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2010-2011 NBA Thread


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QUOTE (bmags @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 04:40 PM)
I think his whole section on memphis is very spot on. Frankly if the bulls had to play memphis in the first round I'd be very very worried. They played us hard.

 

The Blazers are the team I think nobody wants to play. They've got some serious length, athleticism and they're deep as hell. It's a shame Roy has fallen off so greatly (though he's still a solid player) and Oden has become Bowie/Olowokandi part 2.

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QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 05:05 PM)
The Blazers are the team I think nobody wants to play. They've got some serious length, athleticism and they're deep as hell. It's a shame Roy has fallen off so greatly (though he's still a solid player) and Oden has become Bowie/Olowokandi part 2.

The whole bottom of the West(minus NO) is pretty damn dangerous to be honest.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 01:53 PM)
I'm not counting my chips before they're cashed. A couple years ago, it looked like Chris Paul was going to be a monster. Chris Paul's best seasons were at age 23-24, with his team peaking at age 23...then he got hurt, and now it's an open question whether he'll ever get to where he was before, since all it takes is just a little loss of quickness for a guy like this to fall back towards good but not amazing.

 

On top of that, who knows if there'll even be an NBA season next year.

 

That's why I wanted a SG this year...because this is the Bulls's chance. They might or might not get another one.

 

Well anything could happen. Without the benefit of foresight, I will remain ridiculously optimistic for our future. In terms of what could have been, imagine how good this team could have been if we had kept Aldridge and never traded for Tyrus. We'd have a fixture at the 4/5 and wouldn't have needed to spend the money on Boozer, which could have gone for someone else.

 

Oh well. I hate you Tyrus.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 01:53 PM)
I'm not counting my chips before they're cashed. A couple years ago, it looked like Chris Paul was going to be a monster. Chris Paul's best seasons were at age 23-24, with his team peaking at age 23...then he got hurt, and now it's an open question whether he'll ever get to where he was before, since all it takes is just a little loss of quickness for a guy like this to fall back towards good but not amazing.

 

On top of that, who knows if there'll even be an NBA season next year.

 

That's why I wanted a SG this year...because this is the Bulls's chance. They might or might not get another one.

 

Chris Paul's not a great PG anymore? Missed that memo. Still takes a damn good PG to lead that Hornets team to 46 wins thus far.

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QUOTE (MurcieOne @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 07:16 PM)
Well anything could happen. Without the benefit of foresight, I will remain ridiculously optimistic for our future. In terms of what could have been, imagine how good this team could have been if we had kept Aldridge and never traded for Tyrus. We'd have a fixture at the 4/5 and wouldn't have needed to spend the money on Boozer, which could have gone for someone else.

 

Oh well. I hate you Tyrus.

 

yeah, but maybe aldridge provides a few extra wins 4 years ago and rose goes elsewhere

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QUOTE (MHizzle85 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 08:37 PM)
Chris Paul's not a great PG anymore? Missed that memo. Still takes a damn good PG to lead that Hornets team to 46 wins thus far.

You CANNOT tell me that Chris Paul this season was the player he was in 2007-2008 and expect me to believe it.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 07:46 PM)
You CANNOT tell me that Chris Paul this season was the player he was in 2007-2008 and expect me to believe it.

 

The only real difference is he doesnt shoot as much now. The team around him just isn't very good and I don't think West will be too successful either when he leaves this off-season unless paired with another elite PG.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 07:46 PM)
You CANNOT tell me that Chris Paul this season was the player he was in 2007-2008 and expect me to believe it.

Other than PPG, his numbers aren't much off. You could argue PPG is down because he's taking 5 less shots on average a game than he was during those years.

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QUOTE (Felix @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 10:03 PM)
Chris Paul > Derrick Rose

 

Have at it.

 

Probably depends on the situation. In Miami? Hell yes. On this Bulls team, no way.

 

Derrick Rose carries the entire load for the offense. He is involved in almost 60% of the points the Bulls score, one way or another. Chris Paul isn't exactly known for his scoring, especially in the past two years. If you ask him to take a higher volume of shots, his efficiency will most likely go down. On top of that, the Bulls are probably a below average shooting team if you take Rose' ability to create open perimeter shots with his ability to break down the defense, something Chris Paul is not known to do (only 16% of his points are scored inside).

 

Rose is perfect for the Bulls' current situation, whereas Chris Paul is much better when you have better shooters around him who don't need him to create open shots for them. Hence, Miami. LeBron, as good of a ball-handler as he is for his size, is a turn-over machine. If you put Paul on that team, not only do they become much more organized, they also probably get more production from their big men with his passing.

 

The two guys are different types of point guards. If you're talking about point guard ability alone, Paul wins in a landslide. But Rose is the better scorer (maybe not as efficient as Paul, but if Paul took 21 shots a game, I don't think his TS% will be 58%).

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QUOTE (chw42 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 10:19 PM)
Probably depends on the situation. In Miami? Hell yes. On this Bulls team, no way.

