NBA Offseason Thread

[chw42]

If only the Bulls went two picks higher in 2003...

[Quin]

If Wade was really a spy. What a douchebag, he used his kids for crying out loud.

 

This. To everyone who is blaming the Bulls...can you really?

 

No one was giving into the Raptors initially, and the Bulls could still offer a better package minus Noah against the Heat. Wade said he was doing what was best for his kids, had Bosh come into a meeting with him to discuss it, etc. The front office bought it and so did we, because Wade is a shady piece of crap.

 

As for trusting World Wide Wes...a month ago, would anyone have said that was a bad idea?

[sircaffey]

Well we don't know everything they did wrong for sure. But it sounds like the two biggest mistakes were buying into the relevance of William Wesley in LeBron's circle and not securing Chris Bosh first (even if it took giving up the almighty Joakim Noah) to take away Wade's options in Miami in terms of getting help. Acquring Bosh early on also would have made Chicago an even more attractive spot.

I don't think it was possible to secure Bosh. Bosh and Wade have been tied at the hip this whole process.

[Chicago White Sox]

There's no way in hell LeBron goes to Miami. It's just not going to happen for many reasons.

 

The fact that we haven't heard s*** about the Bulls gives me some hope we may still be in the LeBron sweepstakes. You would think the Bulls would act quickly on Boozer/Lee if the big 3 are all gone.

[daa84]

If only the Bulls went two picks higher in 2003...

its funny....EVERYONE had dwyane wade falling to us in that draft....IIRC the bulls were quite surprised that Miami took him as high as they did

[whitesoxfan101]

This. To everyone who is blaming the Bulls...can you really?

 

No one was giving into the Raptors initially, and the Bulls could still offer a better package minus Noah against the Heat. Wade said he was doing what was best for his kids, had Bosh come into a meeting with him to discuss it, etc. The front office bought it and so did we, because Wade is a shady piece of crap.

 

As for trusting World Wide Wes...a month ago, would anyone have said that was a bad idea?

 

If you're the Bulls, you offer Noah to the Raptors in a sign and trade from the beginning. You had to acquire him to not only avoid coming up empty, but also make Wade make a decision. That is entirely on the Bulls, end of story. If Wade and Bosh were so tied together, make them prove how tied together they were.

 

And getting snuggy with WWW is nice, but every other person surrounded by LeBron is a friend who benefits from him staying in Cleveland (which is why it'd make sense if he stays there). You can't put all of your trust into one guy like that, or you risk looking like an idiot as the Bulls now do.

Edited July 7, 2010 by whitesoxfan101

[daa84]

There's no way in hell LeBron goes to Miami. It's just not going to happen for many reasons.

 

The fact that we haven't heard s*** about the Bulls gives me some hope we may still be in the LeBron sweepstakes. You would think the Bulls would act quickly on Boozer/Lee if the big 3 are all gone.

this is the type of stuff that gets dangerous though...you can't overpay for some guys just because you struck out with others...im not saying i wouldnt welcome either lee or boozer with open arms, but max deals for those guys is too much IMO

[MurcieOne]

WojYahooNBA Official with team that made a formal presentation to LeBron James tells Y! Sports: "It's down to Cleveland or Miami for him."

 

I bet that this is a Bulls source.

[whitesoxfan101]

I want no part of Boozer or Lee. You aren't winning a championship because of them, and we've already seen with Luol Deng how damaging overpaying for a guy like that can be.

[Jenksismyhero]

Well we don't know everything they did wrong for sure. But it sounds like the two biggest mistakes were buying into the relevance of William Wesley in LeBron's circle and not securing Chris Bosh first (even if it took giving up the almighty Joakim Noah) to take away Wade's options in Miami in terms of getting help. Acquring Bosh early on also would have made Chicago an even more attractive spot.

 

 

1) The WWW angle is unfair. Prior to this whole process, everyone and their mother figured that WWW was THE man pulling all the strings. Moreover, they clearly hedged their bet when they went after Bosh/Wade before speaking with Lebron in the first place.

