Kenny & Ozzie at it again

[scenario]

Latest from Trib - like the DH decision, KW leaving this up to Ozzie.

 

Smart move. KW shows Ozzie respect, thus covering his *** while opening the door to other teams wanting to negotiate with Ozzie.

 

Next moves:

- Somebody offers Ozzie a longer deal

- The Sox want to wait until the end of next year before talking contract

- Ozzie says he loves the Sox but has to think of his family first

- Hello Miami

 

 

Edited September 23, 2010 by scenario

[LittleHurt05]

Ozzie played good D and sucked at everything else on the baseball field.

 

Watching Ozzie when I was a kid, I do always remember he was excellent at swinging and whiffing at the high fastball. Throw that kid a letter high heater, guaranteed strike 3.

[Balta1701]

Smart move. KW shows Ozzie respect, thus covering his *** while opening the door to other teams wanting to negotiate with Ozzie.

 

Next moves:

- Somebody offers Ozzie a longer deal

- The Sox want to wait until the end of next year before talking contract

- Ozzie says he loves the Sox but has to think of his family first

- Hello Miami

Really...if Ozzie's 1/4 as smart as everyone wants us to think he is...Miami isn't exactly a destination slot for head coaches. They're likely to be better next year as Stanton grows up...but playing before 18,000 fans at home on a good night isn't exactly exciting...and no matter how many homophobic remarks Ozzie makes, he's not going to be any better than #3 on the list of sports teams in Miami and number 8-10 in Sports Icons.

[soxrwhite]

I'm forever grateful for 2005. Having said that lets face it. It ain't workin'. Ozzie's teams always seem to fade the second half. Don't know why. Coop ain't all that. Teaches a pitcher to throw strikes, like no one ever thought of that before. Kenny's win now at all costs would be fine if he won now,but.......I guess I keep Kenny and bring in an experienced manager for another run at it before a total overhaul.

[Soxfest]

I am tired of the soap opera between the 2!

[soxsoxsoxsox]

Latest from Trib - like the DH decision, KW leaving this up to Ozzie.

 

pretty obv this was all ozzie's move to get out of his contract and kw said they would allow it. i don't expect ozzie back next year.

 

[IamtheHBOMB]

This is the most incorrect statement that has ever been posted on this message board. Ozzie Guillen was an incredibly bad hitter. In fact he was such a terrible hitter his career OBP was .287 and he never posted an OPS as high as Mark f***ing Kotsay's OPS is this year. And the guy also sucked at stealing bases yet tried to steal a ton early in his career anyway. Ozzie played good D and sucked at everything else on the baseball field.

 

99 is right on here. I was still a kid when Ozzie left as a FA in '97, but I distinctly remember watching him swing at pitches a foot outside the plate at-bat after at-bat. Dude was a terrible hitter and I was certain of that at the ripe old age of 10.

Edited September 23, 2010 by IamtheHBOMB

[BigSqwert]

Who the hell cares if he was or wasn't a good hitter? What does that have to do with anything now? If that mattered why did he hire s***ty hitters like Walker and Cora on his staff?

[NorthSideSox72]

Who the hell cares if he was or wasn't a good hitter? What does that have to do with anything now? If that mattered why did he hire s***ty hitters like Walker and Cora on his staff?

Walker was actually pretty good for a while, until he had a broken arm, then an aneurism, which eventually ended his career.

 

[MiddleCoastBias]

Really...if Ozzie's 1/4 as smart as everyone wants us to think he is...Miami isn't exactly a destination slot for head coaches. They're likely to be better next year as Stanton grows up...but playing before 18,000 fans at home on a good night isn't exactly exciting...and no matter how many homophobic remarks Ozzie makes, he's not going to be any better than #3 on the list of sports teams in Miami and number 8-10 in Sports Icons.

If this talk of how big his ego is true, this may actually be part of his plan With the new ballpark opening up in a couple years, the Marlins are looking to be a revitalized franchise. I can see Ozzie wanting to be the center of attention and the cornerstone of that new image in Florida. He brings a lot of attention to himself and whichever club he is with, and the addition of an awesome ballpark will (hopefully) bring new energy to the fans, positioning him as a beloved figure.

