Quentin

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I'm done with Q for this year but against trading him after a bad year. Give him another year and see if he can rebound. He's a force if he can get it together.

[Balta1701]

I'm done with Q for this year but against trading him after a bad year. Give him another year and see if he can rebound. He's a force if he can get it together.

There's no reason to trade him frankly; if he puts up an .800 OPS with bad defense next year, he'd be a DFA candidate. You're just not going to get anything for him unless the other GM is a fool.

 

The real thing you have to do in determining what to do about him next year is figure out behind the scenes what's going on with him. Is he still hurting, is he just lost at the plate, is this just all in his head or is he geniuinely never going to recover from his physical issues.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

There's no reason to trade him frankly; if he puts up an .800 OPS with bad defense next year, he'd be a DFA candidate. You're just not going to get anything for him unless the other GM is a fool.

 

The real thing you have to do in determining what to do about him next year is figure out behind the scenes what's going on with him. Is he still hurting, is he just lost at the plate, is this just all in his head or is he geniuinely never going to recover from his physical issues.

I don't know about it taking a fool to want him. Seems like the kind of guy KW would target if he had the same stats with another team. Only 28, one MVP type season but injury prone. Sox once took a chance on the same type of guy (Dye) who ended up a WS MVP.

[Balta1701]

I don't know about it taking a fool to want him. Seems like the kind of guy KW would target if he had the same stats with another team. Only 28, one MVP type season but injury prone. Sox once took a chance on the same type of guy (Dye) who ended up a WS MVP.

Yeah...but you target him once he's DFA'd or becomes a free agent. You don't give up stuff to him while thinking that he'll turn it around with your team...like, for example, what the White Sox did with Mark Teahen.

 

Other teams would jump on him if he was released. Look at the arbitration numbers though. He's going to go from pre-arb this year to a multi-million dollar player; maybe $4-$5 million if I was just guessing. If he puts up another .800 OPS, godawful defense season or an injury-riddled season, then he'd be overpaid at that amount...and if the White Sox wanted to keep him next offseason, they'd have to offer him a big raise in arbitration again; that'd be talking about $7 million+.

 

Someone would sign him for a million or two if he hit the DFA market, but you've got to think about the contracts here. Teams would be signing him looking for a bargain. The Sox would be getting the same treatment if they tried to trade him.

 

It's not that you'd be a fool to want him; it's that you'd be a fool to go after him without paying attention to his contract status.

[shago]

He's slumping right now, the sky isn't falling.

Correct, it already fell

[SoxAce]

He is actually the perfect "rotating DH" that Ozzie was preaching for. Might not be great defensively, but can play there (both LF and RF) in a pinch, and is a much better hitter than Kotsay/Jones. Hopefully KW can find a much better overall RF next season.. or find a CF and stick Rios and his still stellar D in RF.

[Balta1701]

He is actually the perfect "rotating DH" that Ozzie was preaching for. Might not be great defensively, but can play there (both LF and RF) in a pinch, and is a much better hitter than Kotsay/Jones. Hopefully KW can find a much better overall RF next season.. or find a CF and stick Rios and his still stellar D in RF.

Actually, I disagree...he's not exactly the perfect "Rotating DH" because he's a righty who doesn't have severe splits against LHP. In fact, he's sort of been quite a bit better (.116 points in OPS) against righties than against lefties...which kinda makes it impossible for us since Ozzie would never platoon a righty with a righty.

[fathom]

Ozzie is "saving" Quentin to face Liriano and Duensing. Good call Ozzie, Quentin destroys LHP. At this point, seems like Quentin has played himself out of the organization. Very rarely do we see guys fall out of favor with Ozzie, KW, etc. and get back into their good graces.

[Vance Law]

[Quentin] is a much better hitter than Kotsay/Jones.

 

Have you looked at Andruw Jones' numbers?

 

Quentin and Jones have identical .333 OBPs

Quentin's OPS .810

Jones' OPS .824

 

Jones' 2nd half OPS .902

Quentin's 2nd half OPS .711

 

Jones 2nd half HR 6 (in a little more than half the PAs)

Quentin 2nd half HR 5

 

And oh yeah, Jones is insanely better in right field. He should have become the full time right fielder weeks ago.

 

[Jordan4life_2007]

Vance Law just went Kalapse on Ace. How about CQ for Hunter Pence straight up? Pence is one of the most underrated players in baseball. I love him. And I know the Astros would forfeit their franchise before making such a deal.

[chw42]

Vance Law just went Kalapse on Ace. How about CQ for Hunter Pence straight up? Pence is one of the most underrated players in baseball. I love him. And I know the Astros would forfeit their franchise before making such a deal.

 

Pence would be dreamy if he got on base more.

 

Even at his current state, I would definitely make that deal.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Pence would be dreamy if he got on base more.

 

Even at his current state, I would definitely make that deal.

 

His defense in RF alone would be worth it. He's got a Markakis/Bruce like arm.

[thxfrthmmrs]

just checked to see how horrible CQ's defense at right field is

 

He is dead last of all qualified MLB player in terms of UZR and UZR/150, with a UZR/150 of -28.8

 

Konerko is also in the bottom 10 in UZR/150 with -12.0

 

In case you were wondering, of the unqualified players, our golden boy Teahan at 3B has a UZR/150 of -24.2, and Kotsay at RF would a whopping -81.0 UZR/150

 

I'd say we need to fire our fielding coach

Edited September 13, 2010 by thxfrthmmrs

[SoxAce]

Have you looked at Andruw Jones' numbers?

