the opposite i guess

 

Everyone seems to have this view of Kotsay. What I dont get is the following:

 

Why cant this be a case of an oft-injured player(with Boston) that has finally gotten right again. If I'm not mistaken, it was a specific, reoccurring injury that troubled him over the last few years.

 

And starting with his time in Chicago last year...he has turned his career back around.

 

Isnt that at least possible? Everyone acts as if it's not.

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jphat007 Grand Master

jphat007

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QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 02:47 PM)
Everyone seems to have this view of Kotsay. What I dont get is the following:

 

Why cant this be a case of an oft-injured player(with Boston) that has finally gotten right again. And starting with his time in Chicago last year...he has turned his career back around.

 

Isnt that possible? Everyone acts as if it's not.

 

I agree with you 100%. Everybody is sucking off Jones (which is fine, he's having a great camp), but then acting like Kotsay can't keep this up. He's been a pretty solid hitter against righties when healthy. Of course that is the sticking point. He could stay healthy tho

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southsider2k5 Grand Master

southsider2k5

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QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 02:47 PM)
Everyone seems to have this view of Kotsay. What I dont get is the following:

 

Why cant this be a case of an oft-injured player(with Boston) that has finally gotten right again. If I'm not mistaken, it was a specific, reoccurring injury that troubled him over the last few years.

 

And starting with his time in Chicago last year...he has turned his career back around.

 

Isnt that at least possible? Everyone acts as if it's not.

 

This is Soxtalk. If you suck in spring training, it means you are going to suck for the entire year. If you hit in spring training, it means nothing.

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Balta1701 Grand Master

Balta1701

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QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 04:47 PM)
Everyone seems to have this view of Kotsay. What I dont get is the following:

 

Why cant this be a case of an oft-injured player(with Boston) that has finally gotten right again. And starting with his time in Chicago last year...he has turned his career back around.

 

Isnt that possible? Everyone acts as if it's not.

Because...even if his issue the last couple years was not being 100% healthy...he hasn't put up an .800 OPS since 2004, and has only done so 3 times in 13 career seasons. For a DH, that's just ugh. Now, you might fire back "But he's useful as a rolling DH as well and can play the OF, and an .800 OPS for a CF isn't that bad". Except, he's also been bad in CF since 2004 also. He might or might not be an average RF (he hasn't spent enough time there to judge), but his numbers argue he's basically a backup and should be treated as such.

 

If he's getting only garbage time innings or playing every 3rd day to give someone a day off, ok, no one should have any reason to complain. Those are quality numbers for a backup 1b and backup corner OF. If he's getting 400-500 PA's, seeing time at DH, seeing time in the OF, like we keep being told he will, he never was a good enough player to justify that unless he was playing good defense, and he hasn't done that in 6+ years either.

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justBLAZE Grand Master

justBLAZE

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 02:54 PM)
Because...even if his issue the last couple years was not being 100% healthy...he hasn't put up an .800 OPS since 2004, and has only done so 3 times in 13 career seasons. For a DH, that's just ugh. Now, you might fire back "But he's useful as a rolling DH as well and can play the OF, and an .800 OPS for a CF isn't that bad". Except, he's also been bad in CF since 2004 also. He might or might not be an average RF (he hasn't spent enough time there to judge), but his numbers argue he's basically a backup and should be treated as such.

 

If he's getting only garbage time innings or playing every 3rd day to give someone a day off, ok, no one should have any reason to complain. Those are quality numbers for a backup 1b and backup corner OF. If he's getting 400-500 PA's, seeing time at DH, seeing time in the OF, like we keep being told he will, he never was a good enough player to justify that unless he was playing good defense, and he hasn't done that in 6+ years either.

 

Hopefully Jones will become a full time DH/OF and Kotsay will be occasional backup at OF/1B/DH and everyone will be happy.

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Princess Dye Grand Master

Princess Dye

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 03:54 PM)
Because...even if his issue the last couple years was not being 100% healthy...he hasn't put up an .800 OPS since 2004, and has only done so 3 times in 13 career seasons. For a DH, that's just ugh. Now, you might fire back "But he's useful as a rolling DH as well and can play the OF, and an .800 OPS for a CF isn't that bad". Except, he's also been bad in CF since 2004 also. He might or might not be an average RF (he hasn't spent enough time there to judge), but his numbers argue he's basically a backup and should be treated as such.

