Minnesota Misconception

[Bizness]

 

With the Sox in town to play the Minnesota Twins for the next three games Sox fans are in a panic. The Sox sit three games behind the Twins for first place in the AL Central. A series lost would place the Sox four games back. Oh no not an insurmountable four game lead.

 

 

 

Over the years the Sox organization and Sox fans have placed the Minnesota Twins on a pedestal. Since 2005 the Twins have won one division title and zero playoff games. In that same time frame the Sox have won the division twice and won a World Series. This is the team that strikes fear into Sox fans hearts. Why?

 

 

 

 

 

http://www.jonathanhoodshow.com/?p=2529

[witesoxfan]

The Twins have won 2 divisional titles, 2006 and 2009.

 

Other than that, I have no idea. It seems as though the Sox have no sense of urgency until it's either forced upon them or it's too late. In regards to the Sox actually realizing that their backs were up against the wall and they were about to be put into a position of potential elimination, I can only think of 3 memories in my history as a Sox fan that the team, in some fashion, actually responded. In chronological order...

 

1) (Rally) Crede walk-off homer against Cleveland.

2) Pierzynski's strikeout in game 2 of the ALCS

3) Game 163 (and really, that was 3 guys who did most of the dirty work in Thome, Griffey, and Danks).

 

You can argue they did it in game 162 in 2008 too, but they were playing a Tigers team that ultimately finished in last place, so it wasn't stepping up against good competition, it was simply beating a bad team.

[fathom]

I'd love to know what the Twins record against the Sox has been post-ASB since Gardenhire was their manager.

[chetkincaid]

With the Sox in town to play the Minnesota Twins for the next three games Sox fans are in a panic. The Sox sit three games behind the Twins for first place in the AL Central. A series lost would place the Sox four games back. Oh no not an insurmountable four game lead.

 

 

 

Over the years the Sox organization and Sox fans have placed the Minnesota Twins on a pedestal. Since 2005 the Twins have won one division title and zero playoff games. In that same time frame the Sox have won the division twice and won a World Series. This is the team that strikes fear into Sox fans hearts. Why?

 

 

 

 

 

http://www.jonathanhoodshow.com/?p=2529

 

 

1) Because of that dome that they use to play in

 

2) Because Ozzie respects them too much and the team respects them too much to retaliate (see Torii Hunter/Byrnes or Quentin getting hit on purpose the other day)

 

3) Because national baseball experts always pick Minnesota to win the division

Edited August 17, 2010 by Chet Kincaid

[witesoxfan]

I'd love to know what the Twins record against the Sox has been post-ASB since Gardenhire was their manager.

 

Sox record

2002 - 6-9

2003 - 2-5

2004 - 2-7

2005 - 7-6

2006 - 4-8

2007 - 4-2

2008 - 2-6

2009 - 1-8

2010 - 2-5

 

30-56 in the second half

 

(The most interesting tidbit I found out doing that wasn't against Minnesota, but I didn't recall how important the Sox first series out of the ASB was in 2005. The Sox swept Cleveland in Cleveland in a 4-game series to knock them 12 games back in the standings. Of course, that team was phenomenal on the road too)

[Cali]

Sox record

2002 - 6-9

2003 - 2-5

2004 - 2-7

2005 - 7-6

2006 - 4-8

2007 - 4-2

2008 - 2-6

2009 - 1-8

2010 - 2-5

 

30-56 in the second half

 

(The most interesting tidbit I found out doing that wasn't against Minnesota, but I didn't recall how important the Sox first series out of the ASB was in 2005. The Sox swept Cleveland in Cleveland in a 4-game series to knock them 12 games back in the standings. Of course, that team was phenomenal on the road too)

 

 

For comparison sake, what's the first half record?

[caulfield12]

The Twins have won 2 divisional titles, 2006 and 2009.

 

Other than that, I have no idea. It seems as though the Sox have no sense of urgency until it's either forced upon them or it's too late. In regards to the Sox actually realizing that their backs were up against the wall and they were about to be put into a position of potential elimination, I can only think of 3 memories in my history as a Sox fan that the team, in some fashion, actually responded. In chronological order...

 

1) (Rally) Crede walk-off homer against Cleveland.

2) Pierzynski's strikeout in game 2 of the ALCS

3) Game 163 (and really, that was 3 guys who did most of the dirty work in Thome, Griffey, and Danks).

 

You can argue they did it in game 162 in 2008 too, but they were playing a Tigers team that ultimately finished in last place, so it wasn't stepping up against good competition, it was simply beating a bad team.

 

 

You could probably add the Iguchi homer off Wells and the El Duque bases loaded situation that Marte brought on himself...

 

Who did the White Sox beat that Sunday? I think it was the Indians, yes? I'm pretty sure the Twins were playing the Royals that final weekend.

 

 

[witesoxfan]

For comparison sake, what's the first half record?

 

2002 - 2-2

2003 - 7-5

2004 - 7-3

2005 - 4-1

2006 - 5-2

2007 - 5-7

2008 - 7-4

2009 - 5-4

2010 - 2-3

 

44-31

[witesoxfan]

You could probably add the Iguchi homer off Wells and the El Duque bases loaded situation that Marte brought on himself...

 

Who did the White Sox beat that Sunday? I think it was the Indians, yes? I'm pretty sure the Twins were playing the Royals that final weekend.