 

Quentin and Jones have identical .333 OBPs

Quentin's OPS .810

Jones' OPS .824

 

Jones' 2nd half OPS .902

Quentin's 2nd half OPS .711

 

Jones 2nd half HR 6 (in a little more than half the PAs)

Quentin 2nd half HR 5

 

And oh yeah, Jones is insanely better in right field. He should have become the full time right fielder weeks ago.

 

I had no idea one year (especially for a guy who is putting up the highest WAR he's had in three years) defines being a better hitter. Thats like me breaking it down from when Q got the starting gig till now with Jones.

 

Quentin 2008-2010

 

.256/.354/.507/.861 123 OPS+ 4.5 WAR

 

Jones 2008-2010

 

.202/.308/.407/.715 87 OPS+ 1.6 WAR

 

One year should not define them as hitters. Obviously one is going to go to Cooperstown when his career is over (IF he didn't use PEDs which has been questionable in itself mind you) Defensively.. no doubt. Wasn't too long ago people here wanted him DFA'd when he was much worse than Q, despite the D (I wasn't one of them especially only making 500K). Quentin has just been a mystery all in all this year. Dude was once one of the better defensive RFs in the minors since college (and was pretty good in his short stint as a D-Back) and all of a sudden goes back to his natural position and goes Jermaine Dye on us. (actually much worse) Could it be a bad year? Sure. But he is what he is at this point, and that is a guy who has not been the same defensively since f***ing up his shoulder and having surgery on it. He doesn't dive anymore busting it, he is taking bad routes, and actually forgot how to judge a fly ball off an angle from one year of being away from that position. All in all, looks very timid. It's like I'm watching two different people from the guy I saw at Stanford. (though he is also bulkier now than he was then, though he's always been solid in size)

 

Vance Law just went Kalapse on Ace.

 

And typical you on raggin someone without giving him the benefit of backing himself up before you declare the ownage. Keep those fingers off the keyboard for a sec. next time okay essay?

Edited September 13, 2010 by J.Reedfan8

[greg775]

just checked to see how horrible CQ's defense at right field is

 

He is dead last of all qualified MLB player in terms of UZR and UZR/150, with a UZR/150 of -28.8

 

Konerko is also in the bottom 10 in UZR/150 with -12.0

 

In case you were wondering, of the unqualified players, our golden boy Teahan at 3B has a UZR/150 of -24.2, and Kotsay at RF would a whopping -81.0 UZR/150

 

I'd say we need to fire our fielding coach

 

My eyes tell me Konerko is a damn good first baseman, stats be damned.

[hogan873]

My eyes tell me Konerko is a damn good first baseman, stats be damned.

I agree. He can pick throws out of the dirt (and he gets plenty of those) better than most. His range is limited, but to me it doesn't seem to adversely affect him too much.

[soxrwhite]

Keep trading until you get a five tool player at every position? Yeah right. Quentin is streaky but we know he can hit. He is 28 and our right fielder for the now and the future. Accept his defense and get behind him. With his injury record we must have a good utility outfielder to fill in.

[Balta1701]

Ozzie is "saving" Quentin to face Liriano and Duensing. Good call Ozzie, Quentin destroys LHP. At this point, seems like Quentin has played himself out of the organization. Very rarely do we see guys fall out of favor with Ozzie, KW, etc. and get back into their good graces.

What has given you the impression that he's fallen "Out of favor" with these guys? Despite Jones performing better, Quentin has continued to get at bats, and probably gotten more at bats than he deserved.

[GREEDY]

Accept his defense and get behind him.

 

The only thing getting behind Carlos is "low, looping, line drives".

[fathom]

What has given you the impression that he's fallen "Out of favor" with these guys? Despite Jones performing better, Quentin has continued to get at bats, and probably gotten more at bats than he deserved.

 

They just benched him two straight games without having any obvious physical ailments. When's the last time they did that with a starter?

[Balta1701]

They just benched him two straight games without having any obvious physical ailments. When's the last time they did that with a starter?

Am I wrong or haven't they done that regularly with people who have been struggling? I could have swore that Beckham got that treatment back in June, and he deserved/needed it. AJ sort of got it but he has the "the pitchers love him" deal going for him. I feel like Alexei got that last year. Rios definitely did.

[Vance Law]

One year should not define them as hitters.

 

How about the last 2 years?

 

Quentin WAR -.3

Jones WAR 2.6

 

Basically Quentin needs to put up MVP type numbers to be as worthwhile as Jones because his defense is such a nightmare.

 

 

 

 

[Vance Law]

I agree. He can pick throws out of the dirt (and he gets plenty of those) better than most. His range is limited, but to me it doesn't seem to adversely affect him too much.

 

Range is ultimately what UZR is judging, hence the low number for Konerko. I don't think it takes into account picking balls in the dirt which is definitely one of Paulie's strong suits.

[scotty22hotty]

I'd just roll the dice and have TCQ as the full time '11 DH and resign Jones as the RF

 

 

 

[thxfrthmmrs]

I'd just roll the dice and have TCQ as the full time '11 DH and resign Jones as the RF

 

 

if Quentin is willing to accept a full time DH at the young age of 29, then I think the Sox will be more than happy to keep him.

 

I am mean Quentin at DH can put up something like .250-30-100, and with more upside because his confidence will not be affected by his poor defense, and will keep him healthy thus leading to even better production

 

But then having both Jones and Quentin in the lineup means that we will have two homer happy guys in the everyday lineup who will not hit above .250, and possibly 3 if we go with Flowers at catcher, do we really want that?