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Chris Sale signs for a bargain; expected in majors this year


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QUOTE (He_Gawn @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 08:15 AM)
Arguing over a pitchers arm motion is pointless because throwing a baseball is not a regular body motion. So really any pitcher could be gone in five years.

 

An evolution biologist will argue your first statement. As bipedal beings we are designed to walk on two legs and use our arms for overhead activities. :)

 

The bolded is true. However, there are certain biomechanical principles which will decrease the stress on the upper extremity that will decrease the possibility of this happening.

Edited by ptatc
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QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 09:34 AM)
And he blew it and cost the Sox some wins? Eh... I still say I don't wanna ruin Sale's growth. Maybe they should try Threets first.

I can't believe Threets hasn't been called up already. He's been pitching very well in AAA since he got off the DL. I haven't seen a scouting report on him since he joined the Sox, but supposedly he used to throw in the upper 90's.

 

What makes it even more frustrating is that Randy Williams is 34 years old. Why the Sox are treating a journeyman like a rookie going through growing pains blows my mind. He should of had a short leash coming into the season and he's definitely made it clear he's not a major league pitcher.

 

Might as well see what Threets has to offer.

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Great work by KW and everyone involved in the drafting process to get this one done.

 

Adding Sale to our pen would certainly give Ozzie a lot of high velocity arms in there to choose from.

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QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 10:42 AM)
It's gotta suck to be only pulling in $400k when some of your teamates are making almost $15 million per year.

 

Wait... I forgot to use the green text for that.

 

I'll take $400,000 to play baseball. Hell, I'd take $100,000 or $75,000.

Edited by JPN366
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QUOTE (JPN366 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 09:56 AM)
The question is, do the White Sox really want to go the Andrew Miller route with Sale? I just saw Miller pitch the other day for Florida's AA team.

I don't think Miller had the command that Sale does and ultimately I think it is the command that has more or less done Miller in. However, there is no denying that they rushed Miller up and didn't allow him to develop and make the necessary adjustments to try and improve his command at the minor league level.

 

I don't get the feeling that the Sox are doing this with Sale as they just feel he is flat out more advanced and capable. My big concern is by us utilizing him as a reliever so early, there is a chance we stunt the growth and development of some of the secondary pitches needed for him to excel in the rotation.

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QUOTE (JPN366 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 05:56 PM)
The question is, do the White Sox really want to go the Andrew Miller route with Sale? I just saw Miller pitch the other day for Florida's AA team.

Miller never had the command. That's the difference between the two. As a junior, Miller had a 2.92 BB/9. Sale's? 1.22 BB/9.

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QUOTE (Ozzie Ball @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 12:05 PM)
Miller never had the command. That's the difference between the two. As a junior, Miller had a 2.92 BB/9. Sale's? 1.22 BB/9.

 

I think Miller wowed people with his gas at North Carolina, if I remember correctly. Didn't know his BB rate was so bad though.

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QUOTE (JPN366 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 10:07 AM)
I think Miller wowed people with his gas at North Carolina, if I remember correctly. Didn't know his BB rate was so bad though.

Ya. And his college world series performance also added to his hype. Not that it really impacted his draft status, but the guy was tall with a huge arm and it worked well in college. But at the professional level he had adjustments to make and never really was able to. You could argue that rushing him impacted his ability to do such, but who knows.

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QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 12:02 PM)
I don't think Miller had the command that Sale does and ultimately I think it is the command that has more or less done Miller in. However, there is no denying that they rushed Miller up and didn't allow him to develop and make the necessary adjustments to try and improve his command at the minor league level.

 

I don't get the feeling that the Sox are doing this with Sale as they just feel he is flat out more advanced and capable. My big concern is by us utilizing him as a reliever so early, there is a chance we stunt the growth and development of some of the secondary pitches needed for him to excel in the rotation.

 

I would too but he is coming off of a full college season so the ending of this year is to get his feet wet. He can go back to starting next spring

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QUOTE (He_Gawn @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 08:15 AM)
Arguing over a pitchers arm motion is pointless because throwing a baseball is not a regular body motion. So really any pitcher could be gone in five years.

