2010 ALCS: Rangers vs. Yankees

[Harry Chappas]

Would the Rangers Giants be the least watched world series ever.

 

I can give you the Cincinnati Reds starting line-up from 1976 but would struggle to name the 8 starters from either of those teams.

[fathom]

gonna vomit when the yanks sign him.

 

Much rather they get him than the Tigers or Twins, two teams that he's been linked to this upcoming offseason.

[bigruss]

Much rather they get him than the Tigers or Twins, two teams that he's been linked to this upcoming offseason.

It'll be interesting to see where everyone ends up, because apparently Grienke is on the market too now, which could really affect where Lee gets the best offer.

[Balta1701]

Would the Rangers Giants be the least watched world series ever

No one should care about world series ratings at all. Even the people who work at Fox shouldn't.

 

Baseball, unlike other sports, doesn't get a high percentage of its cash from the end of year tournament. Its tournament is smaller, and the bulk of the league's revenue comes from getting people into ballparks. Getting new teams into the World Series (usually) provides a huge boost to the fanbase of the teams that make and win it. On top of that, you get a whole new market for merchandise sales. Even if you don't have the precious, precious, precious NYC market watching the series at a high share, you still get a win.

[fathom]

It'll be interesting to see where everyone ends up, because apparently Grienke is on the market too now, which could really affect where Lee gets the best offer.

 

I've always felt that when Greinke gets traded, it will be to Atlanta.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I've always felt that when Greinke gets traded, it will be to Atlanta.

They've got a bevy of premium pitching prospects not too far away from The Show. They need offense like I need crack.

[fathom]

They've got a bevy of premium pitching prospects not too far away from The Show. They need offense like I need crack.

 

I saw they released Melky today. Wouldn't shock me to see Cabrera with the Sox next year, as he's always been rumored to be a KW favorite.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I saw they released Melky today. Wouldn't shock me to see Cabrera with the Sox next year, as he's always been rumored to be a KW favorite.

Cmon man, I'm already down as it is on the Sox. I'll start fireballing if that happened. I can't take Juan Pierre AND Melky Cabrera. I'll off myself.

[Milkman delivers]

Yankees now cannot win in New York.

 

If the Rangers manage to win tonight, it seems almost impossible that they'd lose the series. Go Texas!

 

Ugh, imagine if they didn't blow that first game.

 

It'll be interesting to see where everyone ends up, because apparently Grienke is on the market too now, which could really affect where Lee gets the best offer.

 

Too bad Kenny won't be able to pull off a trade for a legitimately good Royals player.

[Balta1701]

Too bad Kenny won't be able to pull off a trade for a legitimately good Royals player.

If you were trading for Greinke, which price would you expect to pay...the price for the 2009, best pitcher in baseball guy, or the price for the above average but no where near dominant every year but 2009 guy?

 

If I were the Royals, I'd be asking for the kind of deal the Mariners got for Cliff Lee...a huge, top level prospect guy, which is the value of a recent cy young winner...but Greinke has only been that guy for 1 year, and he wasn't that guy in 2010.

 

Would you give up Beckham, for example, for a guy with a 4.72 ERA in the 2nd half of 2010?

[WhiteSoxfan1986]

Why the hell did Ron Washington use Feliz in an 8-0 game last night?

[Balta1701]

Why the hell did Ron Washington use Feliz in an 8-0 game last night?

Did you see how Feliz performed in his first outing? He was shaky and wild. He's getting him comfortable and back in rhythm.

 

I don't think they have any rules against using him in 3 consecutive games if needbe, and he went over a week without pitching before Sunday, IIRC.

[witesoxfan]

If you were trading for Greinke, which price would you expect to pay...the price for the 2009, best pitcher in baseball guy, or the price for the above average but no where near dominant every year but 2009 guy?

 

If I were the Royals, I'd be asking for the kind of deal the Mariners got for Cliff Lee...a huge, top level prospect guy, which is the value of a recent cy young winner...but Greinke has only been that guy for 1 year, and he wasn't that guy in 2010.

 

Would you give up Beckham, for example, for a guy with a 4.72 ERA in the 2nd half of 2010?

 

If the Sox needed another starting pitcher, you bet your sweet ass I would. The Royals defense was absolutely dreadful last year and was a huge reason Greinke put up mediocre numbers.

[Balta1701]

If the Sox needed another starting pitcher, you bet your sweet ass I would. The Royals defense was absolutely dreadful last year and was a huge reason Greinke put up mediocre numbers.

