Frightening Discovery

[Steve9347]

Everybody knows the white sox should have signed Thome. We don't need to bring it up in every thread.

:notworthy :notworthy

[greg775]

Yes it is. Since only OPS appears to matter to you, let's use that. Back to back .865 OPS seasons in 2008-2009. Whoopty-do. That's a nice OPS if you don't strikeout 400 times in a season and score a pathetic 55 runs. Sure seemed to most of us that Big Jim was trending down pretty hard after the first 2 seasons. Why on earth would you simply average his 4 seasons to determine if he should come back? The trend said he was in sharp decline.

 

Plus our team was what, 3rd to last in 2009 runs scored? I blame that on station to station baseball, a.k.a. White Sox Baseball post 2005, and I was sick of it. So was Ozzie. I'm not happy with Kotsay either but I sure didn't want that wastepit known as Jim Thome back. He just kills momentum like it's his job.

 

 

Great to have somebody remind us of what actually was happening on this board. Thome was getting reamed and the Sox reamed for station to station baseball.

But it still all comes back to Ozzie anyway. He wanted Kotsay and for that the Oz haters will never forgive him til the day he is sxpunged from their lives and becomes Florida's manager where he will excel as he did here.

[Dick Allen]

Okay but last year, in his age 38 season, he posted an .864 OPS and looked to be taking a downward slide. Not only that, but there were some really, REALLY ugly at-bats. Someone on here said we haven't seen at-bats like Manny's since Big Frank in his prime, EVEN THOUGH the results haven't matched the quality of his at-bats (no XBH yet). The converse could be said for Thome last year: he may have hit decently, but boy was it ugly at times.

 

Not only that, but in his limited opportunities with LAD to end the season, he looked awful.

 

So when you rewind to March of this year, when we were projecting his career arc, signs did not point to golden happiness and joy, particularly not in a reduced role (judging from the LAD numbers -- I know, sample size, blah blah blah). The Thome love, enjoyed by about 50% of this board during that couple-day span where we thought we might re-sign him, was largely based on residual fondness and affection from when he was playing well. It wasn't completely devoid of statistical analysis, but let's face it: it was not unreasonable to project a poor season out of the dude. The outrage right now is TOTALLY 20/20 retrospect.

 

It's like playing blackjack: a situation might call for you to hit, simply because of the odds, but there's a chance you bust. If you bust, was it the wrong choice? No.

 

He also played with a bad heel all year last year. He was a no brainer for $1.5 million.

[lostfan]

Ugh I tried to read this thread but I guess I'm done with it, too many cringe-worthy posts in rapid succession from know-it-alls, and more asinine Thome talk. This is like the Brian Anderson debates all over again.

[fathom]

Ugh I tried to read this thread but I guess I'm done with it, too many cringe-worthy posts in rapid succession from know-it-alls, and more asinine Thome talk. This is like the Brian Anderson debates all over again.

 

Ha, I could only have imagined what would have happened if Anderson went to a team and hurt the Sox.

[The Critic]

Ha, I could only have imagined what would have happened if Anderson went to a team and hurt the Sox.

The server would have exploded from the shock of Brian Anderson doing well anywhere.

[knightni]

I'm sad that my Kotsay/Damon thread got hijacked.

[shrek]

I know the Thome thing has been talked to to death, but you can't overlook the close ball games he won for the Twins and his great production. Having his production on our team, minus his production on the twins, the division race would be closer. And if Konerko needed rest every now and then, you put Teahen at 1st base. If this division comes down to a game or two, blame needs to be put on Ozzie. He single handedly handcuffed this team for a good portion of the season and allowed the Twins to get a very productive player for a cheap amount.

[NorthSideSox72]

I know the Thome thing has been talked to to death, but you can't overlook the close ball games he won for the Twins and his great production. Having his production on our team, minus his production on the twins, the division race would be closer. And if Konerko needed rest every now and then, you put Teahen at 1st base. If this division comes down to a game or two, blame needs to be put on Ozzie. He single handedly handcuffed this team for a good portion of the season and allowed the Twins to get a very productive player for a cheap amount.

Welcome to the board!

 

[hogan873]

I know the Thome thing has been talked to to death, but you can't overlook the close ball games he won for the Twins and his great production. Having his production on our team, minus his production on the twins, the division race would be closer. And if Konerko needed rest every now and then, you put Teahen at 1st base. If this division comes down to a game or two, blame needs to be put on Ozzie. He single handedly handcuffed this team for a good portion of the season and allowed the Twins to get a very productive player for a cheap amount.

And it was a damn good post!

[southsider2k5]

Ha, I could only have imagined what would have happened if Anderson went to a team and hurt the Sox.

 

Brian Anderson already killed this team enough while he was here.

[chw42]

Yes it is. Since only OPS appears to matter to you, let's use that. Back to back .865 OPS seasons in 2008-2009. Whoopty-do. That's a nice OPS if you don't strikeout 400 times in a season and score a pathetic 55 runs. Sure seemed to most of us that Big Jim was trending down pretty hard after the first 2 seasons. Why on earth would you simply average his 4 seasons to determine if he should come back? The trend said he was in sharp decline.