[Harry Chappas]

If this talk of how big his ego is true, this may actually be part of his plan With the new ballpark opening up in a couple years, the Marlins are looking to be a revitalized franchise. I can see Ozzie wanting to be the center of attention and the cornerstone of that new image in Florida. He brings a lot of attention to himself and whichever club he is with, and the addition of an awesome ballpark will (hopefully) bring new energy to the fans, positioning him as a beloved figure.

 

Loria, the Marlins owner has an ego the dwarfs anything the White Sox have to offer. He ran Girardi out of town why would he want Guillen.

 

Managers do not sell tickets.

[scenario]

Really...if Ozzie's 1/4 as smart as everyone wants us to think he is...Miami isn't exactly a destination slot for head coaches. They're likely to be better next year as Stanton grows up...but playing before 18,000 fans at home on a good night isn't exactly exciting...and no matter how many homophobic remarks Ozzie makes, he's not going to be any better than #3 on the list of sports teams in Miami and number 8-10 in Sports Icons.

 

Yeah, but...

 

He lives in Miami.

 

Plus it has a huge Hispanic population in which he could/would be a media megastar.

[justBLAZE]

Smart move. KW shows Ozzie respect, thus covering his *** while opening the door to other teams wanting to negotiate with Ozzie.

 

Next moves:

- Somebody offers Ozzie a longer deal

- The Sox want to wait until the end of next year before talking contract

- Ozzie says he loves the Sox but has to think of his family first

- Hello Miami

 

Or Ozzie still has a contract with the Sox and stays for 2011.

[Whitewashed in '05]

One thing that ozzie said that is true is that no one will replace the passion that he and his coaching staff have to make the white sox organization a winner. I agree, most of our coaches have been with the organization for a very long time and were with us as players. That being said, I don't think that's the only factor to winning.

[JohnCangelosi]

I recall when we signed Guillen, sometime in 2004, I told a friend from out of town that we had hired a star- mostly because he commanded respect, was likeable and wasn't a p**sy like Manuel was. The next year we won the World Series and I really believed it to be true....however, I don't feel that way anymore.

 

Ozzie's consistent:

 

* Leaving the starting pitcher in 2 outs too long

* Sacrifice bunting in a HR ballpark

* Overplaying of matchups in late innings (you have to go lefty on lefty right?!?!?!)

* Horrible lineups way too often

* Insistent love of horrible players like Mark Kotsay, Andy Gonzalez, et al

* Seemingly never making the right decision with Pitchers, at ANY time

 

I'm also interested in what the board hates about Ozzie in terms of management/tactical decisions?!??!!?

 

 

[greg775]

Another team may tempt Guillen with more long-term security. But the Sox offer potentially two more years in a city where Guillen is beloved and enjoys the benefit of the doubt — a fact he seemed to realize when telling a group of reporters he wants to stay in Chicago "the rest of my career."

 

Ha, most of "the city" agrees with me, not Saxtalk.

Read that story over and over how much Guillen is beloved. Ozzie rocks.

 

Also, nice way for Kenny to throw in his own ego about how are he is working. Poor, poor KW who put this piece of s*** second half product on the field. Hope you can sleep a few hours, Kenny, staying up all night.

 

"No, not for me," Williams said. "I won't rule that out one day. My competitiveness to win a world championship in Chicago has not waned one bit. The weariness from lack of sleep and trying to figure out how to right the ship, that's exhausting, yes. But I'm not tired of my job here."

 

[greg775]

99 is right on here. I was still a kid when Ozzie left as a FA in '97, but I distinctly remember watching him swing at pitches a foot outside the plate at-bat after at-bat. Dude was a terrible hitter and I was certain of that at the ripe old age of 10.

 

He was not a terrible hitter. He swings at everything much like Tank. He was a decent hitter and a good baseball player. He's also a damn good manager.

Whatever team he goes to I will start to follow and root for No. 2 behind the Sox. Guillen is very likeable.

[Kyyle23]

Greg, you define the term "with blinders on".

 

unreal

[RockRaines]

After reading Cowley's story, I don't see how anybody could want Kenny over Ozzie. Kenny sounds like an egomaniac with his restauranting and pretty boy attitude.

His acquisition of Teahen was a joke and his trade of Hudson for a similar type pitcher was equally dumb.

 

As far as Ozzie, he is an egomaniac as well. But at least he was a far better player than Kenny.

Give Ozzie another GM to work with.