 

2) I have yet to see a report that says the Bulls didn't go after Bosh hard. Everyone has said the opposite. ESPN Chicago's guy just said the Bulls sold him as best they could but that Bosh's number one choice was always Miami. They can't force the guy to sign. The whole s&t angle is meaningless. Toronto had ZERO to do with where Bosh ended up. They were blindsided by his decision just like everyone else. So who cares if they failed to offer up Noah. Toronto never had the chance to accept that deal and THEN convince Bosh to accept it.

 

The Bulls front office did everything they could. I just don't see what they did wrong here. Screwed by circumstane, that's about all you can say.

[bmags]

this is the type of stuff that gets dangerous though...you can't overpay for some guys just because you struck out with others...im not saying i wouldnt welcome either lee or boozer with open arms, but max deals for those guys is too much IMO

 

Yep. ON the other hand...what the hell do you do with 30 mill in cap space. I kind of wish we had our best defensive guard back.

[sircaffey]

If you're the Bulls, you offer Noah to the Raptors in a sign and trade from the beginning. You had to acquire him to not only avoid coming up empty, but also make Wade make a decision. That is entirely on the Bulls, end of story. If Wade and Bosh were so tied together, make them prove how tied together they were.

 

And getting snuggy with WWW is nice, but every other person surrounded by LeBron is a friend who benefits from him staying in Cleveland (which is why it'd make sense if he stays there). You can't put all of your trust into one guy like that, or you risk looking like an idiot as the Bulls now do.

 

It doesn't matter what the Bulls offered to Toronto. Bosh decides where he ends up in a S&T.

[whitesoxfan101]

1) The WWW angle is unfair. Prior to this whole process, everyone and their mother figured that WWW was THE man pulling all the strings. Moreover, they clearly hedged their bet when they went after Bosh/Wade before speaking with Lebron in the first place.

 

2) I have yet to see a report that says the Bulls didn't go after Bosh hard. Everyone has said the opposite. ESPN Chicago's guy just said the Bulls sold him as best they could but that Bosh's number one choice was always Miami. They can't force the guy to sign. The whole s&t angle is meaningless. Toronto had ZERO to do with where Bosh ended up. They were blindsided by his decision just like everyone else. So who cares if they failed to offer up Noah. Toronto never had the chance to accept that deal and THEN convince Bosh to accept it.

 

The Bulls front office did everything they could. I just don't see what they did wrong here. Screwed by circumstane, that's about all you can say.

 

If the Bulls didn't offer up Noah, they didn't do everything they could. If you offer up Noah, Toronto agrees to it. And then you see just how much Bosh wants to play in Miami, as in will he take 30 million less to do it when he could go to a big market with a good roster. Had they done that and Bosh said no, i'd rather play with Wade in Miami, then they did everything they could. But they didn't, so we can't say that.

 

And you're right WWW was supposedly the man pulling the strings. But LeBron has a lot of people around him, that's why he calls them "his team". To put all of your trust in one guy like that, no matter how powerful he supposedly is, is very naive.

[sircaffey]

If the Bulls didn't offer up Noah, they didn't do everything they could. If you offer up Noah, Toronto agrees to it. And then you see just how much Bosh wants to play in Miami, as in will he take 30 million less to do it when he could go to a big market with a good roster. Had they done that and Bosh said no, i'd rather play with Wade in Miami, then they did everything they could. But they didn't, so we can't say that.

How can you possibly know this?

[whitesoxfan101]

Yep. ON the other hand...what the hell do you do with 30 mill in cap space. I kind of wish we had our best defensive guard back.

 

I still think getting rid of Hinrich's deal is the one good thing that's happened here (although dumping him for literally nothing looks awfully dumb right now).

 

How can you possibly know this?

 

KC Johnson, one of the few people that actually appears to know what he's saying, has said it all along. If it comes out that Noah was actually offered, I'll retract what I'm saying and cut the Bulls more slack on what happened with Bosh and thus Wade. But since it seems pretty clear he wasn't, I'm not thinking that'll happen.

Edited July 7, 2010 by whitesoxfan101

[Jenksismyhero]

If you're the Bulls, you offer Noah to the Raptors in a sign and trade from the beginning. You had to acquire him to not only avoid coming up empty, but also make Wade make a decision. That is entirely on the Bulls, end of story. If Wade and Bosh were so tied together, make them prove how tied together they were.

