Racist T-Shirts Around Wrigley?

[southsider2k5]

The ghetto by U.S. Cellular used to be across the expressway in Bronzeville and by Ida B. Wells projects (whichever ones they were, I forget) but that's not even really ghetto anymore (in fact I'm trying to open up a restaurant there)

 

Which would in fact be the worlds most ghetto restaurant.

[lostfan]

I'm not sure what you guys are referring to when you talk about the neighborhood integration of Camden Yards. Yeah it looks like that on TV, but the park is right in the middle of downtown Baltimore. Those buildings you see on Eutaw St., if I recall, those are actually stadium property and they're right there on the concourse, mostly for show. The gap you see in center field, if you look with the right view up high enough, you can see traffic on Camden Street, and then the next street is Pratt Street which is one of the main downtown streets. So there is nothing neighborhood/residential at all with that stadium, it looks nice, but that is all decoration. Yes there is public transportation that goes right there, but there is a big parking lot to the south between Camden Yards and M&T Bank stadium just like there is at the Cell, and to the west of it is expressway that becomes downtown streets.

[lostfan]

Which would in fact be the worlds most ghetto restaurant.

lol... not IN the projects. On Pershing or thereabouts, near the new high rises that keep getting built.

[bmags]

A restaurant in Bronzeville? What do you mean? You mean from my current job?

 

From your job, yeah.

 

Southsidedon...if you didn't have the choice to drive, you wouldn't. As for the other stuff you said, i'd rather the sox have created a situation where lots of bars and restaurants and housing opened up around it creating jobs and community surrounding the team, rather then a bunch of decay. I don't want to give the impression that there hasn't been development around, but nowhere near what was possible. Huge opportunity missed.

[bmags]

I'm not sure what you guys are referring to when you talk about the neighborhood integration of Camden Yards. Yeah it looks like that on TV, but the park is right in the middle of downtown Baltimore. Those buildings you see on Eutaw St., if I recall, those are actually stadium property and they're right there on the concourse, mostly for show. The gap you see in center field, if you look with the right view up high enough, you can see traffic on Camden Street, and then the next street is Pratt Street which is one of the main downtown streets. So there is nothing neighborhood/residential at all with that stadium, it looks nice, but that is all decoration. Yes there is public transportation that goes right there, but there is a big parking lot to the south between Camden Yards and M&T Bank stadium just like there is at the Cell, and to the west of it is expressway that becomes downtown streets.

 

For Camden i was actually referring to how the stadium ITSELF looked and how the sox built, like, the very last stadium before the "new" ballparks that Camden ushered in (Jacobs Field, etc.). Now, of course, our park looks beautiful. The roof improvement and centerfield absolutely made our park gorgeous. No complaints now.

 

I was more referring to that early in the process, the sox were planning on integrating the park in the bridgeport neighborhood, then were going to move to schaumberg i believe. Then they decided to move the schaumberg design IN chicago. It was really dumb.

[southsider2k5]

lol... not IN the projects. On Pershing or thereabouts, near the new high rises that keep getting built.

 

Oh I wasn't talking about its location, I was talking about its theme and management!

[southsider2k5]

For Camden i was actually referring to how the stadium ITSELF looked and how the sox built, like, the very last stadium before the "new" ballparks that Camden ushered in (Jacobs Field, etc.). Now, of course, our park looks beautiful. The roof improvement and centerfield absolutely made our park gorgeous. No complaints now.

 

I was more referring to that early in the process, the sox were planning on integrating the park in the bridgeport neighborhood, then were going to move to schaumberg i believe. Then they decided to move the schaumberg design IN chicago. It was really dumb.

 

The south loop would have been a perfect revamp at that time.

[lostfan]

Ah, gotcha bmags. Camden definitely does have that "cozy" look to it. The concourses and the inside of the stadium is much better in the Cell though, I gotta say.

[lostfan]

Oh I wasn't talking about its location, I was talking about its theme and management!

Haha. Touche. Especially if you've ever met Amber (the one who'll be managing it all).

[NorthSideSox72]

We really must've hired the world's dumbest architects. They got completely trumped by Camden Yards at the time, and instead of building it in a place encouraging mass transit they invite a gridlock to the neighborhood. Those were the times though. Efficient urban planning has a lot more street cred now.

Are you referring to Wrigley or the Cell? Because The Cell actually did this 100% right. Its right next to one El stop, 3 blocks from another, and squeezed between two Metra-used rail lines where we are now going to get a Metra stop. I'm not sure another ballpark in the country has this as good as we do.

 

I do agree with the overall point though about eschewing a neighborhood type design being stupid. There were alternate plans out there to really develop the neighborhood along with the park, but they were rejected for cost.