 

Plus our team was what, 3rd to last in 2009 runs scored? I blame that on station to station baseball, a.k.a. White Sox Baseball post 2005, and I was sick of it. So was Ozzie. I'm not happy with Kotsay either but I sure didn't want that wastepit known as Jim Thome back. He just kills momentum like it's his job.

 

An .865 OPS is good, you do know that right?

 

Plus, I can care less how many times he strikes out as long as he hits enough home runs and keeps his OPS up to a certain level. He was getting on base at a very good rate as well. The 55 runs have more to do with who hit behind him than what he did as a hitter.

 

Plus, you basically said that Thome was useless in his 4 years here, which he was clearly not.

 

And I'm sure you have a "momentum" meter in your head. Were you also b****ing when Thome scored our only run in game 163 back in 08 or when he hit the go ahead home run on opening day in 2009? Whatever your perception might be, they're wrong. And you're sadly mistaken if you think the 05 team didn't rely on home runs or power.

[Mr. Wedmesday]

Brian Anderson already killed this team enough while he was here.

 

 

If this season has taught me anything, it's that Sox-killers don't have to be on other teams. And if we make a (usually dumb) deal to acquire a Sox-killer from a divisional rival,he will kill us twice as dead as a member of our team.

[Balta1701]

If this season has taught me anything, it's that Sox-killers don't have to be on other teams. And if we make a (usually dumb) deal to acquire a Sox-killer from a divisional rival,he will kill us twice as dead as a member of our team.

Huh?

[Mr. Wedmesday]

Huh?

 

Sorry. It's partly a Teahan thing, for which I should probably seek professional help. As Tony Montana says when they throw his informer/partner out of the helicopter, "I never like him".

 

And not to beat a very dead horse, but it's partly about Thome.

 

Intra-divisional trades seem to come back and bite us, no matter the logic behind them.

 

Edited September 8, 2010 by 11and1

[Balta1701]

Ah, Teahen...that's who you're talking about. Never thought of him as a huge Sox killer. Only an .806 career OPS against the Sox. Only 12 home runs against us in nearly 300 AB's. That's above his career numbers but not hugely. I guess I never thought of him as a Sox killer.

 

When I think of Sox killers...the list starts with Thome, and I think he appears somewhere in the neighborhood of 17 times. Mike Sweeney winds up somewhere on that list. I'd count Johan Santana just because he was better against us than anyone else, no matter how good he was overall. Joe Nathan is probably another one I'd count as a Sox killer. That's getting the majority of my recent year, true Sox killer list.

[Jerksticks]

An .865 OPS is good, you do know that right?

 

Plus, I can care less how many times he strikes out as long as he hits enough home runs and keeps his OPS up to a certain level. He was getting on base at a very good rate as well. The 55 runs have more to do with who hit behind him than what he did as a hitter.

 

Plus, you basically said that Thome was useless in his 4 years here, which he was clearly not.

 

And I'm sure you have a "momentum" meter in your head. Were you also b****ing when Thome scored our only run in game 163 back in 08 or when he hit the go ahead home run on opening day in 2009? Whatever your perception might be, they're wrong. And you're sadly mistaken if you think the 05 team didn't rely on home runs or power.

 

Whoa there, it's your tone; it's the wrong tone. When, during any of this pile of generalizations, was the condescending, high school tone necessary? I never liked Thome, you apparently did. In fact, I grew up disliking him on the Indians; you apparently didn't mind him those years. So he hit a few nice homeruns for the Sox over a pointless 4 years did he? Good for him. Good.....for........him (slow, sarcastic clap). I swear some of you act like Jim was Mr. White Sox; Mr. homegrown, glad to be home, king of the South Side. That's Buehrle, Konerko, Baines, Thomas territory that he has no business being in the same discussions with. He grew up a cub fan, played forever on the Indians, co-founder of CWS Corpseball, played on 4 meaningless Sox teams that didn't accomplish dick. What's the big deal? I don't think Thome was the missing piece this year; the first 2 months were. We disagree; why give your arguments that personal attack feel, man? I'm not understanding that avenue.

[Kyyle23]

Whoa there, it's your tone; it's the wrong tone. When, during any of this pile of generalizations, was the condescending, high school tone necessary? I never liked Thome, you apparently did. In fact, I grew up disliking him on the Indians; you apparently didn't mind him those years. So he hit a few nice homeruns for the Sox over a pointless 4 years did he? Good for him. Good.....for........him (slow, sarcastic clap). I swear some of you act like Jim was Mr. White Sox; Mr. homegrown, glad to be home, king of the South Side. That's Buehrle, Konerko, Baines, Thomas territory that he has no business being in the same discussions with. He grew up a cub fan, played forever on the Indians, co-founder of CWS Corpseball, played on 4 meaningless Sox teams that didn't accomplish dick. What's the big deal? I don't think Thome was the missing piece this year; the first 2 months were. We disagree; why give your arguments that personal attack feel, man? I'm not understanding that avenue.