Really? Greinke's K/9 in 09 was 9.5, his career number is 7.6, and he was back to 7.4 last year. His career BB/9 is 2.3, and it was 2.0 in 09 and 2.3 in 2010. He gave up a lot more fly balls in 2010 than in 2009, so he wound up giving up a lot more hits. But if his defense was failing to field balls put in play, his BABIP should have shot up, and instead it was .309 in 2008, .307 in 2009, and .309 in 2010.

[witesoxfan]

Really? Greinke's K/9 in 09 was 9.5, his career number is 7.6, and he was back to 7.4 last year. His career BB/9 is 2.3, and it was 2.0 in 09 and 2.3 in 2010. He gave up a lot more fly balls in 2010 than in 2009, so he wound up giving up a lot more hits. But if his defense was failing to field balls put in play, his BABIP should have shot up, and instead it was .309 in 2008, .307 in 2009, and .309 in 2010.

 

The main difference between Greinke's 2010 season and his 2009 season from a pitching independent scenario is that 60 or so of his strikeouts in 2010 (guaranteed outs) were turned into ground balls in 2010 (generally easy outs or singles). Seriously

 

2009 - 242 K 239 GB 242 FB 116 LD

2010 - 181 K 303 GB 239 FB 117 LD

 

He also saw his HR/9 rise, though it's still below league average (from his freakish 4.5 HR/FB in 2009 to a more realistic 7.5 HR/FB).

 

The biggest outlier in his entire season was his LOB%. For his career, it's 72.5%, and from 2005-2009 it never dipped below 75.2%. In 2010, it was 65.3%. That indicates pretty poor luck on batted balls too.

 

I'd say Greinke is still an elite pitcher and he suffered quite a bit of bad luck last year, and I'd trade anybody in the system for Zach Greinke.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Really? Greinke's K/9 in 09 was 9.5, his career number is 7.6, and he was back to 7.4 last year. His career BB/9 is 2.3, and it was 2.0 in 09 and 2.3 in 2010. He gave up a lot more fly balls in 2010 than in 2009, so he wound up giving up a lot more hits. But if his defense was failing to field balls put in play, his BABIP should have shot up, and instead it was .309 in 2008, .307 in 2009, and .309 in 2010.

Is this Balta or chw42?

[Milkman delivers]

If you were trading for Greinke, which price would you expect to pay...the price for the 2009, best pitcher in baseball guy, or the price for the above average but no where near dominant every year but 2009 guy?

 

If I were the Royals, I'd be asking for the kind of deal the Mariners got for Cliff Lee...a huge, top level prospect guy, which is the value of a recent cy young winner...but Greinke has only been that guy for 1 year, and he wasn't that guy in 2010.

 

Would you give up Beckham, for example, for a guy with a 4.72 ERA in the 2nd half of 2010?

 

It was more of a joke regarding our love of marginal Royals players. He would definitely cost a lot, and we don't need arms in the rotation.

[Jordan4life_2007]

The main difference between Greinke's 2010 season and his 2009 season from a pitching independent scenario is that 60 or so of his strikeouts in 2010 (guaranteed outs) were turned into ground balls in 2010 (generally easy outs or singles). Seriously

 

2009 - 242 K 239 GB 242 FB 116 LD

2010 - 181 K 303 GB 239 FB 117 LD

 

He also saw his HR/9 rise, though it's still below league average (from his freakish 4.5 HR/FB in 2009 to a more realistic 7.5 HR/FB).

 

The biggest outlier in his entire season was his LOB%. For his career, it's 72.5%, and from 2005-2009 it never dipped below 75.2%. In 2010, it was 65.3%. That indicates pretty poor luck on batted balls too.

 

I'd say Greinke is still an elite pitcher and he suffered quite a bit of bad luck last year, and I'd trade anybody in the system for Zach Greinke.

Anybody in the system? Lol. That's not very bold. But would u trade Beckham? And no more alcohol for u if u say yes.

Edited October 19, 2010 by Jordan4life

[Wanne]

Anybody in the system? Lol. That's not very bold. But would u trade Beckham? And no more alcohol for u if u say yes.

