SOXTALK NOV/DEC '10 LIST

[NorthSideSox72]

Bell's Oberon and the Alpha King are excellent choices.

 

And if you want a good summer Mexican beer, I'd much prefer Dos Equis Amber or even a Negro Modelo, which are both far superior to Corona in my view. Corona is on par with Miller Lite.

 

[G&T]

Stella and Corona, huh? Was my family voting on this?

 

But for every questionable beer there is a very worthy beer. I have a pile of Alpha King here right now. It's a bit hoppy for me but I will be giving it another shot. Oberon is good, doesn't make my list but definitely worthy. Sierra Nevada is nice with a burger.

 

Looking at all of these pale ales I wish I had tried the Founders Centennial IPA before this week. That is a superb beer.

[G&T]

Oktoberfest and Winter Lager are the two Sam Adams seasonals that are consistently very good and the ones I make sure to try every year when they show up. If they didn't make it so hard to find Old Fezziwig outside of the stupid holiday 12-packs I would probably have that on the favorite seasonal list as well.

 

i was lucky enough to score a bottle of Sam Adams Infinium this year and I am looking forward to sharing that with the wife on New Years Eve.

 

I had the Infinium a couple nights ago. I look forward to comparing notes with you.

[SoxFan1]

Holy bejeezus. I just realized I've driven past the Three Floyd's Brewery hundreds of times in my life. Definitely going there next week.

[hogan873]

I don't think any of their beers made the list, but Flossmoor Station makes some great beers. Their restaurant, which is in the old Flossmoor train station, is fantastic. Very good food, reasonably priced. And they usually have about a dozen of their beers on tap. I've gotten their 12 beer sampler a few times. I think it's 12 3 oz samples for about $6 or so.

[SoxFan1]

I don't think any of their beers made the list, but Flossmoor Station makes some great beers. Their restaurant, which is in the old Flossmoor train station, is fantastic. Very good food, reasonably priced. And they usually have about a dozen of their beers on tap. I've gotten their 12 beer sampler a few times. I think it's 12 3 oz samples for about $6 or so.

One of my buddies just recommended them to me as well.

[Leonard Zelig]

Thanks for the head's up Mr Honorary Thread Policeman.

Whatever dude. People are donating their own time to do something fun & nice for the site and you're complaining about it? It was two days after Christmas, you think people might be a little busy around this time?

[BigSqwert]

Whatever dude. People are donating their own time to do something fun & nice for the site and you're complaining about it? It was two days after Christmas, you think people might be a little busy around this time?

Around Christmas? This thread started on November 10th.

 

EDIT: And why don't you just put me on ignore. It seems like 80% of your posts are stalking me and complaining about what I say in here.

Edited December 29, 2010 by BigSqwert

[Leonard Zelig]

Around Christmas? This thread started on November 10th.

 

EDIT: And why don't you just put me on ignore. It seems like 80% of your posts are stalking me and complaining about what I say in here.

ok

[FlaSoxxJim]

First I'll get the confession out of the way. I drink Corona. I do the whole lime thing and everything. I'm not proud but there it is.

 

In Florida Corona is ubiquitous, and I apparently have a tastebud blindspot that allows me to choke it down way more willingly than a Miller Lite or a Bud. In Corona I don't taste the adjunct grain (corn or rice) nearly as up front as I do in the majority of American megas, and I think that is the key reason I can tolerate the stuff. For the record, please not that Corona did not make my top 20 list, but it actually might crack my top 200.

 

With that said, knight's last set of 5 has a lot worth talking about. I've already indicated that Oberon is among the very few American style wheat beers that I find satisfying. And Three Floyd's Alpha King is a long-time favorite of mine that I wish I could get with more regularity.

 

Stella Artois is an enigma to me. When I think of Belgian beer I do not ever think of light lagers, but the numbers from the thread post indicate a sad (to me) reality that 3/4 of Belgian beer production is light lagers. The concern for me and other lovers of world class artisinal beer is that economics may eventually drive many of the hundreds of Belgian ale styles to extinction. If you can make a beer that satisfies 75% of the population and it doesn't involve cask conditioning, wild yeas wrangling, double decoction, or vows of silence/poverty/chastity, there is a real danger that the historic, unique, expensive, and and hard-as-hell to produce beers will die out. I actually think there is less danger of that now compared to just a few years ago because much of the rest of the world finally woke up to the glory of Belgian ales. Any drop in domestic consumption of the craft products in Belgium is probably more than offset by export consumption for at least those brewers with the capacity to export.