 

Look, both of you are going back and forth with the snide condescending attitude in regards to thome, so dont cry foul when you are throwing your"since ops only matters to you", "whoop de doos" and "Good....for.....him(slow clap)"'s back at him.

[greg775]

All I want to know is: Where was all this praise for Thome when he was, uh, actually on our team?

[SoxAce]

Whoa there, it's your tone; it's the wrong tone. When, during any of this pile of generalizations, was the condescending, high school tone necessary? I never liked Thome, you apparently did. In fact, I grew up disliking him on the Indians; you apparently didn't mind him those years. So he hit a few nice homeruns for the Sox over a pointless 4 years did he? Good for him. Good.....for........him (slow, sarcastic clap). I swear some of you act like Jim was Mr. White Sox; Mr. homegrown, glad to be home, king of the South Side. That's Buehrle, Konerko, Baines, Thomas territory that he has no business being in the same discussions with. He grew up a cub fan, played forever on the Indians, co-founder of CWS Corpseball, played on 4 meaningless Sox teams that didn't accomplish dick. What's the big deal? I don't think Thome was the missing piece this year; the first 2 months were. We disagree; why give your arguments that personal attack feel, man? I'm not understanding that avenue.

 

:crying

[Kyyle23]

All I want to know is: Where was all this praise for Thome when he was, uh, actually on our team?

 

Would you let it go? Thome got plenty of praise when he was here, and he got plenty of s*** when he had his bad stretches, as any player for the White Sox does on this site. What do you want people to do, go back and alter their posts and heap tons of praise on the guy? Some people loved him(Kalapse), some people didnt care for him(Jerksticks). It is what it is. Asking something like what is quoted above is doing nothing but asking for an argument

[hogan873]

All I want to know is: Where was all this praise for Thome when he was, uh, actually on our team?

I think there was plenty of praise for him when he was here. But, as with any player that is or is supposed to be high-impact, you're going to hear more negativity when they are not playing well. Like you had mentioned before about Konerko, same thing there.

 

As far as Thome now, many of us are still upset that the Sox decided not to sign him, and seeing him play so well really grinds our gears. I've always liked Thome (as a player, even when he was with the Indians). Hated to see him destroy the Sox, but had to admire the guy. I still like him, but I just hope he strikes out or gets beat by the shift when he's playing us. Otherwise, I hope he hits .400 with 50 HRs (just as long as one of those homeruns doesn't eliminate the Sox!).

[chw42]

Whoa there, it's your tone; it's the wrong tone. When, during any of this pile of generalizations, was the condescending, high school tone necessary? I never liked Thome, you apparently did. In fact, I grew up disliking him on the Indians; you apparently didn't mind him those years. So he hit a few nice homeruns for the Sox over a pointless 4 years did he? Good for him. Good.....for........him (slow, sarcastic clap). I swear some of you act like Jim was Mr. White Sox; Mr. homegrown, glad to be home, king of the South Side. That's Buehrle, Konerko, Baines, Thomas territory that he has no business being in the same discussions with. He grew up a cub fan, played forever on the Indians, co-founder of CWS Corpseball, played on 4 meaningless Sox teams that didn't accomplish dick. What's the big deal? I don't think Thome was the missing piece this year; the first 2 months were. We disagree; why give your arguments that personal attack feel, man? I'm not understanding that avenue.

 

What do you mean my tone? You told another poster to not talk to you in a certain way and called him "boy". You're the one who had aggression towards somebody else.

[hi8is]

Whoa there, it's your tone; it's the wrong tone. When, during any of this pile of generalizations, was the condescending, high school tone necessary? I never liked Thome, you apparently did. In fact, I grew up disliking him on the Indians; you apparently didn't mind him those years. So he hit a few nice homeruns for the Sox over a pointless 4 years did he? Good for him. Good.....for........him (slow, sarcastic clap). I swear some of you act like Jim was Mr. White Sox; Mr. homegrown, glad to be home, king of the South Side. That's Buehrle, Konerko, Baines, Thomas territory that he has no business being in the same discussions with. He grew up a cub fan, played forever on the Indians, co-founder of CWS Corpseball, played on 4 meaningless Sox teams that didn't accomplish dick. What's the big deal? I don't think Thome was the missing piece this year; the first 2 months were. We disagree; why give your arguments that personal attack feel, man? I'm not understanding that avenue.

I, personally, just love, your use of the, English literary device which is, the comma. Not to be forgotten, is your use of it's cousin, the simi-colon; which is also amazing.

Edited September 8, 2010 by hi8is

[chw42]

I, personally, just love, your use of the, English literary device which is, the comma. No to be forgotten, is your use of it's cousin, the simi-colon; which is also amazing.

Edited September 8, 2010 by chw42