Is this just a coincidence?

[bmags]

Where's the line? Where do you stop "subsidizing" things?

 

For the record, don't ...

 

answer the question. Why aren't you criticizing the people buying subsidized oil and causing us to lose leverage with dangerous "rogue" nations, causing people to die from air pollution and destroying industries in the gulf, when they could just be less lazy and pay a little more for cleaner energies, walk more or use public transit. This is choices, and these people are just lazy.

[Jenksismyhero]

answer the question. Why aren't you criticizing the people buying subsidized oil and causing us to lose leverage with dangerous "rogue" nations, causing people to die from air pollution and destroying industries in the gulf, when they could just be less lazy and pay a little more for cleaner energies, walk more or use public transit. This is choices, and these people are just lazy.

 

Having parents buy fruits and vegetables instead of Big Mac's is a little different than telling people to stop using their cars and start walking/using public transit (though those that can should be expected to I agree).

[Balta1701]

Having parents buy fruits and vegetables instead of Big Mac's is a little different than telling people to stop using their cars and start walking/using public transit (though those that can should be expected to I agree).

Really, no it isn't. Taking fruits and vegetables yourself and using them to prepare a meal takes a lot of time and effort. Going to McDonalds is a convenience. Taking public transit anywhere except NYC (to first order) takes a lot of effort, compared to walking outside and getting in your car.

[Jenksismyhero]

Really, no it isn't. Taking fruits and vegetables yourself and using them to prepare a meal takes a lot of time and effort. Going to McDonalds is a convenience. Taking public transit anywhere except NYC (to first order) takes a lot of effort, compared to walking outside and getting in your car.

 

And that's exactly my point - spending an extra 10 minutes a day on proper food choices/preperation versus rearranging your whole commute to and from work. One is a pretty simple alteration to your morning and shopping routine, the other is ranges from impossible (in non-metro areas) to completely impractical.

[Balta1701]

And that's exactly my point - spending an extra 10 minutes a day on proper food choices/preperation versus rearranging your whole commute to and from work. One is a pretty simple alteration to your morning and shopping routine, the other is ranges from impossible (in non-metro areas) to completely impractical.

10 minutes a day does not make a meal from most fresh items. Even Rachel Ray needs 3 times that amount.

[bmags]

you guys are also missing the point that in both cases the government has helped the consumer make a simple choice of taking the cheapest route to a meal.

[Balta1701]

you guys are also missing the point that in both cases the government has helped the consumer make a simple choice of taking the cheapest route to a meal.

I think the reality is we've got a combination of problems. Are there people who just go to McDonalds for their kids every night out of laziness? I'm sure there are. Would those people change their habits if you eliminated the corn subsidies and suddenly fast food and soda prices went upwards by 50% relative to fresh fruits? Some might, but a lot probably wouldn't. Are there people who are in 2 income, middle class families who simply don't have time to prepare a meal for their kids and who use those things as a fill-in? I'm sure there are from personal experience. If you raised the price on processed foods by 75%, would that make it that they suddenly have the time and ability to prepare a full meal? My guess is no, and I think that's a very, very common issue in this country.

[CrimsonWeltall]

Really, no it isn't. Taking fruits and vegetables yourself and using them to prepare a meal takes a lot of time and effort.

 

What are the prep times on apples, bananas, oranges, grapes, strawberries, blueberries, cherries? 10 seconds to wash them? There are plenty of vegetables that take less than 15 minutes to make.

 

 

 

 

 

[bmags]

I think the reality is we've got a combination of problems. Are there people who just go to McDonalds for their kids every night out of laziness? I'm sure there are. Would those people change their habits if you eliminated the corn subsidies and suddenly fast food and soda prices went upwards by 50% relative to fresh fruits? Some might, but a lot probably wouldn't. Are there people who are in 2 income, middle class families who simply don't have time to prepare a meal for their kids and who use those things as a fill-in? I'm sure there are from personal experience. If you raised the price on processed foods by 75%, would that make it that they suddenly have the time and ability to prepare a full meal? My guess is no, and I think that's a very, very common issue in this country.

 

what if you subsidized fruits and vegetables as much as you have meats and corn?

[Balta1701]

What are the prep times on apples, bananas, oranges, grapes, strawberries, blueberries, cherries? 10 seconds to wash them? There are plenty of vegetables that take less than 15 minutes to make.

As individual "boiled vegetable X", sure. As far as putting together a whole meal, for most people, it's 10 minutes for 1, 10 minutes for another, 10 minutes for another, then 20-30 minutes of cleanup/running the dishwasher/emptying the dishwasher.

[CrimsonWeltall]

As individual "boiled vegetable X", sure. As far as putting together a whole meal, for most people, it's 10 minutes for 1, 10 minutes for another, 10 minutes for another, then 20-30 minutes of cleanup/running the dishwasher/emptying the dishwasher.

 

I think your numbers are a bit inflated. You don't have to cook one ingredient at a time, things like a pot of simmering water don't require constant attention, you can accomplish other things while they're cooking, you don't have to run the dishwasher every night unless you're a huge family or have very few dishes, etc.

 

Yeah, it can take SOME work, but I think there's a lot of excuse-making too. If one can spare 15 minutes to drive to McDonalds and wait in the drive-through for a breakfast meal, they've got the time to pour a bowl of cereal and peel a banana.