 

Jerry's silence, however, makes me think he will back Kenny on this one. That's dumb. It's Ozzie over Kenny in this battle.

 

It is sad when former players come back to manage the team that made them famous. Because managers are hired to be fired and when Ozzie gets canned there will be hard feelings and he'll probably never be a Sox again.

Hal McRae was a great great Royal; now he never comes back after getting canned as manager.

To a lesser extent, Wathan was a very good Royal and though he works for the team now, there were hard feelings when he got canned.

It's why Frank White can't ever be manager.

KW has about 1% to do with Market, he doesnt make any decisions and is an owner by name only. Cowley clearly hasnt done much research on that establishment.

[That funky motion]

I got this from a radio guy who comes in my business. He said, he ran into Ozzie's son at the East Bank Club. Ozzie's son said that if the Sox don't sign Oz to an longer deal, that Oz will call Jim Hendry personally, to try to manage the Cubs.

[RockRaines]

I recall when we signed Guillen, sometime in 2004, I told a friend from out of town that we had hired a star- mostly because he commanded respect, was likeable and wasn't a p**sy like Manuel was. The next year we won the World Series and I really believed it to be true....however, I don't feel that way anymore.

 

Ozzie's consistent:

 

* Leaving the starting pitcher in 2 outs too long

* Sacrifice bunting in a HR ballpark

* Overplaying of matchups in late innings (you have to go lefty on lefty right?!?!?!)

* Horrible lineups way too often

* Insistent love of horrible players like Mark Kotsay, Andy Gonzalez, et al

* Seemingly never making the right decision with Pitchers, at ANY time

 

I'm also interested in what the board hates about Ozzie in terms of management/tactical decisions?!??!!?

How many of those points are skewed by your only seeing the situation when it goes wrong?

 

The resurgence of Jon Garland was attributed to Ozzie keeping him in longer in outings giving him confidence.

 

I would like to know how many times he has made the correct decision with pitchers vs the incorrect decision. Perception in this case is skewed by a negative outcome and the emotions attached to it.

[RockRaines]

I got this from a radio guy who comes in my business. He said, he ran into Ozzie's son at the East Bank Club. Ozzie's son said that if the Sox don't sign Oz to an longer deal, that Oz will call Jim Hendry personally, to try to manage the Cubs.

Which son? I see a few of them on my block and I'd be more than happy to try and confirm this even though I think its BS.

[greg775]

Greg, you define the term "with blinders on".

 

unreal

 

 

I got this from a radio guy who comes in my business. He said, he ran into Ozzie's son at the East Bank Club. Ozzie's son said that if the Sox don't sign Oz to an longer deal, that Oz will call Jim Hendry personally, to try to manage the Cubs.

 

1.) The article called him a beloved figure in the city of Chicago. He's a veteran trusted reporter. And you say I have the blinders on??

The guy with the pen in his hand backs me.

 

2.) That story has BS all over it. He'd have one of his people call the Cubs to say he's interested.

[soxrwhite]

I got this from a radio guy who comes in my business. He said, he ran into Ozzie's son at the East Bank Club. Ozzie's son said that if the Sox don't sign Oz to an longer deal, that Oz will call Jim Hendry personally, to try to manage the Cubs.

 

So the sox can never get rid of any player, coach, or manager because he might find success with the cubs and make the sox look bad? Screw that and the cubs too!

[JohnCangelosi]

How many of those points are skewed by your only seeing the situation when it goes wrong?

 

The resurgence of Jon Garland was attributed to Ozzie keeping him in longer in outings giving him confidence.

 

I would like to know how many times he has made the correct decision with pitchers vs the incorrect decision. Perception in this case is skewed by a negative outcome and the emotions attached to it.

Ozzie has consistently made poor decisions with our pitching staff, even in 2005 he did, but things worked out that year all the way around. How about leaving in Scott Linebrink at Wrigley Field after giving up a 3 run homer to Derrick Lee to make it a 5-4 ballgame? And the next guy hits it out to tie the game off him???

 

THAT WAS ABSOLUTELY A NO BRAINER TO PULL LINEY there. And he didn't.

 

He made the same mistake this year a million times, I am sure you don't want to go through each instance, but he's flat out an awful decision maker and it's sickening to see him get out managed consistently and watch us get our brains beat in by the Twins year in year out.