 

[lostfan]

Are you referring to Wrigley or the Cell? Because The Cell actually did this 100% right. Its right next to one El stop, 3 blocks from another, and squeezed between two Metra-used rail lines where we are now going to get a Metra stop. I'm not sure another ballpark in the country has this as good as we do.

 

I do agree with the overall point though about eschewing a neighborhood type design being stupid. There were alternate plans out there to really develop the neighborhood along with the park, but they were rejected for cost.

It's relatively easy to get to Yankee Stadium on the subway FWIW, although there's no commuter rail like the Metra that I know of. Camden Yards has light rail and commuter rail though, sometimes I take that instead of driving.

[bmags]

Are you referring to Wrigley or the Cell? Because The Cell actually did this 100% right. Its right next to one El stop, 3 blocks from another, and squeezed between two Metra-used rail lines where we are now going to get a Metra stop. I'm not sure another ballpark in the country has this as good as we do.

 

I do agree with the overall point though about eschewing a neighborhood type design being stupid. There were alternate plans out there to really develop the neighborhood along with the park, but they were rejected for cost.

 

hence the "that we already have infrastructure" part of it. All that parking lot space is a waste, all of that could be developments.

[NorthSideSox72]

hence the "that we already have infrastructure" part of it. All that parking lot space is a waste, all of that could be developments.

Sure, that's the part I agree with. I just didn't understand your reference to some sort of lack of mass transit, which didn't make sense.

 

[joeynach]

This is one of the main reasons the cub fan base has been moving from gritty die hards to just a bunch of rowdy frat boys over the last 10 years or so. And its not just us that have noticed. We had had the whole beer dumping incident last year with Vicotrino. And here its not that the t shirts themselves are bad, but the glorification of this type of stuff by the "cubbie faithful". The fact that after they signed Fukudome a couple years ago, a big signing at the time, 4 years 48 mil, a player thought to really anchor the cubs outfield, there fanbase made a spectacle out of the whole thing. Its all a big happy go fun time joke to them. They glorify this whole ra ra wooo hoo attitude where the actual game is the in the background. To sign Fukudome and then see every young person (my age), frat boys, young trixies, even young couples, wearing these shirts, singing these chants, and wearing red head bands like their Japanese warriors is disgusting. Enjoy the game, enjoy the park, enjoy chicago summer, even wear a funny t shirt once in a while, but dont make a mockery of 100+ years of baseball and turn a following a baseball game (or team) into just another partying/ra ra activity.

Edited April 14, 2010 by joeynach

[The Ginger Kid]

i like the green bay shirt. would never wear it, but it made me laugh. hate those f***ers.

[bmags]

Sure, that's the part I agree with. I just didn't understand your reference to some sort of lack of mass transit, which didn't make sense.

 

You'd have to follow every post i made, I stated that we already had the infrastructure for public transit, which is why needing acres of parking spots to bring congestion to the city isn't a great decision.

[SockMe]

stay classy Cubs fans

[RockRaines]

This is one of the main reasons the cub fan base has been moving from gritty die hards to just a bunch of rowdy frat boys over the last 10 years or so. And its not just us that have noticed. We had had the whole beer dumping incident last year with Vicotrino. And here its not that the t shirts themselves are bad, but the glorification of this type of stuff by the "cubbie faithful". The fact that after they signed Fukudome a couple years ago, a big signing at the time, 4 years 48 mil, a player thought to really anchor the cubs outfield, there fanbase made a spectacle out of the whole thing. Its all a big happy go fun time joke to them. They glorify this whole ra ra wooo hoo attitude where the actual game is the in the background. To sign Fukudome and then see every young person (my age), frat boys, young trixies, even young couples, wearing these shirts, singing these chants, and wearing red head bands like their Japanese warriors is disgusting. Enjoy the game, enjoy the park, enjoy chicago summer, even wear a funny t shirt once in a while, but dont make a mockery of 100+ years of baseball and turn a following a baseball game (or team) into just another partying/ra ra activity.

I'd venture to guess far less than 1% of the fans at Wrigley were in a fraternity. Nice generalization though.

[SockMe]

i like the green bay shirt. would never wear it, but it made me laugh. hate those f***ers.

 

 

The Brewers one is pretty funny

[greg775]

I wish they had integrated Comiskey into bridgeport the same way, and hadn't encouraged so many people to drive there.

 

How do you do that? Isn't Bridgeport just a nice old neighborhood with very narrow streets, schools, parks, churches, etc?

It's just an old neighborhood. What do you mean integrate the park into Bridgeport?

[Real]

Why is this thread in PHT? dumb

[Pants Rowland]

How do you do that? Isn't Bridgeport just a nice old neighborhood with very narrow streets, schools, parks, churches, etc?

It's just an old neighborhood. What do you mean integrate the park into Bridgeport?