[BigSqwert]

I think your numbers are a bit inflated. You don't have to cook one ingredient at a time, things like a pot of simmering water don't require constant attention, you can accomplish other things while they're cooking, you don't have to run the dishwasher every night unless you're a huge family or have very few dishes, etc.

 

Yeah, it can take SOME work, but I think there's a lot of excuse-making too. If one can spare 15 minutes to drive to McDonalds and wait in the drive-through for a breakfast meal, they've got the time to pour a bowl of cereal and peel a banana.

Coming from a household that cooks 95% of the time I completely agree with you.

 

Find a great cookbook that shows accurate cooking & prep times for meals and you're set. We do a lot of one pot meals that don't take too long and have plenty of leftovers for lunch the next day.

Edited July 15, 2010 by BigSqwert

[Controlled Chaos]

As individual "boiled vegetable X", sure. As far as putting together a whole meal, for most people, it's 10 minutes for 1, 10 minutes for another, 10 minutes for another, then 20-30 minutes of cleanup/running the dishwasher/emptying the dishwasher.

If the government can just supply everyone with a chef and a maid the problem would be solved.

[Iwritecode]

I think your numbers are a bit inflated. You don't have to cook one ingredient at a time, things like a pot of simmering water don't require constant attention, you can accomplish other things while they're cooking, you don't have to run the dishwasher every night unless you're a huge family or have very few dishes, etc.

 

Yeah, it can take SOME work, but I think there's a lot of excuse-making too. If one can spare 15 minutes to drive to McDonalds and wait in the drive-through for a breakfast meal, they've got the time to pour a bowl of cereal and peel a banana.

 

But cereal is far more difficult to eat on the way to school/practice/etc...

[ChiSox_Sonix]

But cereal is far more difficult to eat on the way to school/practice/etc...

 

Get up 10 minutes earlier than you normally would...

[mr_genius]

If the government can just supply everyone with a chef and a maid the problem would be solved.

 

it's the only reasonable thing to do

[Jenksismyhero]

it's the only reasonable thing to do

 

yeah, but I heard the chefs and maids in Canada and Europe are WAY better.

[bmags]

let me write down this routine and send it to cbs. This is hilarious.

[mr_genius]

yeah, but I heard the chefs and maids in Canada and Europe are WAY better.

 

oh, they are. you heard right.

[iamshack]

So even if you can find the time to cook meals at home for your family, how do you even know that what you're cooking them is healthy? Where do you shop to get your food?

[Balta1701]

While we're on the subject...I'm sure it'll be filibustered in the Senate, but worth noting.

House Democrats are moving forward on first lady Michelle Obama's vision for healthier school lunches, propelling legislation that calls for tougher standards governing food in school and more meals for hungry children.

 

The bill approved by the House Education and Labor Committee Thursday would allow the Agriculture Department to create new standards for all food in schools, including vending machine items. The legislation would spend about $8 billion more over 10 years on nutrition programs.

[kapkomet]

You are still missing the point. The GOVERNMENT is not the ones who should be telling us what to eat. This is preposterous. You don't even realize the freedoms of making those decisions. Right or wrong, it's NOT THE PLACE OF THE GOVERNMENT to tell us what to eat and what not to. Yet, you condone this from our government.

 

Oil subsidies, bmags? Get rid of them. Bring it on. But while you're at it, if you buy a contract, you have to own the oil and take physical possesion of it. (goodbye speculators and other bulls*** market manipulations)

[bmags]

excellent, all these people using gasoline are sucking the teat of the government. the lazy bastards.

[NorthSideSox72]

You are still missing the point. The GOVERNMENT is not the ones who should be telling us what to eat. This is preposterous. You don't even realize the freedoms of making those decisions. Right or wrong, it's NOT THE PLACE OF THE GOVERNMENT to tell us what to eat and what not to. Yet, you condone this from our government.

 

Oil subsidies, bmags? Get rid of them. Bring it on. But while you're at it, if you buy a contract, you have to own the oil and take physical possesion of it. (goodbye speculators and other bulls*** market manipulations)

First... these are public schools we are talking about. I'm all for getting parents heavily involved in nearly all things school, but frankly, the school diet will not be helped by most parents. For public schools, the schools need to do something - either independently, or at the state or federal level. Probably best at the state level.

 

Second... If the only people buying oil futures contracts are planning to take delivery, then you no longer have a market whatsoever. Oil prices will go up FAR faster that way, than with having futures markets.

 

[Balta1701]

Second... If the only people buying oil futures contracts are planning to take delivery, then you no longer have a market whatsoever. Oil prices will go up FAR faster that way, than with having futures markets.

Honestly, is that really the case?

 

I'm under the impression that the widespread trading of oil futures contracts as speculation is something that is fairly new as of the last couple decades, am I wrong on that?

 

Furthermore, even if I'm wrong, I think it's safe to argue against the rationality of markets under certain circumstances right now. For example, if the futures markets had predicted the large dropoff in demand for oil in 2008, it would have blunted the gigantic price spike. On the other hand, if the futures markets were trading into a bubble, they would have exacerbated the price spike and helped push down the global economy. I think, in hindsight, that the latter was reality.