Is this just a coincidence?

[Balta1701]

I would like to see any information regarding how the soil makes the crops less nutritionally dense. The minerals in the soil will allow the crops to grow properly or not. So they can either be harvested or not. The nutritional value of the crop is in the intrinsic value of the given crop and not what it brings in from the soil, that is primarily for growth. With the catle, there is no feedcorn the has empty calories. The corn will either be heathy enough to harvest and contain the nutrients or it won't be harvested because no one will buy it.

Here's a summary study I found by googling. I can send a pdf if you'd like. There's a number of things that affect it. Heavy production using fertilizers and GM crops that grow faster appear to dilute the amount of nutrients that can be taken up during the lifecycle. Artificial selection in favor of more carbohydrate rich seeds produces plants that grow with greater sugar content, but other nutrients aren't selected for and thus aren't going along. Other industrial techniques, like early harvesting and factory preservation of vegetables, similarly cut the nutrient content.

[Jenksismyhero]

And what's a 5 minute sack lunch going to wind up being? It's going to wind up being a sandwich of some sort, maybe wheat bread if we're lucky, sugar/HFCS loaded peanut butter, sugar/HFCS loaded jelly, and a piece of fruit that has half the nutritional value that it did 20 years ago. Oh, and a pudding cup or something like that for dessert.

 

We haven't become a lazy country. We've become a country that you have to work like a dog just to be able to afford to pay the interest on your credit card bill that you've got left over from the time you were laid off or got sick without health insurance. So you make due as well as you can.

 

And can we please stop pretending that a cell phone isn't basically a mandatory thing to get by in today's society yet?

 

I think you can make your kid a pretty healthy meal if you take the effort to do so. Just because it's tough or takes some extra time out of your day isn't an excuse. It's pretty damn difficult to go to college and get a job. Guess i'll just complain about it and expect the rest of society to provide for me. Nor is it an excuse that those foods are less nutritious. An apple that might be less nutritious than an apple 50 years ago, but it's still more nutritious than a pudding cup.

 

And we haven't become more lazy? Are you kidding? As a whole we're a bunch of zombies that sit on couches, watch tv and shove processed foods into our mouths. Compare a child's activities on a typical day in the past to today. I see it with all of the kids under 10 that I know. They'd rather sit on a couch in the AC playing a video game than out and about exploring their world and running around. We're insanely more lazy as a whole.

 

And I agree that we're worked like dogs compared to past generations, but how can you discount the fact that "middle class" now encompasses more and more "things" that aren't requirements, but instead are choices? A cell phone IS a choice. There's absolutely no need for one except pure convenience. If you absolutely NEED one, it's for business purposes, that's it. Why is it mandatory? It's no more mandatory than the internet, which is a great luxury, but isn't necessary to function.

Edited July 14, 2010 by Jenksismybitch

[ptatc]

Here's a summary study I found by googling. I can send a pdf if you'd like. There's a number of things that affect it. Heavy production using fertilizers and GM crops that grow faster appear to dilute the amount of nutrients that can be taken up during the lifecycle. Artificial selection in favor of more carbohydrate rich seeds produces plants that grow with greater sugar content, but other nutrients aren't selected for and thus aren't going along. Other industrial techniques, like early harvesting and factory preservation of vegetables, similarly cut the nutrient content.

 

Yes, please send me the pdf. I can't get enough of the information from the abstract. If you have more research article I would appraciate seeing them as well. Being in research myself, I don't take any one study at face value.

Edited July 14, 2010 by ptatc

[Balta1701]

They'd rather sit on a couch in the AC

So, you're saying that something has changed regarding warming of the climate?

 

Anyway, if you're seriously going to argue to me that a cell phone isn't a basic necessity for both kids and adults these days, then really, I ought to get off your lawn. You're just not paying attention to the world. And Hell, at this point, a standard cell plan is often cheaper than a land line.

[Jenksismyhero]

So, you're saying that something has changed regarding warming of the climate?

 

Anyway, if you're seriously going to argue to me that a cell phone isn't a basic necessity for both kids and adults these days, then really, I ought to get off your lawn. You're just not paying attention to the world.

 

Because in the summer you need AC? Yeah, it was never hot and humid before humans ruined the Earth. GMAB.

 

I'm 28 and don't feel like a cell phone is all that necessary. I did without one as a kid and turned out just fine. I'm sure most of the people on the board did too. Why is it a basic necessity? It surely makes life more convenient, but you'd survive without one.