 

I'd trade Beckham in a heartbeat in the right deal. Like many have said tho...his value really isn't that high right now. Tell ya what...I just have a bad feeling about him right now for some reason. He looked absolutely clueless at the plate this past year except for a few mini-streaks. Love to see him turn it around...but it really wouldn't surprise me if he got sent down at some point next year. Hope I'm wrong.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I'd trade Beckham in a heartbeat in the right deal. Like many have said tho...his value really isn't that high right now. Tell ya what...I just have a bad feeling about him right now for some reason. He looked absolutely clueless at the plate this past year except for a few mini-streaks. Love to see him turn it around...but it really wouldn't surprise me if he got sent down at some point next year. Hope I'm wrong.

For another pitcher? And who's our 2B, Retherford? Like Balta said, outside of '09 Greinke has been pretty ordinary. This franchise desperately needs to come up wit some premium position talent. I'm nowhere close to giving up on Gordon.

[witesoxfan]

Anybody in the system? Lol. That's not very bold. But would u trade Beckham? And no more alcohol for u if u say yes.

 

If the Sox needed another starting pitcher, you bet your sweet ass I would (trade Beckham). The Royals defense was absolutely dreadful last year and was a huge reason Greinke put up mediocre numbers.

 

Beckham looks to be a pretty damn good player, but what exactly is his ceiling? Is he a .310/.400/.525/.925 type of player? Or is he a .290/.360/.490 type of player? Or is he a .270/.350/.450 kind of player?

 

We know Beckham is good, but I don't know how good he is, and 2B can be pretty readily found on the free agent market. If the Sox needed someone to play 2B right now, they could easily go after Orlando Hudson, Mark Ellis, or Omar Infante (or Juan Uribe!) and they would be adequate. There are also other candidates all around the majors, like Howie Kendrick, Chone Figgins, Jose Lopez, Jed Lowrie, Marco Scutaro...a 2B could be brought in from outside the organization. I don't know how many of those players are available nor how much they would cost, but I imagine you could get some at a relatively decent price.

 

I still believe Zach Grienke is still a top 5-10 pitcher in the AL and have no reason to think otherwise. The Sox, as good of a rotation as they may have, don't really have an ace, shutdown type pitcher. Greinke could absolutely be that guy.

 

So, if the Sox decide they want to trade two starting pitchers this year and then include Beckham in a package for Greinke, you bet your ass I'd be on board with that.

[Balta1701]

I still believe Zach Grienke is still a top 5-10 pitcher in the AL and have no reason to think otherwise. The Sox, as good of a rotation as they may have, don't really have an ace, shutdown type pitcher. Greinke could absolutely be that guy.

Greinke was #28 in the AL in ERA this year, 18th in k/9IP, had a worse WHIP than D1, etc.

 

I'm not sure what numbers are out there to say he didnt' have a top 5-10 year, but pretty much all of them say he was somewhere between D1 and Buehrle.

[witesoxfan]

7th in FIP at 3.34...the 6 ahead of him were Lee, Liriano, Verlander, Felix, Weaver, and Lester. The 3 behind him were Price, Floyd, and Sabathia

9th in xFIP - the 8 ahead of him were Liriano, Lee, Hernandez, Lester, Weaver, Verlander, Shields, and Romero. The 3 behind him were Sabathia, Floyd, and Scherzer.

 

If you put him on the White Sox with an infield defense of from 3B-1B of Morel, Ramirez, Beckham, and Konerko, and I think his ERA is 3.50-3.75. The Royals had a -0.8 UZR at 1B, -5.6 at 2B, -9.5 at SS, and -15.1 at 3B. The White Sox had a -13.9 UZR at 1B, -2.3 at 2B, 12.2 at SS, and -18.4 at 3B. The only two huge differences I see are at 1B (where UZR's legitimacy has been debated) and SS, where the difference between the two teams is 21.8. Knowing the reputation of how bad Betancourt is defensively, and how good Ramirez looked this year, I would say that there were quite a few groundballs that Betancourt did not get to that Ramirez would have, and that alone decreases his WHIP and BAA and will directly and indirectly save runs by preventing hits with runners on base and preventing base runners in general. The Royals entire OF defense put up a -12.1 UZR, while the White Sox OF defense put up a -6.9 UZR. That's gonna save runs too.

 

If Greinke does get traded this winter, I hope whatever team trades for him has a good defense, because he's an absolute monster.

[SoxAce]

Tell ya what...I just have a bad feeling about him right now for some reason. He looked absolutely clueless at the plate this past year except for a few mini-streaks.

 

Someone should pull up Beckham's stats post all-star break.

[Balta1701]

Someone should pull up Beckham's stats post all-star break.

Really? You can't do that one yourself in the time it took to write this post?