 

And getting snuggy with WWW is nice, but every other person surrounded by LeBron is a friend who benefits from him staying in Cleveland (which is why it'd make sense if he stays there). You can't put all of your trust into one guy like that, or you risk looking like an idiot as the Bulls now do.

 

Regardless of the fact that you don't know what the Bulls did or didn't do, who gives a s*** if the Bulls offered this and Toronto accepted? You're completely ignoring the fact that it was Bosh's decision and he never made it. Toronto had a deal lined up with the Cavs but Bosh said no.

[SoxFan562004]

Bulls had no choice but to blow it up and hope for a marquee guy, there's nothing worse in the NBA than being mediocre and constantly getting a 5-8 seed, basically your players are just good enough to eat up the cap and you have no chance of getting a high draft pick. With Kirk and #17 the team would be mediocre for years unless Rose and Noah take a MAJOR step.

 

Honestly, at this point I would rather them not force a sign and be a bad team and see what shakes out, no point in being behind Mia, Orlando, Cle (if LBJ stays) because they could never beat any of them in the playoffs. Not the best scenario, but a better one than being stuck in the middle.

 

[whitesoxfan101]

Regardless of the fact that you don't know what the Bulls did or didn't do, who gives a s*** if the Bulls offered this and Toronto accepted? You're completely ignoring the fact that it was Bosh's decision and he never made it. Toronto had a deal lined up with the Cavs but Bosh said no.

 

And had they had a deal lined up with Chicago and Bosh said no, we'd have heard about it and I'd be a lot more willing to listen to the "oh, the poor Bulls did everything they could here and just came up empty" sympathy angle.

Edited July 7, 2010 by whitesoxfan101

[HuskyCaucasian]

Well, it was fun while it lasted. Steve, I'll FedEx you some beer. Go drink.

[BigSqwert]

So what does next year's free agent class look like?

[scenario]

Well... one positive side consequence for us of clearing so much cap space is that it provides us flexibility for trades (taking on contracts other teams would like to move).

 

Could work out to help pick off somebody fairly reasonably.

 

So, we're not just stuck giving max deals to with whoever is left out there as free agents.

Edited July 7, 2010 by scenario

[whitesoxfan101]

Bulls had no choice but to blow it up and hope for a marquee guy, there's nothing worse in the NBA than being mediocre and constantly getting a 5-8 seed, basically your players are just good enough to eat up the cap and you have no chance of getting a high draft pick. With Kirk and #17 the team would be mediocre for years unless Rose and Noah take a MAJOR step.

 

Honestly, at this point I would rather them not force a sign and be a bad team and see what shakes out, no point in being behind Mia, Orlando, Cle (if LBJ stays) because they could never beat any of them in the playoffs. Not the best scenario, but a better one than being stuck in the middle.

 

Well if you use a bunch of money to sign Boozer or Lee, you're stuck firmly in the NBA mediocre 5-8 seed range in the east position. I agree the Bulls had no choice but to blow it up and hope for a marquee guy, and you're also right that you can't compound your failures with the big 3 by forcing a bad signing.

[sircaffey]

Bosh wanted to go to Miami and not Chicago. End of story.

[whitesoxfan101]

Well... one positive side consequence for us of clearing so much cap space is that it provides us flexibility for trades (taking on contracts other teams would like to move).

 

Could work out to help pick off somebody fairly reasonably.

 

So, we're not just stuck with whoever is left out there as free agents.

 

The problem with this is the teams that want to move those contracts want to move them for a reason.

[Jenksismyhero]

And had they had a deal lined up with Chicago and Bosh said no, we'd have heard about it and I'd be a lot more willing to listen to the "oh, the poor Bulls did everything they could here and just came up empty" sympathy angle.

 

You're complaining about something you (1) have no knowledge of and (2) is meaningless in the long run. It was Bosh's decision. I'm quite confident that the Bulls told Bosh they'd work something with Toronto to get him a s&t. Neither the Bulls nor Toronto has ever come out and said Noah was the sticking point.