 

It's a wonder you think health care is a right! Might as well make tv/cable/cell phones/internet/computers/any piece of technology a right provided by the government too. It's just so hard to live without them!

Edited July 14, 2010 by Jenksismybitch

[Balta1701]

I love how your standard for arguing that poor people don't need cell phones is "What allows me to survive" and then you immediately jump to health care as another thing poor people don't need.

[Jenksismyhero]

I love how your standard for arguing that poor people don't need cell phones is "What allows me to survive" and then you immediately jump to health care as another thing poor people don't need.

 

I didn't say they don't need it. I said that you think it's a right, and I clearly don't. But it's not a wonder that you think health care is a right given that you apparently think cell phones are so necessary to function in this world.

 

Please explain why a cell phone is a necessity in life. So far your reasons are (1) because it's a necessity and (2) because I live under a rock.

[Balta1701]

I didn't say they don't need it. I said that you think it's a right, and I clearly don't. But it's not a wonder that you think health care is a right given that you apparently think cell phones are so necessary to function in this world.

 

Please explain why a cell phone is a necessity in life. So far your reasons are (1) because it's a necessity and (2) because I live under a rock.

 

I like how just about as many people consider a cell phone a necessity as AC.

 

it's also interesting to me to note that most other items declined substantially after the recession started, except for cell phones.

 

Like it or not, staying in touch is a necessity in this age. People use them while they're at school. People use them as a security measure. You simply cannot conduct business of any sort without a cell phone; they're vital in almost everything, right down to the service industry. You can't find a job without them often any more (let alone finding one without that internet access that you already told me poor people don't need).

[Jenksismyhero]

I think we're working on different definitions of "necessity."

[Jenksismyhero]

it's also interesting to me to note that most other items declined substantially after the recession started, except for cell phones.

 

Like it or not, staying in touch is a necessity in this age. People use them while they're at school. People use them as a security measure. You simply cannot conduct business of any sort without a cell phone; they're vital in almost everything, right down to the service industry. You can't find a job without them often any more (let alone finding one without that internet access that you already told me poor people don't need).

 

Are land lines no longer in existence?

 

I mean, come on. It's not enough that TV's are necessities according to this survey, but FLAT SCREEN tv's are as well. What a joke. And an Ipod? Dryer? AC?

 

I'll give you a car, for certain people, in certain locations. The rest are luxuries.

Edited July 14, 2010 by Jenksismybitch

[ChiSox_Sonix]

 

I like how just about as many people consider a cell phone a necessity as AC.

 

it's also interesting to me to note that most other items declined substantially after the recession started, except for cell phones.

 

Like it or not, staying in touch is a necessity in this age. People use them while they're at school. People use them as a security measure. You simply cannot conduct business of any sort without a cell phone; they're vital in almost everything, right down to the service industry. You can't find a job without them often any more (let alone finding one without that internet access that you already told me poor people don't need).

 

Oh come on Balta that poll is complete crap. I'm not disputing the results, but anyone who thinks owning a dishwasher or air conditioning (or the select few who voted for flat screen tv) is a necessity is out of their minds and must have some sort of sense of entitlement.

 

Cell phones are a luxury. Granted, they are one the more important ones to have IMO. Cellphones for 10 year old kids though? Hardly. I agree with a lot of those being almost necessary in today's society (internet, for example) but there are some absurd choices on that list. I mean come on.

[southsider2k5]

 

I like how just about as many people consider a cell phone a necessity as AC.

 

Peoples priorities are just f***ed up. Too bad they don't put the same emphasis on things that could actually do something good in their lives...

[bmags]

how much of a difference does "need to live" and "need to make a living" mean to you all?

 

All those jobs you can't walk to, cross them off, you don't need a car to live! only shelter water and sustenance.

Oh you're potential employers want to "reach you"? Haha, sure you lazy bastard!

Oh, right you need a "computer"? Not according to Laslow!

 

f***in bums.

[bmags]

also, cell phone plans are comparable to land lines, so who gives a f***. This isn't 1980.

[Balta1701]

I just love how it's totally ok for you guys to lecture everyone else on how they're wrong in all their financial choices as long as they're not wealthy.

[Balta1701]

also, cell phone plans are comparable to land lines, so who gives a f***. This isn't 1980.

If your income isn't $75,000 a year, you shouldn't need a phone line.