 

The cautionary tale that I know I've related in the Finer Things thread is the story or British Real Ale. This unique, historic, and miraculous traditional beer style came frighteningly close to extinction as new generations of drinkers fell victim to global commercialism and eschewed cask ale in favor of the likes of Budweiser, Carling's, and Stella Artois. If not for the herculean efforts of the grassroots Campaign for Real Ale (CAMRA) in the 1970s, British cask ale could very well have disappeared. That would have been a mortal blow to a big part of our global beer heritage.

 

Having said all of that, I do think Stella is a good beer. And I too much prefer the draught version to the bottle. I just really hate the idea of the Belgians wasting their time producing (and drinking) such a non-Belgian offering.

 

I have quite a bit to say about my beloved Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, so I'll keep that as a separate post.

[FlaSoxxJim]

Around Christmas? This thread started on November 10th.

 

EDIT: And why don't you just put me on ignore. It seems like 80% of your posts are stalking me and complaining about what I say in here.

 

This list could have been more timely in the offing, and certainly that would have been nice but everybody's free time is scarce. And I don't begrudge you, Milkman, or anybody for thinking that this list topic is not a good one. Jeremy stressed at the outset that he's not a beer drinker so we knew going into this that it was going to be a bit different. I, obviously, think it is a great topic for listing and for general discussion, and I'm pleased to see I am not the only one. With literally thousands of beers of varying accessibility worldwide, of course consensus is going to be impossible. But I think that an enthusiastic discussion of the beers that did/didn't/should have made the list is going to more than make up for it. The list has already reconfirmed for me that there are plenty of beers I've not had the pleasure of sampling, and that is exciting.

[G&T]

Everything I have read about CAMRA leads me to believe that they don't know who their friends are. The movement seems to be anti "craft" beer (read American small brewery movement) though the CAMRA movement would be better suited to have such people on their side.

 

IMO, it is American innovation that is truly reinvigorating the artisinal beer styles. American has become a beer destination for it's quality and variety. Real ale is as likely to catch on the States as it is to be reinvigorated in the UK. If American craft brew fans sought out real ale, a style I love, it would help their cause more than CAMRA wants to admit.

 

But maybe I'm wrong.

[BigSqwert]

Celebrated seeing my Allegash White on the list by downing a four pack last night.

[FlaSoxxJim]

Everything I have read about CAMRA leads me to believe that they don't know who their friends are. The movement seems to be anti "craft" beer (read American small brewery movement) though the CAMRA movement would be better suited to have such people on their side.

 

IMO, it is American innovation that is truly reinvigorating the artisinal beer styles. American has become a beer destination for it's quality and variety. Real ale is as likely to catch on the States as it is to be reinvigorated in the UK. If American craft brew fans sought out real ale, a style I love, it would help their cause more than CAMRA wants to admit.

 

But maybe I'm wrong.

 

I don't think you are wrong. The United States craft beer consumer has absolutely started the ball rolling worldwide as far as a global beer renaissance. And yes, world class beer in just about all styles is as likely to come from the states as it is from the country of origin. I'm sure we've talked before about how cool it is that brewers like Scotland's BrewDog are now sending us their reinterpretation of the US over-the-top interpretation of classic English ale. I love it.

 

But 1971 was way different than today, and CAMRA was busy fighting the good fight when nobody in the US even knew what real ale was. The joke about Englishmen drinking their beer warm and flat was about as much as we knew.

[G&T]

I also want to add my concern over Belgian ales, which I didn't know I had to be concerned about until Jim's post (thanks).

 

But if they are going away, it will be a long time from now. They are extremely popular (at least in a dumbed down version) and they are sought after by enthusiasts in their best form. Economics is, most certainly, the enemy. Even today, a Cantillon is a special occasion beer at its price point. The good stuff is very expensive and isn't an everyday beer. However, American brewers have a great job replicating the styles, especially Jolly Pumpkin (Bam Biere is as close as you can get to the true farmhouse style in the US). Even the Sam Adams Barrelroom Stony Brook Red is a perfectly passable flemish red (along with Ommegang's Zuur). Still they are pricier than normal and most people won't pay it for a beer that is an acquired taste.

 

Having said that, it is really the price of hops that has increased in the last few years, and belgians have maintained a steady price point based on their low hop levels. True, it is time and labor intensive to make these beers, but the actual ingredient costs is not rising. So for now, I think the good stuff will still live on.