 

The park is kind of an island in a sea of asphalt. You have to go a couple blocks in any direction to find any critical mass of homes, retail, schools, etc. They could have built the park closer to the pulse of the neighborhood.

 

While I wish they had done something like this originally, it should be noted that surface parking lots are nothing more than vacant parcels of land that have no higher and better use to merit new construction. The Sox get good revenue for the lots during the season, but for the right price, I am confident some type of deal could be worked for future development. The fact is the returns on an investment are not high enough yet to merit building a mixed use structure incorporating first floor retail with a multi-level parking garage above and maybe some residential units above the parking component.

[Quin]

im sure it goes both ways. sox fan says wrigley is a dump, cub fan says USCF sucks, sox fan says Zambrano is not an ace, cub fan says buehrle is not an ace. Its a never ending feud that is impossible to avoid no matter how hard you try, cub "fans" are everywhere. At work, in other cities, at weddings, at funerals.. the day the Cubs win the world series is the day i move out of chicago.. it would be non-stop smack talk every single season until the Sox win another one.

 

"Mark Buehrle had a No Hitter"

"Zambrano had a better No Hitter"

"Buehrle had a ****ing Perfect Game"

"Well Zambrano is the ****!"

 

^ Standard conversation with some friends who are Cubs fans.

 

It's sadder with me personally. A few Cubs fans I know love USCF cause our field/ballpark is "nice." They actually go to the games too and just try and either heckle people, or wear Cubs gear like they are some kind of rebel... without a cause. They hate everything else about us though.

 

One game, this guy decked out in Cubs gear wouldn't leave my mom alone on the concourse. Eventually, I just asked him "Dude, can you just leave her alone and enjoy a good game (The Dodgers 13-Inning Game)." He didn't stop, and I eventually had him warned by an Sox employee, who then threw him out when he didn't stop.

 

i hate seeing that, people wearing opposing teams gear just to be overtly obnoxious at our games. Although i dont condone this type of behavior, one of the supposed twins fans at the game on friday got his head split open by a huge sox fan that apparently had enough of him screaming obnoxiously and cheering wildly after every single white sox out for the entire game (which went into extra innings). I think if you plan on going to a game dressed as a fan of the opposing team, thats fine, but you cross the line when you overtly taunt the home team and annoy every fan around you. There are people in this world that wont grin and bear it, and there are other people that dont believe in calling security and take matters into their own hands..

 

The game Saturday...two drunk Sox fans kept yelling "Kuuuuubeeeeeel" to Kubel in LF, and then a group of Twins/Cubs fans decided to do it to mock them and do the same thing. I was *this* close to telling them the shut up, but figured it would be best not to.

[bmags]

The Sox get good revenue for the lots during the season, but for the right price, I am confident some type of deal could be worked for future development. The fact is the returns on an investment are not high enough yet to merit building a mixed use structure incorporating first floor retail with a multi-level parking garage above and maybe some residential units above the parking component.

 

First point, the sox didn't pay for the stadium, so a stadium design that would've fostered quite a bit more commercial activity is far more beneficial to me than allowing people to drive to the games and pollute and add traffic at an already awful time.

 

BUt to your second point, you are correct. However, had it happened 20 years ago we'd have had that much more progress. Look at Wicker park 20 years ago to now. Look at South Loop. It was so god damn boring and stupid.

 

But, there is clearly overregulation right now that could really help create something by the sox stadium. Look at the restrictions the new jimbos is working around (liquor license freeze).

[greg775]

The park is kind of an island in a sea of asphalt. You have to go a couple blocks in any direction to find any critical mass of homes, retail, schools, etc. They could have built the park closer to the pulse of the neighborhood.

 

While I wish they had done something like this originally, it should be noted that surface parking lots are nothing more than vacant parcels of land that have no higher and better use to merit new construction. The Sox get good revenue for the lots during the season, but for the right price, I am confident some type of deal could be worked for future development. The fact is the returns on an investment are not high enough yet to merit building a mixed use structure incorporating first floor retail with a multi-level parking garage above and maybe some residential units above the parking component.

 

Ah, I get it.

But some of us remember Old Comiskey before they had the massive parking lots. There were houses in the neighborhood right by the park and it was a dangerous situation. You had to pay thugs on the street money to "watch your car" during the game. To the thugs' credit, if you paid the thugs 10 bucks, you would come out to find your car still had its tires inflated If you didn't pay, good chance your tires would be flat.

The argument would be, if the Sox didn't buy out all those homes, would it still be a dangerous area?

Bridgeport may be several blocks away, but it's still pretty close by. The homes by the old Comiskey parking lots were shacks with many roving gangs hanging around the park.

Edited April 14, 2010 by greg775