R. Soriano, Fielder, Kemp mentioned in connection w/ Sox

[Balta1701]

Not really. He hit .217/.335/.427/.762 with RISP this year, and a paltry .169/.344/.366/.710 with RISP and 2 out- add to that a total of almost 100 strikeouts in those 2 situations. Those are the stats that count to me. He's not a horrible offensive player, he just isn't great. His defense IS horrible. I'd take PK any day of the week over that dude.

And in 2009 he hit .283 with a 1.019 OPS with RISP. Did you stop to think that you might be looking at a sample size issue there?

 

I'm not saying I wouldn't take PK14 at 1b over him, you never said that. You said his 40 HR are useless, garbage time HR.

[greg775]

First point:

 

1. How on Earth can we judge what Viciedo's 1b defense would be like? He's barely played there, he bounced back and forth between 1b and 3b this season to get at bats, despite his size he's probably going to wind up having better reactions/instincts/speed/range than PK14 because he is somewhat athletic.

 

2. How on Earth can you say "our 1b defense will be atrocious" and "I want Fielder" in the same post? Either you care about 1b defense or you don't.

 

I meant Fielder as DH

[Balta1701]

I meant Fielder as DH

I have 1 big reason why I don't want Fielder as a DH...I don't want to spend the kind of money it would take to keep him and only have him at DH...and I don't want to give up the cost it would take to trade for him and only have him at DH.

[MiddleCoastBias]

Why has the talk about Adrian Gonzalez died off for us now? I know the Padres got off to a hot start so we knew we wouldn't get him early but it still looks like he could be had this off-season by a number of teams. I know there was the issue with FA coming up ( after '11, right?), but isn't that the same case for Fielder? If they are in the same boat in terms of years remaining, I would much rather have Adrian due to both his defensive and offensive capabilities. Is there a reason we're not mentioned in his rumors now?

[gatnom]

Why has the talk about Adrian Gonzalez died off for us now? I know the Padres got off to a hot start so we knew we wouldn't get him early but it still looks like he could be had this off-season by a number of teams. I know there was the issue with FA coming up ( after '11, right?), but isn't that the same case for Fielder? If they are in the same boat in terms of years remaining, I would much rather have Adrian due to both his defensive and offensive capabilities. Is there a reason we're not mentioned in his rumors now?

 

Without even thinking about whether or not the Padres want to trade him, what do we have that they (or the Brewers for that matter) would want in a trade? The only players with value we have are expensive, so it doesn't really make sense for us to acquire either Gonzalez or Fielder because the sole reason they wish to trade them is that they won't be able to afford them for much longer.

 

[southsideirish71]

Typical offseason crap.

 

1.) Over the next 4 months we will get linked to all sorts of players, only to get peoples hopes up.

2.) Then the inevitable post about how "Kenny only operates under the radar, if you see someone linked he won't be here."

3.) Then the counter thread talking about how Kenny picked up X player he has loved and has been linked to all year.

4.) Then some of the players go off the board. Then the debates about how X team overpaid or got the player for the cheap.

5.) Then a thread about how Reinsdorf if cheap, with a counter on how he pretty much dumps what they make in revenue into the team.

6.) Then we sign someone or trade for someone and over reaction city happens.

 

Now the warning sign of inactivity is when you get the catch phrases, "We really like our kids", "Some GMs really want everything for their players, two sides are necessary to make a trade", and of course the "Well the money we don't spend now, we will have available for the stretch run"

 

The big deal is the Konerko situation. That will drive how we spend our money more than anything. They need to ramp up the offense, get a real DH or actual hitters who can provide production at DH. Hopefully no retreads, or ex-1990's Cleveland Indians, or other players Kenny had a crush on when they were good 8 years ago. I think we have run our course with the Frankenstein lets put a few batteries, some duct tape, and string and run them out there as a productive part of our team.

 

Its early. Wait till the GM meetings before this gets into the true swing of things.

 

 

 

[Balta1701]

Without even thinking about whether or not the Padres want to trade him, what do we have that they (or the Brewers for that matter) would want in a trade? The only players with value we have are expensive, so it doesn't really make sense for us to acquire either Gonzalez or Fielder because the sole reason they wish to trade them is that they won't be able to afford them for much longer.

It's also worth noting that we probably don't have the bullets to get Gonzalez after the Hudson trade either. We can't deal Sale even as a PTBNL until December (and they're probably not going to want him to stay in our org for 6 months after a deal). The only pieces we'd really have to move in the minors are Viciedo and Morel...everyone else is down at lower levels or failing (Flowers). Viciedo, Morel, Flowers, and a throw in pitcher or two...I wouldn't take that if I were the Padres, I'd call up the Red Sox and make them an offer.

