I want Ozzie and KW gone.

[Jordan4life_2007]

The 2005 honeymoon is officially over (or should be over). Let's face it, take 2005 away (and I know you can't realistically do this), they've both been average at their jobs at best. In Ozzie, you've got a manager who doesn't realize it's 2010 and not 1910. He's got a King-Kong sized ego despite the fact that he's not even a top 10 manager in the game. He's stubborn as f*** and I think gets a personal pleasure of managing against the norm, whether it benefits the team or not. Ozzie is simply not the kinda manager you're going to win consistently with. KW? I was willing to, not that my opinion means a thing, ignore the fact that he's blatantly neglected the farm and has consistently traded away young talent for mediocre vets. But this past offseason was inexcusable. Jim Thome? Vladimir Guerrero? Hideki Matsui? No! Let's roll with Mark f***ing Kotsay because that's what my dumbass manager truly wanted. We're up s***s creek now because not only do we have an offense that doesn't come close to matching up with the likes of the Yankees, Red Sox and Rangers, we now have an unfixable pitching hole (and I'm not blaming either for Peavy getting hurt) that must be addressed if we have any realistic hope of competing for the AL pennant. Yes, the AL pennant. I'm not salivating over winning a below average division only to get waxed in the playoffs (2008). It makes me sick to look at what the Angels gave up to get Haren when we easily could've topped it. BUT NO!!! We have to save the few bullets in a pathetic system (ever since KW took over) to upgrade an offense that could've been taken care of back in March. Again, I know my rant doesn't mean a thing. Ozzie and KW would have to quit before either is held accountable. I just had to vent. This organization is going nowhere fast with these two as manager and GM.

Edited July 26, 2010 by Jordan4life

[chisox2334]

glad to see your true w sox fan:)

[bigruss]

glad to see your true w sox fan:)

How does this make him less of a Sox fan? By wanting them to be better?

[Goober]

Neat.

[BigSqwert]

glad to see your true w sox fan:)

Value added poor grammar post of the minute.

[Quin]

Value added poor grammar post of the minute.

 

I think you're overreacting J4L, but I do understand your point of view.

 

This is why this place is nicer after wins.

 

[chisox2334]

hes pisst and jealous because angels got Haren.

[bigruss]

hes pisst and jealous because angels got Haren.

For that package, why shouldnt he be?

 

 

[KipWellsFan]

I strongly disagree.

[chisox2334]

For that package, why shouldnt he be?

 

 

so are alot of teams and fans. We weren't even in the mix for him.

[Kyyle23]

glad to see your true w sox fan:)

 

 

Value added poor grammar post of the minute.

 

 

hes pisst and jealous because angels got Haren.

 

 

[mcgrad70]

He's not saying anything that any Sox fan hasn't felt from time to time.

We want the Sox to be an elite team.

But you have to have committed ownership to make that happen.

The first thing they can do is become major players in the free agent market and stop with this nonsense of not signing players because of their representation.

The next thing they do is commit to a substantial financial outlay to improve their farm system. This means hiring the top evaluators in the business and commission them to search the planet for talent. You stockpile your farm system with talent not only for your needs but to make trades that don't impact your 25 man roster time and time again.

[bigruss]

so are alot of teams and fans. We weren't even in the mix for him.

Not the point, you're saying that he is less of a Sox fan because he is jealous and mad for losing out on an Ace who is signed reasonably for the next 3 years and the team that got him barely gave up anything. How does that make sense? You wouldn't want Haren while giving up scraps? You don't want the Sox to make moves to get better? Atleast add something valuable to talk about, add some opinion, some facts to back it up, something.

[T R U]

Since Ozzie took over as manager in 04 we have 2 division titles, a World Series Championship, and are currently leading the division as we speak..

 

2004: 83-79 - 2nd

2005: 99-63 - Division Champs, World Series Champs

2006: 90-72 - 3rd

2007: 72-90 - 4th

2008: 89-74 - Division Champs

2009: 79-83 - 3rd

2010: 53-44 - Leading Division

 

No one likes Kotsay being a major contributor to this team, but lets just say we win the division this season.. that's 3 division titles and a world series title in 7 seasons..

 

That also puts Ozzie at 565-505 career record with the Sox.. 12-4 in the postseason.. They don't need to be fired, but a collective agreement between them of the RIGHT moves to make would prolly help out a lot.. KW needs to just man up and do what he thinks is best for the club instead of submitting to Ozzie..

[Balta1701]

I feel the need already to suggest that people should try to keep it less than personal in this thread.

[GREEDY]

For that package, why shouldnt he be?

Actually, I heard Rafael Rodriguez is hung like a horse.

[fathom]

I'm just going to sit back with my popcorn and enjoy this thread. I'll just say this: hard to project Sox as winning the AL Central when we're below .500 against AL teams this season.

[bigruss]

glad to see your true w sox fan:)

 

 

I strongly disagree.

