NBA Offseason Thread

[Balta1701]

The Celtics got Garnett that year too. I don't remember anyone talking about him being a defensive genius when he was with the Knicks and Rockets.

I just went through the defensive metric stats at basketball-reference.com.

 

Out of the Knicks, the Rockets, and the Celtics, the worst a team with Thibodeau as its defensive coach has ever finished in "Defensive rating" is 6th. Every year he was coaching for a team, that team has been top 6 in defense or better.

 

I vividly remember people talking about Van Gundy and his staff being defensive wizards with the Rockets. Just didn't know Tom's name at the time.

[fathom]

Celtics signing Josh Howard would be a nice step in their quest to become the most unlikeable team in history.

[whitesoxfan101]

Celtics signing Josh Howard would be a nice step in their quest to become the most unlikeable team in history.

 

They'd need to sign satan to be more unlikeable than the Heat.

Edited July 12, 2010 by whitesoxfan101

[kev211]

Celtics signing Josh Howard would be a nice step in their quest to become the most unlikeable team in history.

Ya I think they heat have that locked up for awhile.

[bmags]

I think another edition of: why the heat will be awesome

 

is that teams with great players tend to make pretty avg. players look much better than they are. Pretty much every guy in the NBA can just hit a shot unguarded. What makes these players so special is their ability to hit extraordinary shots with dudes bumping and putting their hands in their face. But when you have 3 great scorers on the floor at the same time, you are going to get a lot of great looks because teams just can't focus you.

[Chisoxfn]

I really think Redick is actually on the upswing. He'll be a real nice asset, imo. Does he make us a championship team, no, but he makes us better and gives us an even better shot at being a top 3/4 team in the East.

[bmags]

I really think Redick is actually on the upswing. He'll be a real nice asset, imo. Does he make us a championship team, no, but he makes us better and gives us an even better shot at being a top 3/4 team in the East.

 

Dan bernstein was reading the vegas odds on the bulls on friday and they were shockingly good. It sucks that adding a 20/10 player and 2 sharp shooters to your team still feels so empty. F the NBA

[ZoomSlowik]

I just went through the defensive metric stats at basketball-reference.com.

 

Out of the Knicks, the Rockets, and the Celtics, the worst a team with Thibodeau as its defensive coach has ever finished in "Defensive rating" is 6th. Every year he was coaching for a team, that team has been top 6 in defense or better.

 

I vividly remember people talking about Van Gundy and his staff being defensive wizards with the Rockets. Just didn't know Tom's name at the time.

 

 

And look at the guys that were on those teams. The Celtics had Garnett, one of the best defensive players of the last 15 years, the Knicks had guys like Ewing, Oakley, Camby and Kurt Thomas, all of whom were damn good interior defenders (not to mention the Knicks led the league in defensive efficiency the 3 years before he got there), and the Rockets had Yao, who is in the top-10 in active career defensive rating and around the top-30 in defensive win shares even with all of the injuries (admittedly the Rockets work is a bit more impressive).

 

There's no question he'll help, but you need more than just Noah to be an elite defensive team.

Edited July 12, 2010 by ZoomSlowik

[chw42]

Thibs gets Boozer and Noah, both were leaders in defensive rating last year. Noah 9th, Boozer 16th.

[chw42]

J.J. Redick was second in offensive rating last year at 123...holy crap.

[Palehosefan]

Haslem sticking with Heat, Fisher sticking with LA.

[ZoomSlowik]

Thibs gets Boozer and Noah, both were leaders in defensive rating last year. Noah 9th, Boozer 16th.

 

I assume that number for Boozer is heavily influenced by his rebounding. The Jazz defense was almost 6 points WORSE per 100 possessions with him on the floor. That's not a new phenomena either as it was +5 the year before and +6 again the year before that (+ meaning they allowed more points per 100).

Edited July 12, 2010 by ZoomSlowik

[DBAHO]

People are speculating in Orlando that Otis Smith may still match the Redick offer.

 

Q-Rich is getting the remainder of the MLE (the rest was given to Duhon) and he'll be starting at SF for us next season in place of Matt Barnes.

 

That gives us 3 options at the wing spots now in Carter, Q-Rich and Pietrus, and that could still be 4 if Redick is kept.

 

Nothing really surprises me with Otis these days, I thought there was no chance we matched Gortat's offer from Dallas last off-season and he did, so the same could still happen here.

 

If we do that, then we'll be paying a LOT of tax this season, but we've got VC's expiring deal of about $16M to come off the books 1 season from now also.

[chw42]

I assume that number for Boozer is heavily influenced by his rebounding. The Jazz defense was almost 6 points WORSE per 100 possessions with him on the floor.

 

Probably and Boozer's previous defensive ratings were never this good, he got close a couple of times though. Boozer's not as bad as some people thing he is though.

[chw42]

People are speculating in Orlando that Otis Smith may still match the Redick offer.

 

Q-Rich is getting the remainder of the MLE (the rest was given to Duhon) and he'll be starting at SF for us next season in place of Matt Barnes.

 

That gives us 3 options at the wing spots now in Carter, Q-Rich and Pietrus, and that could still be 4 if Redick is kept.

 

Nothing really surprises me with Otis these days, I thought there was no chance we matched Gortat's offer from Dallas last off-season and he did, so the same could still happen here.

 

If we do that, then we'll be paying a LOT of tax this season, but we've got VC's expiring deal of about $16M to come off the books 1 season from now also.

