Beckham needs to be sent down

[BigSqwert]

I don't know if the Sox broadcast showed it, but the Braves broadcast followed him into the dugout, and man he looked despondent. Threw his gum across the dugout, sat down looking pissed, etc.

I know an overwhelming majority of us in here "know" he'll eventually turn it around but what makes us so sure that he ever will?

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Yeah, but the question in terms of going for it is...what does KW have that he's willing to give up?

 

I still think trading any of Flowers, Viciedo, Morel, or Hudson is basically suicide for next year since by my count we have 10 open roster spots for next year and only about $10 million or so available for free agency. Out of those, I think Morel is the most tradeable...but that means you're comfortable with Teahen at 3b for the remainder of his contract.

Well I don't think the Sox would have to part with any of those guys to land a Ryan Spilborghs or a Reed Johnson for example. Improving over Juan Pierre's offense isn't exactly the toughest thing in the world to do.

 

I've been 100% pro-trade Morel in the past, but now I'd like to hang on to him at least until we can find an MLB solution. As for the other guys, I'd deal any one of them for the right bat. We probably wouldn't be able to land that right bat, but if a Flowers deal gets you Dunn then you wake up and do it. He's a guy we could probably extend too. But keep Hudson and Viciedo if you can IMO.

Edited June 23, 2010 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[Balta1701]

but if a Flowers deal gets you Dunn then you wake up and do it.

If I were the Nats, I wouldn't do that deal, not when Dunn is going to get me 2 draft picks for walking.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

If I were the Nats, I wouldn't do that deal, not when Dunn is going to get me 2 draft picks for walking.

Those picks are also far away though. And Dunn isn't an elite player all-around, he's just a great hitter, so he's not going to price himself into pure contender range. The Nats could very easily end up with a supplemental first plus a second rounder, and then if they want someone nice there they'll have to pony up the cash. Flowers is close to being ready now and he's owed no bonus. If the Sox throw in an arm or two with upside - yeah, that's the kind of deal they'd want IMO.

[Greg Hibbard]

I know an overwhelming majority of us in here "know" he'll eventually turn it around but what makes us so sure that he ever will?

 

I'm certain "Slappy" Caruso will get alluded to a lot in the next three months, but Gordon has a bit more going for him than 27 infield singles, or whatever it was. His offensive game is pretty versatile and should respond well to rebuilding, provided he has the mental makeup to withstand this sort of thing. I still believe he'll eventually turn it around, but maybe not this year.

 

 

[caulfield12]

If you trade Flowers, are we really sure we want to take a chance with AJ for one more season at his age, and at that salary range?

 

I just think you have to get solid contributions from Dayan, Beckham, Quentin, Hudson and Flowers for us to have any chance in 2011 and beyond. Maybe we can afford one failure out of those five, but that's about all the breathing room we have with the Twins really starting to get contributions on a consistent basis from Delmon Young finally.

 

I just doesn't see Ozzie and KW going away from Pierre at this point...unless someone amazing comes on the market that's totally unexpected.

 

Dunn would be great as the DH, as long as he doesn't play OF (as many have mentioned), but is he worth Flowers and Hudson for a half-season rental? I guess it depends on what we can do with those draft picks and how much we're willing to spend, but we can't wait 2-3 more years to find a catching replacement, Gonzalez and Phegley are far, far away and Donny Lucy is quickly disappearing in the rearview mirror.

[caulfield12]

Well I don't think the Sox would have to part with any of those guys to land a Ryan Spilborghs or a Reed Johnson for example. Improving over Juan Pierre's offense isn't exactly the toughest thing in the world to do.

 

I've been 100% pro-trade Morel in the past, but now I'd like to hang on to him at least until we can find an MLB solution. As for the other guys, I'd deal any one of them for the right bat. We probably wouldn't be able to land that right bat, but if a Flowers deal gets you Dunn then you wake up and do it. He's a guy we could probably extend too. But keep Hudson and Viciedo if you can IMO.

 

 

Then who's going to hit leadoff? Reed Johnson? In the AL? That's a clear improvement?

 

I just don't think that Morel is worth that much to very many teams....he's struggling mightily in AAA, and what's his OPS upside in the majors, around 725-750? Unless he plays near Gold Glove defense, he just doesn't have enough pop to play everyday at USCF.

 

We already have Juan Pierre, Teahen and Vizquel with limited power, I can't imagine adding another corner spot with someone whose upside at the next level is 8-12 homers.

Edited June 23, 2010 by caulfield12

[witesoxfan]

If you trade Flowers, are we really sure we want to take a chance with AJ for one more season at his age, and at that salary range?

 

I just think you have to get solid contributions from Dayan, Beckham, Quentin, Hudson and Flowers for us to have any chance in 2011 and beyond. Maybe we can afford one failure out of those five, but that's about all the breathing room we have with the Twins really starting to get contributions on a consistent basis from Delmon Young finally.

 

I just doesn't see Ozzie and KW going away from Pierre at this point...unless someone amazing comes on the market that's totally unexpected.

 

Dunn would be great as the DH, as long as he doesn't play OF (as many have mentioned), but is he worth Flowers and Hudson for a half-season rental? I guess it depends on what we can do with those draft picks and how much we're willing to spend, but we can't wait 2-3 more years to find a catching replacement, Gonzalez and Phegley are far, far away and Donny Lucy is quickly disappearing in the rearview mirror.

