What moves have come back to bite Kenny?

[LittleHurt05]

John Grabow is pretty bad.

 

2 years, $7.5 million. Thats nothing. And there's still no reason to think he can't have a good 2011, he was a decent reliever for the last 5 years.

[Quin]

That was fun. Lets bring in as many guys as possible that throw in the high 90s, but might not know where the ball is gonna go. I doubt there has been a bullpen that can throw as hard as Sisco, MacDougal, Aardsma, & Thornton combined.

 

2007 Fastball Averages

 

Sisco: 92.4

MacDougal: 93.2

Aardsma: 92.5

Thornton: 94.3

Jenks: 93.9

 

I dont know, it appears Santos, Putz, Thorton, Jenks, Threets and even Chris sale can give those guys a run for their money. The two "soft throwing" guy in our pen are Linebrink and Pena and both are mid-90's.

 

Santos: 95.8

Putz: 94.0

Threets: 93.3

Thornton: 96.1

Jenks: 94.9

Sale: 94.8

 

2010 Bullpen Wins.

 

Used FanGraphs by the way.

Edited August 14, 2010 by Quinarvy

[LittleHurt05]

2007 Fastball Averages

 

Sisco: 92.4

MacDougal: 93.2

Aardsma: 92.5

Thornton: 94.3

Jenks: 93.9

 

 

 

Santos: 95.8

Putz: 94.0

Threets: 93.3

Thornton: 96.1

Jenks: 94.9

Sale: 94.8

 

2010 Bullpen Wins.

 

Used FanGraphs by the way.

 

So much for that,

 

Most of those 2007 pitchers must have been a bit overhyped as flamethrowers because they just weren't very good at pitching. It's pretty awesome that you can find all that info on FanGraphs though.

[Kyyle23]

So much for that,

 

Most of those 2007 pitchers must have been a bit overhyped as flamethrowers because they just weren't very good at pitching. It's pretty awesome that you can find all that info on FanGraphs though.

 

I would actually say that they could all throw harder than they were, but Coop was trying to get them to have better control by not throwing as hard.

[AWhiteSoxinNJ]

No chance.

 

I guarantee he has recently passed waivers.

 

Considering players on the DL can't be on waivers, I say your 100% incorrect.

[Balta1701]

Seeing Linebrink mentioned here made me think. Is his contract one of the worst ever given to a reliever?

Bobby Jenks 1 year, $7.5 million. JJ Putz 1 year, $ 3 million.

 

I don't really believe that but I'm pissed and I've been drinking.

[elrockinMT]

Moves that can come back to bite Kenny?

 

Ok maybe:

 

the trading of CF Chris Young to Az

The trading of Gio Gonzalez

The trading of 4 young arms inclusding Richards who is now 10-5 for Peavy

The trade of Nick Swisher

Not resigning Jim Thome

Not resigning Juan Uribe

The trade of Ely to LA

Not resigning Scott Podsednik

 

trading Earl Battey

Trading Johnny Callison

Trading Denny McClain

letting Nellie Fox go to Houston

wait a minute now what year are we in?

[lostfan]

Moves that can come back to bite Kenny?

 

Ok maybe:

 

the trading of CF Chris Young to Az

The trading of Gio Gonzalez

The trading of 4 young arms inclusding Richards who is now 10-5 for Peavy

The trade of Nick Swisher

Not resigning Jim Thome

Not resigning Juan Uribe

The trade of Ely to LA

Not resigning Scott Podsednik

 

trading Earl Battey

Trading Johnny Callison

Trading Denny McClain

letting Nellie Fox go to Houston

wait a minute now what year are we in?

In fairness, he tried to re-sign Pods

[elrockinMT]

Bobby Jenks 1 year, $7.5 million. JJ Putz 1 year, $ 3 million.

 

I don't really believe that but I'm pissed and I've been drinking.

 

 

I know what you mean and I just witnessed Putz give up anothetr game losing HR

[elrockinMT]

In fairness, he tried to re-sign Pods

 

 

Oh but apparently not hard enough

[caulfield12]

Boone Logan has put together a decent career with the Yankees.

 

It would have been nice to get him straightened out so we would never have to witness the Williams Era.

 

It's funny, with Richard, Garland, Hudson, Ely and Haeger, you could theoretically have a competitive NL West rotation, well...maybe not Charlie. Perhaps that hypothetical team would try to use Poreda instead.

 

 

Right now, you can definitely make a compelling argument that the money from Jenks and Linebrink would have given us plenty of money to give us a competitive offense, enough to hold off the Twins. Just keeping Thome and Minnesota not having him should have been enough to get it done, without someone like Damon or Vladimir Guerrero or Aubrey Huff.