 

How much would they have to pay Redick if they matched?

[bmags]

And look at the guys that were on those teams. The Celtics had Garnett, one of the best defensive players of the last 15 years, the Knicks had guys like Ewing, Oakley, Camby and Kurt Thomas, all of whom were damn good interior defenders (not to mention the Knicks led the league in defensive efficiency the 3 years before he got there), and the Rockets had Yao, who is in the top-10 in active career defensive rating and around the top-30 in defensive win shares even with all of the injuries (admittedly the Rockets work is a bit more impressive).

 

There's no question he'll help, but you need more than just Noah to be an elite defensive team.

 

so you can list one person on other teams as the sole reason that team was good on defense, but then you list one person on the bulls team (who is a great defender) and qualify it saying that's not enough. Maybe in Thibs years working with great defenders, he learned how to get the most of that talent. Because frankly, there is more to the celts great d than garnett.

[DBAHO]

How much would they have to pay Redick if they matched?

It's 20/3 IIRC. Some of that is front-loaded I think (something similar to what Portland offered Paul Millsap before he re-signed with Utah).

[ZoomSlowik]

so you can list one person on other teams as the sole reason that team was good on defense, but then you list one person on the bulls team (who is a great defender) and qualify it saying that's not enough. Maybe in Thibs years working with great defenders, he learned how to get the most of that talent. Because frankly, there is more to the celts great d than garnett.

 

I listed like 4 other plus defenders for the Celtics in a previous post and four different elite interior defensive big men during his 7 years with the Knicks. Neither of those teams were starting three average or worse defenders like the Bulls will.

[Quin]

I think the Heat will burst out the gates for what its worth, but one thing is overlooked.

 

Every team is going to step up their game and intensity against the Heat. It'll be hard for the Heat to keep the intensity up all year without injuries.

 

I really hope Otis Smith doesn't match for Redick, I actually like this roster a roster where we resign Brad, Law, and look at Bouldin, Byars, Richard, and Alexander (even though Alexander has mysteriously disappeared from the Summer League roster):

 

PG: Rose - Law - Bouldin

SG: Redick - Korver - Byars

SF: Deng - Johnson - Alexander

PF: Boozer - Gibson - Richard

C: Noah - Asik - Brad

 

That's assuming you can get Bouldin, Byars, Alexander, and Richard on min. contracts, which you should

 

Brad would be the Lindsey Hunter type tutor (that can still play somewhat) for Noah, Gibson, and Asik, Law showed some good stuff in his 2 starts last year, while BBAR would all be there for mop up duty or to surprise us.

[ZoomSlowik]

It's 20/3 IIRC. Some of that is front-loaded I think (something similar to what Portland offered Paul Millsap before he re-signed with Utah).

 

I think you're missing the point a bit. It's not just the salary, they're so far over the luxury tax threshold that they'd be paying the league another $7 mil to the league. It'd essentially cost them $14 mil to keep Redick, which is pretty nuts if you ask me.

[whitesoxfan101]

I am a little late to this party, but I don't know how anybody could ever determine Dwyane Wade is a good defender. He is to basketball defense what the guy who makes a bunch of diving catches but has no range is to baseball defense. He does a lot of stuff that looks spectacular, but overall he's not good at it.

[DBAHO]

I think you're missing the point a bit. It's not just the salary, they're so far over the luxury tax threshold that they'd be paying the league another $7 mil to the league. It'd essentially cost them $14 mil to keep Redick, which is pretty nuts if you ask me.

Yeah I know the luxury tax implications, but I was just explaining what the actual contract was.

 

Rich Devos is getting really old and really wants to see a championship. So in that sense, it wouldn't surprise me if we matched it.

 

You have to remember with the Magic moving into a brand new building, they'll be generating more revenue going forward as well.

[SoxAce]

It'd essentially cost them $14 mil to keep Redick, which is pretty nuts if you ask me.

 

Wouldn't surprise me with the Magic owner. He might be a billionaire, but he's handed out alot of terrible contracts in his tenure (and made alot of dumb decisions). I think he would be an idiot to match Redick who would be a bench player on his team. (I thought 14 million, but now I'm hearing it will be more around 17 million) But then again, I thought Gortat was gone and he had me left scratching my head there too.

 

Yeah I know the luxury tax implications, but I was just explaining what the actual contract was.

 

Rich Devos is getting really old and really wants to see a championship. So in that sense, it wouldn't surprise me if we matched it.

 

You have to remember with the Magic moving into a brand new building, they'll be generating more revenue going forward as well.

 

Thing is, how much can you be confident in? Teams like Miami, Chicago, Milwaukee, etc.. have seriously improved and you still have teams like the Lakers, Celtics, etc.. who will be the same (and are still better than Orlando) and up and commers like the Thunder, Philly etc.. on the rise.

Edited July 12, 2010 by SoxAce

[DBAHO]

The Bulls are working out Adam Morrison in Vegas tomorrow also apparently via Alex Kennedy.

[ZoomSlowik]

Wouldn't surprise me with the Magic owner. He might be a billionaire, but he's handed out alot of terrible contracts in his tenure (and made alot of dumb decisions). I think he would be an idiot to match Redick who would be a bench player on his team. (I thought 14 million, but now I'm hearing it will be more around 17 million) But then again, I thought Gortat was gone and he had me left scratching my head there too.

 

You've got a point there, that one still baffles me.