[Sox72]

Its been made clear for the past couple years, Detroit's season ticket holder base has collapsed in an epic way, and they are cutting, cutting, cutting. They aren't spending that kind of money for 2011, I'll bet the farm on that.

 

Our farm? That's not offering much.

[witesoxfan]

Not really. He hit .217/.335/.427/.762 with RISP this year, and a paltry .169/.344/.366/.710 with RISP and 2 out- add to that a total of almost 100 strikeouts in those 2 situations. Those are the stats that count to me. He's not a horrible offensive player, he just isn't great. His defense IS horrible. I'd take PK any day of the week over that dude.

 

He's put up a .231/.411/.478/.890 line with RISP in his career. Which is a better sample size - 1707 PAs or 191 PAs?

He's put up a .214/.429/.443/.872 line with RISP and 2 outs in his career. He's walked more than he's struck out in those situations. Which is a better sample size - 771 PAs or 90 PAs?

 

Yes, his average is low, because he does not hit for average. His OBP is higher with RISP w/ 2 outs because teams won't pitch to him unless they have a definitive advantage in that circumstance, hence the 9 IBBs this past year and the 69 IBBs in those situations throughout his career.

 

Food for thought - Konerko is a career .284/.372/.479/.851 hitter with RISP in his career (2109 PAs) and a .236/.348/.415/.763 hitter with RISP w/ 2 outs in his career (976 PAs), and teams are obviously not afraid to go after him considering he only has 27 IBBs in his career in those situations (again, Dunn has 69). The first is worse than Dunn, and the second is considerably worse than Dunn. If you suggest that Dunn isn't a great offensive player, then Paul Konerko isn't either.

Edited October 30, 2010 by witesoxfan

[Jerksticks]

He's put up a .231/.411/.478/.890 line with RISP in his career. Which is a better sample size - 1707 PAs or 191 PAs?

He's put up a .214/.429/.443/.872 line with RISP and 2 outs in his career. He's walked more than he's struck out in those situations. Which is a better sample size - 771 PAs or 90 PAs?

 

Yes, his average is low, because he does not hit for average. His OBP is higher with RISP w/ 2 outs because teams won't pitch to him unless they have a definitive advantage in that circumstance, hence the 9 IBBs this past year and the 69 IBBs in those situations throughout his career.

 

Food for thought - Konerko is a career .284/.372/.479/.851 hitter with RISP in his career (2109 PAs) and a .236/.348/.415/.763 hitter with RISP w/ 2 outs in his career (976 PAs), and teams are obviously not afraid to go after him considering he only has 27 IBBs in his career in those situations (again, Dunn has 69). The first is worse than Dunn, and the second is considerably worse than Dunn. If you suggest that Dunn isn't a great offensive player, then Paul Konerko isn't either.

 

Totally agree. I just fail to see how signing Dunn over Konerko is an upgrade; slightly better offense in theory with WAY worse defense. There's no way he picks balls as well as Paulie so the entire infield takes a step back too..sorry Buehrle. Add to that the fact that we have to sign him for more money, more years and lose our draft pick. No thanks, let's resign the captain. Let the cubs have Dunn.

[ScottyDo]

He's put up a .231/.411/.478/.890 line with RISP in his career. Which is a better sample size - 1707 PAs or 191 PAs?

He's put up a .214/.429/.443/.872 line with RISP and 2 outs in his career. He's walked more than he's struck out in those situations. Which is a better sample size - 771 PAs or 90 PAs?

 

Yes, his average is low, because he does not hit for average. His OBP is higher with RISP w/ 2 outs because teams won't pitch to him unless they have a definitive advantage in that circumstance, hence the 9 IBBs this past year and the 69 IBBs in those situations throughout his career.

 

Food for thought - Konerko is a career .284/.372/.479/.851 hitter with RISP in his career (2109 PAs) and a .236/.348/.415/.763 hitter with RISP w/ 2 outs in his career (976 PAs), and teams are obviously not afraid to go after him considering he only has 27 IBBs in his career in those situations (again, Dunn has 69). The first is worse than Dunn, and the second is considerably worse than Dunn. If you suggest that Dunn isn't a great offensive player, then Paul Konerko isn't either.