 

And it would be nice to have Juan Uribe's clutch-ness around, the guy has 3 walk-off hits this year and always seems to come through in the clutch. Vizquel's been great, but it's a shame that Juan kind of grew stale and didn't continue to improve after his first couple of seasons in Chicago.

[Balta1701]

Not resigning Jim Thome

/thread.

 

Really...there's a division championship riding on this mistake.

 

I'll go to my grave saying we lost in 06 because of how often Mackowiak played CF, and I think I'll do the same thing saying that we'd have beat the Twins if we'd kept Thome...even if we lose by 6 games, the only reason they have momentum and we don't is that they've been able to cover for Morneau.

[elrockinMT]

/thread.

 

Really...there's a division championship riding on this mistake.

 

I'll go to my grave saying we lost in 06 because of how often Mackowiak played CF, and I think I'll do the same thing saying that we'd have beat the Twins if we'd kept Thome...even if we lose by 6 games, the only reason they have momentum and we don't is that they've been able to cover for Morneau.

 

 

I can not argue with your statement. Plus I will add Jon Garland to the list of bad trades

[knightni]

Wasn't Garland a free agent after only one year?

 

Cabrera was needed at the time.

[Balta1701]

Wasn't Garland a free agent?

Garland was traded straight up for Orlando Cabrera. Cabrera's bat was key in winning the division in 2008 and Garland struggled in Anaheim to the point that he didn't make their playoff rotation. We got an extra pick for Cabrera as well.

[knightni]

Garland was traded straight up for Orlando Cabrera. Cabrera's bat was key in winning the division in 2008 and Garland struggled in Anaheim to the point that he didn't make their playoff rotation. We got an extra pick for Cabrera as well.

You're too fast for me. I edited my post.

[caulfield12]

When did we trade away Garland? (Too funny, I didn't even remember this trade, I was thinking of the trade we almost made for Erstad with the Angels).

 

And 2003, we didn't have a fifth starter and every team in baseball could have picked Kenny Rogers off the scrap heap and the Twins were prescient enough to do so, even though the guy's a total jerk.

 

That's three seasons where we could or should have been playoff-bound and KW made massive mistakes. I'll give him a bit of a pass for this year, because you don't expect to go to the playoffs when Peavy goes down, but we were in position to do so...and still theoretically are, unless we get swept by the Twins on the road next week.

Edited August 15, 2010 by caulfield12

[lostfan]

I didn't like Cabrera but I can't see the Garland trade as a mistake.

[Balta1701]

When did we trade away Garland?

Prior to 2008, we dealt him straight up for Orlando Cabrera. We saved a million or two on the deal and got an extra draft pick out of it, in addition to winning the division and clearing a spot for G!

[caulfield12]

Leading to the now "almost infamous" KW offering arbitration and Orlando failing to accept it scenario...which would have precluded Alexei Ramirez from becoming the shortstop we all know and love, lol.

 

I think Dick Allen wrote 350-500 posts about that situation, if I remember correctly.

[nitetrain8601]

When did we trade away Garland? (Too funny, I didn't even remember this trade, I was thinking of the trade we almost made for Erstad with the Angels).

 

And 2003, we didn't have a fifth starter and every team in baseball could have picked Kenny Rogers off the scrap heap and the Twins were prescient enough to do so, even though the guy's a total jerk.

 

That's three seasons where we could or should have been playoff-bound and KW made massive mistakes. I'll give him a bit of a pass for this year, because you don't expect to go to the playoffs when Peavy goes down, but we were in position to do so...and still theoretically are, unless we get swept by the Twins on the road next week.

 

They tried for Kenny but he didn't want to come here.

[elrockinMT]

"Having Marv Throneberry play for your team is like having Willie Sutton play for your bank."

Marvelous Marv Thornberry NY Mets 1962

 

Ok now compare that line to one we can come up with for Jenks and Putz and have some fun

[caulfield12]

Rogers signed with Minnesota for two million a season. Kenny confirmed he offered him one million before the Twins topped the Sox offer. (How often do you hear that?) Kenny wasn't comfortable making another offer and the rest is history.

 

I found that actually doing a google search which ended up at a WSI thread, from Mark Liptak.

 

I think Boras was also Rogers' agent at the time. FWIW.

Edited August 15, 2010 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

"Having Marv Throneberry play for your team is like having Willie Sutton play for your bank."

Marvelous Marv Thornberry NY Mets 1962

 

Ok now compare that line to one we can come up with for Jenks and Putz and have some fun

 

 

Inviting Bobby Jenks to Crispy Kreme when they're hot out of the oven Putz your playoff chances into prayers for Santos (meaning Saint in Spanish).

 

Sorry Greg.

 

 

[kitekrazy]

I'm glad Fukadome wanted to be a Cub and played for less money than Kenny offered him.