 

Please take note on how to add to a discussion.

Since Ozzie took over as manager in 04 we have 2 division titles, a World Series Championship, and are currently leading the division as we speak..

 

2004: 83-79 - 2nd

2005: 99-63 - Division Champs, World Series Champs

2006: 90-72 - 3rd

2007: 72-90 - 4th

2008: 89-74 - Division Champs

2009: 79-83 - 3rd

2010: 53-44 - Leading Division

 

No one likes Kotsay being a major contributor to this team, but lets just say we win the division this season.. that's 3 division titles and a world series title in 7 seasons..

 

That also puts Ozzie at 565-505 career record with the Sox.. 12-4 in the postseason.. They don't need to be fired, but a collective agreement between them of the RIGHT moves to make would prolly help out a lot.. KW needs to just man up and do what he thinks is best for the club instead of submitting to Ozzie..

 

I am not trying to make this personal, but if Soxtalk wants to continue to have insightful discussions then they should see hows its done.

 

Im not saying one liners need to completely disappear, sometimes great comedy will come from them, or one line is all that is needed sometimes to make a point. But, IMO, I have seen way to much of the non-value one liners on Soxtalk, and not enough real discussion going on. Maybe Im wrong, but thats my 2 cents.

 

Edited July 26, 2010 by bigruss22

[southsider2k5]

The sad thing is that if Gordo gets down on that ball in the second inning, this thread never happens.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Since Ozzie took over as manager in 04 we have 2 division titles, a World Series Championship, and are currently leading the division as we speak..

 

2004: 83-79 - 2nd

2005: 99-63 - Division Champs, World Series Champs

2006: 90-72 - 3rd

2007: 72-90 - 4th

2008: 89-74 - Division Champs

2009: 79-83 - 3rd

2010: 53-44 - Leading Division

 

No one likes Kotsay being a major contributor to this team, but lets just say we win the division this season.. that's 3 division titles and a world series title in 7 seasons..

 

That also puts Ozzie at 565-505 career record with the Sox.. 12-4 in the postseason.. They don't need to be fired, but a collective agreement between them of the RIGHT moves to make would prolly help out a lot.. KW needs to just man up and do what he thinks is best for the club instead of submitting to Ozzie..

 

GMAB with the postseason record. Like I said, other than 2005, there's nothing to get loud about here. I've mentioned a few times that both Ozzie and KW would get majorly exposed if we didn't have the luxury of playing in what mostly has been a weak division since they've been together. We go into EVERY season with holes and the common consensus is "Wait until the deadline and will upgrade." We wouldn't be able to do that in the AL east. It'd be nice to go INTO a season without holes. Yes, I know this isn't fantasy baseball and you're not going to be loaded at every position. But there were options out there. We dropped the ball just because.

[Jordan4life_2007]

The sad thing is that if Gordo gets down on that ball in the second inning, this thread never happens.

 

Whatever. If you think I created this thread because of today's loss then you're delusional. I didn't create a thread when we were 10 games under back in early June.

[mcgrad70]

Winning division titles mean absolutely nothing.

The goal is to get to the Series.

[bigruss]

GMAB with the postseason record. Like I said, other than 2005, there's nothing to get loud about here. I've mentioned a few times that both Ozzie and KW would get majorly exposed if we didn't have the luxury of playing in what mostly has been a weak division since they've been together. We go into EVERY season with holes and the common consensus is "Wait until the deadline and will upgrade." We wouldn't be able to do that in the AL east. It'd be nice to go INTO a season without holes. Yes, I know this isn't fantasy baseball and you're not going to be loaded at every position. But there were options out there. We dropped the ball just because.

It would be nice to have a better farm system to help with the constant few holes we seem to have each year. I think this organization is recognizing that, but the change is coming slowly (only the first few picks in each draft are really being spent on, and even that is debatable).

 

Still, I think one of the biggest problems is that the value of deadline contributors has risen dramatically this season, teams are seeing these difference makers in a new light in terms of value. Even mediocre players are demanding a ton now, and its stopping a lot of teams from being able to acquire them thus far.

 

Haren was in a different situation, as Arizona needed to dump his salary, whereas other teams arent as desperate to dump some of the contracts such as Dunn's, Berkman's, Fielder's, etc, so the price has stayed high.

[chisox2334]

Not getting Haren should not turn into a thread about blasting Ozzie and Kenny. Would it be nice to have Haren? Hell ya it would be great. Let me guess blast Kenny and Ozzie for a team going from 9 1/2 out to 1 game up in the divsion.

[T R U]

Winning division titles mean absolutely nothing.

The goal is to get to the Series.

 

You cant get to the series without winning the division for us, because we aren't gonna be the wild card.. so yes, winning a division title absolutely does mean something..

 

And just to add to this, winning a division title also means more attendance which also more than likely means higher payroll and again, another thing to help get to another world series..

Edited July 26, 2010 by T R U