 

 

[hogan873]

This list could have been more timely in the offing, and certainly that would have been nice but everybody's free time is scarce. And I don't begrudge you, Milkman, or anybody for thinking that this list topic is not a good one. Jeremy stressed at the outset that he's not a beer drinker so we knew going into this that it was going to be a bit different. I, obviously, think it is a great topic for listing and for general discussion, and I'm pleased to see I am not the only one. With literally thousands of beers of varying accessibility worldwide, of course consensus is going to be impossible. But I think that an enthusiastic discussion of the beers that did/didn't/should have made the list is going to more than make up for it. The list has already reconfirmed for me that there are plenty of beers I've not had the pleasure of sampling, and that is exciting.

I give Jeremy a ton of credit for taking time to create these lists. The handful of beers I collected information on for the list took me longer than I would have expected. Sure the list could have made its appearance earlier, but I like the countdown to New Years. And we still have three months of off season in which to do other lists.

 

I was really excited about a beer list, because I know there are so many I haven't tried. I blame Sam Adams and Pete's Wicked Ales for getting me into good beer. I started drinking beer 17 years ago, and they were a couple of the pioneers into "craft" beer. I say I blame them, but I should really thank them. I think that if it weren't for brewers like them we wouldn't have brewers like New Belgium, Dogfish Head, and Three Floyds today.

 

I go into a Binny's and my brain overloads with the number of beers they carry...and that's only a small percentage of the beers of the world. I may get a chance to go to Italy for work next year, and I look forward to trying a slew of beers over there.

[The Gooch]

I also thought I would have to add my hatred for Stella. I think it tastes terrible and would take a Corona over it anytime. On the other hand, I can't wait to try some of these other craft beers listed that I have not had a chance to yet.

[BigSqwert]

I also thought I would have to add my hatred for Stella. I think it tastes terrible and would take a Corona over it anytime.

Ditto

[FlaSoxxJim]

Sierra Nevada Pale Ale is THE American Pale Ale. Period. There are more full-bodied, higher-octane, or mor aggressively hopped American ales out there now, but this is the classic American Pale Ale that served as the prototype for everything else.

 

In my mind (and in the minds of others), there are five guys who are the Forefathers of the American Craft Beer scene: Jack McAuliffe (New Albion), Bert Grant (Grant’s Brewery Pub), Fritz Maytag (Anchor Brewing), Charlie Papazian (the Father of American Homebrewing), and Ken Grossman of Sierra Nevada.

 

Grossman and his partner were homebrewers who took a chance and scaled up to small-scale commercial production. The company started out producing less than 30 barrels per week and no they produce more that 13,000 a week.

 

Sierra Pale Ale is the nuthin’ fancy homebrew-based beer that set the stage for all the hoppy, flavorful West Coast (later nationwide) ales that would follow. The signature use of Cascades as the finishing hop, with its floral citrus/spicy nose was unlike any commercial product at the time. Bottle conditioning — a homebrewing staple — was also pretty much nonexistent in commercial beers at that time.

[IlliniKrush]

Maybe if you or Steve actually leave your house on NYE and buy me a few with the millions of dollars you guys make.

 

On topic though, I've only tried like 4 of these so far, I have a lot of work to do apparently. And I assume Keystone is going to be number 1?

I think we'll both be leaving our places that night, however neither of us have said million nor want to agree to buy you "a few" because to you that probably means 17, not the 3-4 it would mean to "normal" people.

 

****************************

 

I have a lot of work to do here too. This thread is great. It took a while to get it going but it was well worth the wait and it is a great list idea. It's very beneficial. I look forward to walking into Binny's and having an idea of what to grab. There's just so many options, and I usually have no idea what to try.

 

I appreciate everyone's contributions and follow-up postings.

Edited December 29, 2010 by IlliniKrush

[smalls2598]

This thread is great. It took a while to get it going but it was well worth the wait and it is a great list idea. It's very beneficial. I look forward to walking into Binny's and having an idea of what to grab. There's just so many options, and I usually have no idea what to try.

 

I appreciate everyone's contributions and follow-up postings.

 

I agree; there are quite a few beers here that i've seen before, but have yet to try, but now i'm tempted. Thanks for the list; I'm looking forward to see the rest of it.

[Heads22]

I don't care what anyone else says, Summer Shandy is like f***ing candy to me.

[IlliniKrush]

I don't care what anyone else says, Summer Shandy is like f***ing candy to me.

No arguments here man

[3E8]

I don't care what anyone else says, Summer Shandy is like f***ing candy to me.

Hahaha, I knew it was you. To each their own.

[Heads22]

No arguments here man

 

It's a very enjoyable warm weather beer.