I think that has a LOT to do with protection. Paulie has batted in front of some good players. I can't think of one good batter Dunn has batted in front of. I'm also not much of a Reds/Nats expert.

[witesoxfan]

I think that has a LOT to do with protection. Paulie has batted in front of some good players. I can't think of one good batter Dunn has batted in front of. I'm also not much of a Reds/Nats expert.

 

Over the past two seasons, he's batted in front of Josh Willingham most of the time. Willingham isn't exactly a slouch, but he is right handed, which is a large factor in this. Hitting left handed works to Dunn's advantage.

[Eminor3rd]

I just want to mention that I really think we DON'T want Fielder, given what he'll cost. Consider: he'll make roughly $16m in arbitration this year, and he'll command a ridiculous $20m+ salary afterwards -- one we should NOT give him. He's a terrible defender with old player skills, and he's gonna cost Texeira/AGonz money, who are elite defenders.

 

If we're considering one year of Fielder at the price of $16m + top prospects, I think I'd rather take one year of Konerko at $10m + no prospects.

 

EDIT: That being said, I am totally in favor of "shaking things up." I'd totally sign Dunn for 4 years at $10-12m before I'd bring Konerko back at a similar cost with fewer years, if solely for the age difference. I'd also be in favor of trying to give Kemp a "change of scenery" as long as he played RF and we left Rios in CF. However, wouldn't it be so much nicer, if we're gonna trade some prospects, to try to get Ethier's LH bat in RF instead? Just wishful thinking...

Edited November 3, 2010 by Eminor3rd

[Balta1701]

However, wouldn't it be so much nicer, if we're gonna trade some prospects, to try to get Ethier's LH bat in RF instead? Just wishful thinking...

Yes it would.

 

However...we're at a point where, outside of Beckham, I don't think we have anything that we could trade that would bring us back Ethier. The reason Kemp might be on the list is that the Dodgers might be interested in taking "whatever they can get" for him. They're not dumping Ethier.

[3E8]

I'd be shocked if they add the $45M in payroll you are suggesting.

 

I could be wrong, we'll see in April.

Prepare to be shocked.

 

Martinez: 12/50

Benoit: 5.5/16.5

Inge: 5.5/11.5

Peralta: 5.25/11.25

Ordonez: 10/10

Penny: 6 (incentives)/6

 

$44.25M in free agent contracts for '11. $105.25M by total contract sizes.

[southsider2k5]

Prepare to be shocked.

 

Martinez: 12/50

Benoit: 5.5/16.5

Inge: 5.5/11.5

Peralta: 5.25/11.25

Ordonez: 10/10

Penny: 6 (incentives)/6

 

$44.25M in free agent contracts for '11. $105.25M by total contract sizes.

 

That might be the worst spending of $45 million in one season I have ever seen.

[nitetrain8601]

That might be the worst spending of $45 million in one season I have ever seen.

 

I have to agree. I like all the players somewhat minus Penny. Individually, they look nice. Together, they aren't nice on that Tigers team unless most of them are bench players.

[southsider2k5]

I have to agree. I like all the players somewhat minus Penny. Individually, they look nice. Together, they aren't nice on that Tigers team unless most of them are bench players.

 

With Inge, Penny, Ordonez and company, that is a disabled list waiting to happen.

[NorthSideSox72]

Prepare to be shocked.

 

Martinez: 12/50

Benoit: 5.5/16.5

Inge: 5.5/11.5

Peralta: 5.25/11.25

Ordonez: 10/10

Penny: 6 (incentives)/6

 

$44.25M in free agent contracts for '11. $105.25M by total contract sizes.

To be clear, I meant add, as in, add players that we're already on the team. Not new contracts to the same players. But I will admit I was surprised at the V-Mart signing, followed by what really looks like a bunch of garbage. I just don't see them as being competitive in the division this year.

 

 

[Balta1701]

Yankees general manager Brian Cashman said he did not want to sign Rafael Soriano because he didn't feel paying closer money to the team's setup man made sense. And, in the end, Cashman said he did not participate in negotiations with Soriano's agent, Scott Boras.

 

"I didn't recommend [the deal]," Cashman said after the team officially introduced Soriano as their eighth-inning man in front of closer Mariano Rivera.

 

Cashman's statements were made after the formal introduction and not on the dais directly in front of Soriano.

 

Cashman said his feelings have nothing to do with Soriano himself. The 31-year-old is a fine reliever, Cashman said, but as he tries to pare down the Yankees $200 million payroll he would have preferred a more patient approach. The executives above Cashman disagreed.

Link