[Jenksismyhero]

Yeah, cuz it's SO awful to say that someone on welfare or on food stamps or who stuff their kids full of processed crap because they can't afford/spend the time on healthy food, walking around with a cell phone and watching TV on their 60 inch flat screen, doesn't have their priorities straight. God f***ing forbid our society has some sort of expectation of self-responsibility.

 

Life would just be easier if the government gave us everything! it's so hard to live life without a computer or cell phone or tv! The wealthy people have them, so I should have them too!! It's my right!!

[Balta1701]

Frankly, yeah, it is pretty awful of you to say that.

 

It's also worth noting that you can't defend your opinion that poor people don't need to make phone calls or use the computer without blaming the government.

 

I thought the whole point was to keep the government out of our lives! Except for where it decides when you're too poor to have a cell phone. That's ok.

[Jenksismyhero]

Frankly, yeah, it is pretty awful of you to say that.

 

It's also worth noting that you can't defend your opinion that poor people don't need to make phone calls or use the computer without blaming the government.

 

I thought the whole point was to keep the government out of our lives! Except for where it decides when you're too poor to have a cell phone. That's ok.

 

Why is that so awful? Because we should expect people to have some fundamental priorities in their lives, i.e., their health, their kids, their kids' health, and that those are more important than personal luxuries? Yeah, what an awful position to take.

 

What does that second point even mean? It's the government's fault that these people aren't provided phones or computers to use? Who said that? Is that a right I missed somewhere? That in the constitution? "We the people will provide every citizen of the United States every piece of technology deemed necessary by the masses?"

 

 

Ridiculous.

[bmags]

Yeah, cuz it's SO awful to say that someone on welfare or on food stamps or who stuff their kids full of processed crap because they can't afford/spend the time on healthy food, walking around with a cell phone and watching TV on their 60 inch flat screen, doesn't have their priorities straight. God f***ing forbid our society has some sort of expectation of self-responsibility.

 

Life would just be easier if the government gave us everything! it's so hard to live life without a computer or cell phone or tv! The wealthy people have them, so I should have them too!! It's my right!!

 

they stuff their kids full of processed fat because that's what is cheap. Now why is it cheap? Government. I love how when the government is legitimately into peoples lives you act like they aren't. If fruits and veggies were subsidized the same amount as meat and corn you'd see how much more "responsible" these peoples food choices get.

 

as for your hypothetical welfare person that you create to show why welfare people are all evil communiss lazy and hellbent on stealing your money, well, who cares. Enjoy it, it makes your life easier.

[Balta1701]

What does that second point even mean? It's the government's fault that these people aren't provided phones or computers to use? Who said that? Is that a right I missed somewhere? That in the constitution? "We the people will provide every citizen of the United States every piece of technology deemed necessary by the masses?"

No, it means that you're insisting the government ought to be saying "It's the right of the wealthy to decide that you can't buy these products." You're the one who started bashing the government on that issue.

[Jenksismyhero]

they stuff their kids full of processed fat because that's what is cheap. Now why is it cheap? Government. I love how when the government is legitimately into peoples lives you act like they aren't. If fruits and veggies were subsidized the same amount as meat and corn you'd see how much more "responsible" these peoples food choices get.

 

as for your hypothetical welfare person that you create to show why welfare people are all evil communiss lazy and hellbent on stealing your money, well, who cares. Enjoy it, it makes your life easier.

 

Are you kidding? Have you bought groceries recently? Produce is incredibly cheap. You can spend 20 bucks and get a weeks full of produce pretty easily. It has nothing to do with the government. They're not forcing people to buy certain products. Lazy people choose to buy the convenient, pre-packaged products. It has nothing to do with the price.

 

That person isn't hypothetical. It's a pretty good chunk of the welfare recipients I've seen and worked with. Got no job (or have a s***ty job), their food and housing is paid for, but they got cell phones and tv's and other "necessities" that get them through life.

[Balta1701]

That person isn't hypothetical. It's a pretty good chunk of the welfare recipients I've seen and worked with. Got no job (or have a s***ty job), their food and housing is paid for, but they got cell phones and tv's and other "necessities" that get them through life.

Yup. They should sit around in the dark thinking about how bad their life is!

[Jenksismyhero]

No, it means that you're insisting the government ought to be saying "It's the right of the wealthy to decide that you can't buy these products." You're the one who started bashing the government on that issue.

 

I did?

[Jenksismyhero]

Yup. They should sit around in the dark thinking about how bad their life is!

 

OR, they should get a job/better job so the government doesn't have to provide everything for them. Again, what an AWFUL expectation.

Edited July 14, 2010 by Jenksismybitch