 

Derrick Rose carries the entire load for the offense. He is involved in almost 60% of the points the Bulls score, one way or another. Chris Paul isn't exactly known for his scoring, especially in the past two years. If you ask him to take a higher volume of shots, his efficiency will most likely go down. On top of that, the Bulls are probably a below average shooting team if you take Rose' ability to create open perimeter shots with his ability to break down the defense, something Chris Paul is not known to do (only 16% of his points are scored inside).

 

Rose is perfect for the Bulls' current situation, whereas Chris Paul is much better when you have better shooters around him who don't need him to create open shots for them. Hence, Miami. LeBron, as good of a ball-handler as he is for his size, is a turn-over machine. If you put Paul on that team, not only do they become much more organized, they also probably get more production from their big men with his passing.

 

The two guys are different types of point guards. If you're talking about point guard ability alone, Paul wins in a landslide. But Rose is the better scorer (maybe not as efficient as Paul, but if Paul took 21 shots a game, I don't think his TS% will be 58%).

Yeah, without a doubt. In all reality, it's a pretty close draw between the two of them given their drastically different styles. If I'm building a team from scratch, I'd probably take Paul, especially given how much he's carried the Hornets year in and out. His supporting cast is not pretty at all.

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QUOTE (Felix @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 10:03 PM)
Chris Paul > Derrick Rose

 

Have at it.

 

Felix, at this point it really seems like you're trolling.

 

No one is going Aldridge > Love out of nowhere, even though I know you will be (rightfully) furious if Aldridge gets the MIP.

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QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 11:26 PM)
Felix, at this point it really seems like you're trolling.

 

No one is going Aldridge > Love out of nowhere, even though I know you will be (rightfully) furious if Aldridge gets the MIP.

That was a pretty trolly post, without a doubt. I do seriously think that you can make a legit argument for Paul over Rose however, as chw42 pointed out above. I'm not going to bother doing so, as the responses will be the same as all the others that have been in this thread (eye test, I STUCK WITH THE TEAM WHEN THEY WERE BAD SO I CAN MAKE WHATEVER ARGUMENT I WANT AND BE RIGHT BECAUSE I'M A THE BEST FAN EVER AND YOU AREN'T, team is the best in the league, etc.).

 

And Aldridge certainly has a very real case for MIP, as do a lot of other players (including Rose, although he won't get it). I wouldn't be too pissed either way, to be honest.

Edited by Felix
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Before this season I would have taken CP3 over Rose for sure.

 

But CP3 has got big time issues with his knees, and we all have seen what happens to a PG when you lose your quickness and can't beat anyone off the dribble (Agent Zero).

 

Right now I'd probably just lean towards Rose, although I think CP3 is a better "pure" point guard.

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QUOTE (DBAHO @ Apr 12, 2011 -> 04:13 AM)
Before this season I would have taken CP3 over Rose for sure.

 

But CP3 has got big time issues with his knees, and we all have seen what happens to a PG when you lose your quickness and can't beat anyone off the dribble (Agent Zero).

 

Right now I'd probably just lean towards Rose, although I think CP3 is a better "pure" point guard.

 

Agreed completely. And I actually hope Rose can reach Paul's 07-08 levels. People forget how incredible he was. (many would argue Kobe took his MVP)

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QUOTE (SoxAce @ Apr 12, 2011 -> 10:43 PM)
Agreed completely. And I actually hope Rose can reach Paul's 07-08 levels. People forget how incredible he was. (many would argue Kobe took his MVP)

Was that the season NO made the Conference Finals?

 

If so, I'd agree with that because Paul's basically dealing with a pretty similar sort of supporting cast now (except when Peja was decent).

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 11, 2011 -> 01:53 PM)
I'm not counting my chips before they're cashed. A couple years ago, it looked like Chris Paul was going to be a monster. Chris Paul's best seasons were at age 23-24, with his team peaking at age 23...then he got hurt, and now it's an open question whether he'll ever get to where he was before, since all it takes is just a little loss of quickness for a guy like this to fall back towards good but not amazing.

 

On top of that, who knows if there'll even be an NBA season next year.

 

That's why I wanted a SG this year...because this is the Bulls's chance. They might or might not get another one.

Umm, WTF. Chris Paul is still a phenomenal point guard. He's shooting less and get to the line a bit less frequently but his shooting averages are almost spot on with career numbers. He has a horrible Hornets team competing.

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QUOTE (DBAHO @ Apr 12, 2011 -> 04:13 AM)
Before this season I would have taken CP3 over Rose for sure.

 

But CP3 has got big time issues with his knees, and we all have seen what happens to a PG when you lose your quickness and can't beat anyone off the dribble (Agent Zero).

 

Right now I'd probably just lean towards Rose, although I think CP3 is a better "pure" point guard.

What is a "pure" PG?

 

I find it hard for anyone to argue that there is a better player that Rose at the PG position, period. Pure or impure (whatever the hell that means), there isnt another PG you would take over him if you were starting a team.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Apr 12, 2011 -> 11:39 AM)
What is a "pure" PG?

 

I find it hard for anyone to argue that there is a better player that Rose at the PG position, period. Pure or impure (whatever the hell that means), there isnt another PG you would take over him if you were starting a team.

I'd take it one step further. There isn't another PG you would take over him if you were starting a team, or if you had one game to win right now.

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