 

Yeah, the Sox were playing the Indians, but lost 2 of 3 to them. It appeared for all intents and purposes that the Sox had put their tail between their legs and given up. Thankfully, the Twins were busy celebrating their division title without actually clinching it. That old, annoying cliche goes, "It ain't over till it's over."

[caulfield12]

For comparison sake, what's the first half record?

 

 

From 2000-2011, the White Sox are something like 5 games over .500 against the Twins in the first half.

 

2000=3-3

2001=2-11 (oops!)

2002=2-2

2003=7-5

2004=7-3

2005=4-1

2006=5-2

2007=5-7/4-2 (interesting, Ozzie's worst team actually played .500 ball against MINN this season)

2008=7-4/1-6

2009=5-4/1-8

2010=2-3/2-5

 

OVERALL=49-45

 

Take out that 2-11 in the disastrous 2001 campaign (14-29 start), it's 47-34.

 

Huge, huge difference on a consistent basis.

[Milkman delivers]

1) Because of that dome that they use to play in

 

2) Because Ozzie respects them too much and the team respects them too much to retaliate (see Torii Hunter/Byrnes or Quentin getting hit on purpose the other day)

 

3) Because national baseball experts always pick Minnesota to win the division

 

Man, that pissed me off. No retaliation whatsoever.

[elrockinMT]

We should place our own team on a pedestal for a change

[BigSqwert]

We should place our own team on a pedestal for a change

I think an appointment with Stuart Smalley is in order.

[caulfield12]

We should place our own team on a pedestal for a change

 

 

Gordon Beckham was placed on the biggest pedestal that I can remember last year.

 

The White Sox were walking on water after 2008, and almost nobody was disappointed they fizzled in the playoffs.

 

But you have to do SOMETHING to earn that pedestal head-to-head against your biggest rival, instead of wetting the bed.

 

 

[kitekrazy]

I have no problem losing to some of the better teams but when you lose to the Royals, Indians but the real choke job was against the mighty Orioles. The Sox had to play that extra game in 2008 because they sucked against suck teams.

[caulfield12]

Or because the Twins choked against the Royals when they could have easily put us down for the count.

[Vance Law]

Or because the Twins choked against the Royals when they could have easily put us down for the count.

 

Can't be true. The Twins don't ever choke. The Twins always are the best.

[greg775]

I don't think anybody fears the Twins, but I do think many of us expect them to not only beat us, but blow us out in games.

I fully expect us to lose all 3 games.

I would be shocked if we win two. I wouldn't be totally surprised if we win one.

I dont fear Minnesota. I'm a realist. This is another season where they again have our number.

They have no pressure on them going into this series and frankly figure to bury our ass. That's all right though. The Sox had a chance to kick their ass in Chicago and promptly lost 2 of 3.

 

And I do expect a fight this series, which may turn out the way it did when Robin Ventura charged Nolan Ryan.

Bad timing for a fight/beanball war. But I sense it is coming tonight in game one, to try to set the cliche-like "tone" to the series.

 

Edited August 17, 2010 by greg775

[kitekrazy]

And I do expect a fight this series, which may turn out the way it did when Robin Ventura charged Nolan Ryan.

Bad timing for a fight/beanball war. But I sense it is coming tonight in game one, to try to set the cliche-like "tone" to the series.

 

That macho bulls*** never does anything. Ask Carlos Z.

 

[Balta1701]

That macho bulls*** never does anything. Ask Carlos Z.

Armando Galarraga got into it with his catcher in the dugout on Sunday and then the Tigers stood up and creamed the White Sox. By your standard 1 example is sufficient to prove a universal truth, therefore, I think all 3 of our pitchers ought to challenge AJ to a dugout fight after the first inning.

[kitekrazy]

Armando Galarraga got into it with his catcher in the dugout on Sunday and then the Tigers stood up and creamed the White Sox. By your standard 1 example is sufficient to prove a universal truth, therefore, I think all 3 of our pitchers ought to challenge AJ to a dugout fight after the first inning.

 

What? Galarraga had nothing to do with the bullpen implosion. The hitters should have beat the crap out of Putz.

 

[clyons]

I think an appointment with Stuart Smalley is in order.

Bad idea. He represents Minnesota.

 

 

[Balta1701]

What? Galarraga had nothing to do with the bullpen implosion. The hitters should have beat the crap out of Putz.

Exactly my point. You said that being macho never does anything and cited the Zambrano meltdown. I immediately cited another situation where the exact opposite happened. Therefore, by your own logic, the Zambrano meltdown has zero information on whether or not "that macho BS" actually does anything.

[fathom]

Sox record

2002 - 6-9

2003 - 2-5

2004 - 2-7

2005 - 7-6

2006 - 4-8

2007 - 4-2

2008 - 2-6

2009 - 1-8

2010 - 2-5

 

30-56 in the second half

 

This should really be the end of this thread

[kitekrazy]

Exactly my point. You said that being macho never does anything and cited the Zambrano meltdown. I immediately cited another situation where the exact opposite happened. Therefore, by your own logic, the Zambrano meltdown has zero information on whether or not "that macho BS" actually does anything.

 

Fines

Suspensions

Player's decline of market value

 

 

End of discussion.