 

If he's getting only garbage time innings or playing every 3rd day to give someone a day off, ok, no one should have any reason to complain. Those are quality numbers for a backup 1b and backup corner OF. If he's getting 400-500 PA's, seeing time at DH, seeing time in the OF, like we keep being told he will, he never was a good enough player to justify that unless he was playing good defense, and he hasn't done that in 6+ years either.

 

If he has a full year like the time he had with us last year, will he be an 'ugh-level' DH? For certain it wouldnt be that impressive, but I dont know about 'ugh.'

 

These are great points about how he'd be decent production for a CF, etc...bad production for a DH...

 

But I think of those as being valuable in constructing a team. Now that the team's constructed, I think we have to take a .350 OBP anywhere we can get it.

 

Yeah he's be a light-hitting DH. But we've added power in the IF (and hopefully with CQ) to possibly offset that lack. If he gives us a year full of quality at-bats from the left hand side, he's giving us something we need every bit as badly as SLG, if not more.

 

 

 

No he's not an outstanding player, obviously. But he fits a need. He can do something with the bat besides 'all-or-nothing.' I have long wanted more of that, be it at DH or elsewhere.

Edited by Princess Dye
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Ultimate Warrior Explorer

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If he has a full year like the time he had with us last year, will he be an 'ugh-level' DH? For certain it wouldnt be that impressive, but I dont know about 'ugh.'

 

These are great points about how he'd be decent production for a CF, etc...bad production for a DH...

 

But I think of those as being valuable in constructing a team. Now that the team's constructed, I think we have to take a .350 OBP anywhere we can get it.

 

Yeah he's be a light-hitting DH. But we've added power in the IF (and hopefully with CQ) to possibly offset that lack. If he gives us a year full of quality at-bats from the left hand side, he's giving us something we need every bit as badly as SLG, if not more.

 

 

 

No he's not an outstanding player, obviously. But he fits a need. He can do something with the bat besides 'all-or-nothing.' I have long wanted more of that, be it at DH or elsewhere.

What suggests to you that he will put up a .350 OBP? His 2004 season? Or his 113 AB's with the white sox last year? Kotsay blows. He can't slug well, he can't put up a decent OBP. He's a lousy player, that's what he is. I don't see why you think he will be a good DH. He brings nothing good to the table.

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Kalapse Grand Master

Kalapse

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QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 04:19 PM)
If he has a full year like the time he had with us last year, will he be an 'ugh-level' DH? For certain it wouldnt be that impressive, but I dont know about 'ugh.'

 

These are great points about how he'd be decent production for a CF, etc...bad production for a DH...

 

But I think of those as being valuable in constructing a team. Now that the team's constructed, I think we have to take a .350 OBP anywhere we can get it.

 

Yeah he's be a light-hitting DH. But we've added power in the IF (and hopefully with CQ) to possibly offset that lack. If he gives us a year full of quality at-bats from the left hand side, he's giving us something we need every bit as badly as SLG, if not more.

 

 

 

No he's not an outstanding player, obviously. But he fits a need. He can do something with the bat besides 'all-or-nothing.' I have long wanted more of that, be it at DH or elsewhere.

He was healthy in '05 and '06 while leaving his prime and hit .278/.329/.405/.734 with 22 HRs in nearly 1200 PA, aside from a tiny sample with the Sox last season there's really no reason to believe he'd do any better than that ~735 OPS and 10 HR he put up when he was last healthy and somewhat youthful. This isn't some 28 year who's had a rash of bad luck injury wise, it's a mid-30 year old man who's body has been breaking down and just isn't nearly as talented as he once was.

 

He won't be an all or nothing guy because he has no power, he'll just be an occasional doubles guy who doesn't get on base, play good defense anywhere but 1B or run well. In other words; not very good. Instead of making his outs via the K he'll make them via the weak popout and grounder, I don't see how that's much more exciting.

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knightni Grand Master

knightni

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QUOTE (flavum @ Mar 21, 2010 -> 06:36 PM)
Let's tee it up, already!

I'm with you, but it frickin' snowed in Chicago yesterday.

 

I still wish that they would start the season early with the first 7 or so games on the road in warm weather/dome parks.

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