 

I don't think the Sox have any visions of dealing Hudson whatsoever.

[Greg Hibbard]

If you trade Flowers, are we really sure we want to take a chance with AJ for one more season at his age, and at that salary range?

 

I just think you have to get solid contributions from Dayan, Beckham, Quentin, Hudson and Flowers for us to have any chance in 2011 and beyond.

 

Konerko might take a short term deal at a reasonable rate.

[WhiteSoxfan1986]

Flowers is the last guy I want to deal.

[Controlled Chaos]

I know an overwhelming majority of us in here "know" he'll eventually turn it around but what makes us so sure that he ever will?

He's a ballplayer. It's probably the 1st time he has really struggled in his life. He's trying different things and thinking different things. There are no guarantees in life, but I'm pretty dam confident that this kid will get back to his normal self.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Then who's going to hit leadoff? Reed Johnson? In the AL? That's a clear improvement?

 

I just don't think that Morel is worth that much to very many teams....he's struggling mightily in AAA, and what's his OPS upside in the majors, around 725-750? Unless he plays near Gold Glove defense, he just doesn't have enough pop to play everyday at USCF.

 

We already have Juan Pierre, Teahen and Vizquel with limited power, I can't imagine adding another corner spot with someone whose upside at the next level is 8-12 homers.

The point was simply that upgrading over Pierre wouldn't necessarily cost us our best prospects. I just threw out 2 guys off the top of my head who presumably would be available for next to nothing and are currently having better seasons than Pierre is.

 

But anyway, the main thing we need is a big bat. We can put it in the field if he's good enough to play there or we can put him at DH. But that's the main thing we need, and after that we can tweak a bit here and there if we need to.

[Balta1701]

Konerko might take a short term deal at a reasonable rate.

I have no doubt he would...problem is...if we're coming at this offseason with somewhere in the range of $12 million available to spend and 10 slots to fill, a reasonable rate for Konerko might be in the $7 million/year range...so you've pretty much left yourself nothing to fill any of your other slots.

 

Which means...you could really use having Flowers, Hudson, and Viciedo available next year.

[greg775]

I'm at the point I expect to see 0-for-4 in the box score for Beckham and 1-4 is a mild pleasant surprise.

He's been that bad.

At least he's working on his defense at a new position in the big leagues during his season from hell. He seems pretty decent at second in the games I've watched.

[thxfrthmmrs]

hello brian anderson, joe borchard, josh fields.

 

who was the last Sox first round pick to come through their farm system and have success in the majors? can't think of any recent ones

 

if they don't send beckham down soon, I am afraid we will see his name in that infamous group soon.

[WCSox]

Beckham needs to work with a different hitting instructor. He's not getting anything out of Walker.

 

[Kalapse]

hello brian anderson, joe borchard, josh fields.

 

who was the last Sox first round pick to come through their farm system and have success in the majors? can't think of any recent ones

 

if they don't send beckham down soon, I am afraid we will see his name in that infamous group soon.

Gio Gonzalez - supplemental pick of the White Sox in 2004 having a very nice season for the A's. That's about it dating back to Kip Wells and Aaron Rowand in 1998.

[Brian]

Buerhle

[witesoxfan]

Buerhle

 

Buehrle wasn't a 1st round pick.

[Quin]

Buehrle wasn't a 1st round pick.

 

Buehrle wasn't a first 37 rounds pick.

[soxrwhite]

It isn't about Beckham it is about the Sox. Vizquel should play second and bat second. That gives us our best chance.

[Chi Town Sox]

hello brian anderson, joe borchard, josh fields.

 

who was the last Sox first round pick to come through their farm system and have success in the majors? can't think of any recent ones

 

if they don't send beckham down soon, I am afraid we will see his name in that infamous group soon.

 

I understand what you mean but none of those players ever batted higher than .244 in a season. Gordon has almost had more success in one 3/5 of a year (last year) than those guys had in all of their careers combined. He'll come around

Edited June 23, 2010 by Chi Town Sox

[Balta1701]

I understand what you mean but none of those players ever batted higher than .244 in a season. Gordon has almost had more success in one 3/5 of a year (last year) than those guys had in all of their careers combined. He'll come around

You're putting that much on batting average? Josh Fields hit 23 HR in 373 at bats as a rookie.

[thxfrthmmrs]

Gio Gonzalez - supplemental pick of the White Sox in 2004 having a very nice season for the A's. That's about it dating back to Kip Wells and Aaron Rowand in 1998.

 

 

his numbers prior to this season was beyond terrible. Besides, I was more or less talking about a first round pick position players having success coming from a white sox farm system, gio has gone to the phillies and to the A's before reaching the majors.

 

yes, beckham did have the highest batting average of all the recent sox first rounder last season, but that is his calling card. Fields had 23 hrs in 2007 and became totally irrelevant next season. We may be witnessing the same thing with becks now, and if he doesn't get demoted soon, it's really going to affect his success from now on.

Edited June 23, 2010 by thxfrthmmrs

[soxrwhite]

This kid is killing us. Two balls off his glove tonight, a strike out, a tapper back to the mound, and a swing and a miss on a hit and run. Back under the Mendoza line for his batting average? I've said it before the big leagues are not a training ground. This kid is over matched. The league figured him out the last month of last season. We need him on the bench or in AA! All you defenders must have some kind of crush on him. Be realistic. We have a chance to win this division, this is not the time to develope potential, but play your best nine. He is not ( at least right now ) one of them.