Every human is different when it comes to durability. So, in the end, it's always a guess.

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QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 01:52 PM)
IMO, Flowers is only on the cusp of flameout. 73Ks in 54 games and batting .215 in AAA

He spent the month of May tinkering with his swing and hit .122 in May. In April, he hit .323 with a 1.045 OPS. In June, he's hitting .234 with a .929 OPS.

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QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 01:58 PM)
ahh ok. that June number isnt too hot though

Very true, but the power and the walks are still there.

 

I think, looking at his stats, the difference between him being useful and useless is going to be whether he's a 25 HR guy in the big leagues or a 40+ home run guy. With his strikeout rate, if he's hitting 40+ home runs, he's still taking walks and has a high OPS, so he's basically the catching version of Mark Reynolds, and his HR will carry his batting average. If he's only hitting 20-25 home runs, he's striking out so much that he'll be hitting in the low .200's and he'll look like Nick Swisher did when he was with us.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 01:17 PM)
Very true, but the power and the walks are still there.

 

I think, looking at his stats, the difference between him being useful and useless is going to be whether he's a 25 HR guy in the big leagues or a 40+ home run guy. With his strikeout rate, if he's hitting 40+ home runs, he's still taking walks and has a high OPS, so he's basically the catching version of Mark Reynolds, and his HR will carry his batting average. If he's only hitting 20-25 home runs, he's striking out so much that he'll be hitting in the low .200's and he'll look like Nick Swisher did when he was with us.

those are my thoughts as well.

 

ok, now back to Sale....

:)

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 01:17 PM)
Very true, but the power and the walks are still there.

 

I think, looking at his stats, the difference between him being useful and useless is going to be whether he's a 25 HR guy in the big leagues or a 40+ home run guy. With his strikeout rate, if he's hitting 40+ home runs, he's still taking walks and has a high OPS, so he's basically the catching version of Mark Reynolds, and his HR will carry his batting average. If he's only hitting 20-25 home runs, he's striking out so much that he'll be hitting in the low .200's and he'll look like Nick Swisher did when he was with us.

 

Yeah, but he should be doing it as a catcher, as long as he's good enough defensively. If he can put up a .219/.332/.410/.743 from behind the plate, you take it and run with it. The problem with Swisher was that Ozzie apparently didn't trust him in CF, didn't trust him in the leadoff spot, and then didn't trust him to even start games towards the end of the year. When someone's confidence is that shoddy, they're bound to fail.

 

If Flowers can put up .230/.330/.430 in his first couple years in the league, I'll gladly take that, simply because it's solid production from a catcher and Flowers has room to do much more than just that.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 12:17 PM)
Very true, but the power and the walks are still there.

 

I think, looking at his stats, the difference between him being useful and useless is going to be whether he's a 25 HR guy in the big leagues or a 40+ home run guy. With his strikeout rate, if he's hitting 40+ home runs, he's still taking walks and has a high OPS, so he's basically the catching version of Mark Reynolds, and his HR will carry his batting average. If he's only hitting 20-25 home runs, he's striking out so much that he'll be hitting in the low .200's and he'll look like Nick Swisher did when he was with us.

Yeah, we don't want him to be John Buck or Miguel Olivo (although Olivo has one hell of a first half this year in Colorado).

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 21, 2010 -> 01:17 PM)
Very true, but the power and the walks are still there.

 

I think, looking at his stats, the difference between him being useful and useless is going to be whether he's a 25 HR guy in the big leagues or a 40+ home run guy. With his strikeout rate, if he's hitting 40+ home runs, he's still taking walks and has a high OPS, so he's basically the catching version of Mark Reynolds, and his HR will carry his batting average. If he's only hitting 20-25 home runs, he's striking out so much that he'll be hitting in the low .200's and he'll look like Nick Swisher did when he was with us.

Hes not going to be a 40 hr guy, especially at C. There are very few 40 hr guys these days.

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