TSA - Going too Far?

[EvilMonkey]

Evidence of TSA groping three year olds?

 

Evidence of profiling actually being effective?

I didn't say 'would'. Rean next time before climbing on your horse. And if you haven't seenthe video of the screaming kid being searched by the tsa yet, not my fault.

[EvilMonkey]

Keep ignoring all the Americans who headed off to Somalia to join AQ.

WHo come back with Muslim names, long beards and other things that could also be profiled.

[BigSqwert]

WHo come back with Muslim names, long beards and other things that could also be profiled.

[Steve9347]

A definition of where that line is?

penetration

[Balta1701]

WHo come back with Muslim names, long beards and other things that could also be profiled.

You know what's impossible to do? Shave.

[StrangeSox]

I didn't say 'would'. Rean next time before climbing on your horse.

 

I'm not following what you're saying here. Regardless, aside from being racist, profiling is not an effective method.

 

And if you haven't seenthe video of the screaming kid being searched by the tsa yet, not my fault.

 

Is it a video of a three year old being groped by TSA?

[StrangeSox]

WHo come back with Muslim names, long beards and other things that could also be profiled.

 

[Jenksismyhero]

How do we prevent people from carrying dangerous non-metallic items onto planes?

 

don't allow anyone to fly.

 

Seriously though, absent full on cavity searches, how are you ever going to prevent that?

[Balta1701]

Seriously though, absent full on cavity searches, how are you ever going to prevent that?

How will you react when the guy with a colon loaded with HMX explodes and takes out 250 people? Serious question.

[dasox24]

I've went through some of the full body scanners. Not specifically the ones at O'Hare but ones had other airports. As long as they have the resources to keep the lines down (as the scanners tend to take a bit longer), I have no issue with it.

 

Bottom line while flying is inconvenient I'm pretty open as I have nothing to hide and I just want to get from point A to point B safely (most importantly) and hopefully without any significant delays.

Same here.

 

Also, I really don't care what some TSA agent sees if I were to go through a full-body scanner. If that's what they get-off to, so be it. I'd rather be a bit safer.

Edited November 16, 2010 by dasox24

[EvilMonkey]

I'm not following what you're saying here. Regardless, aside from being racist, profiling is not an effective method.

 

 

 

Is it a video of a three year old being groped by TSA?

Damn, I think i pwned myself back there. That's what happens when i try to work and post at the same time. Anyway....yes, there is a video of tsa 'searching' a 3 year old who is scared and screaming while they do it, and parents not doing anything out of fear of arrest.

 

profiling by itself it not so good. Profiling accompanied by other methods, good. Why is it bad to select certain people who lok a certain way for extra scrutiny? Why the need to spend extra time on a 3 year old and less on someone of perhaps Muslim origin, just to appear to be non-profiling? Just look around at other incidents that have happened. That guy who shot up the military base, Nadal, was spouting off some things that should have caused people to take a closer look at him. But everyone was afraid of being accused of Islamophobia, so nobody did anything. In a world where a second grader can point his finger at someone and go 'bang', then be expelled because they think he is a serial murderer-in-waiting, we can't look twice at the person in Islamic garb, even though most terrorism seems to come from people that might wear such garb? We can't look closer at the jittery guy in line because he happens to look arabic, don't want to offend anyone, so let's give the 80 year old lady the once over instead, just to assure our Muslin friends that we are not profiling anyone.

 

You wanna do these scanner, first have to make it so that there is ZERO chance that anyone can ever get those pictures off the machine. Because if there is a way, someone will find it and manipulate it to their gain or pleasure. But stop the security-theater, it wastes time, wastes resources and is just a waste, period.

[NorthSideSox72]

Damn, I think i pwned myself back there. That's what happens when i try to work and post at the same time. Anyway....yes, there is a video of tsa 'searching' a 3 year old who is scared and screaming while they do it, and parents not doing anything out of fear of arrest.

 

profiling by itself it not so good. Profiling accompanied by other methods, good. Why is it bad to select certain people who lok a certain way for extra scrutiny? Why the need to spend extra time on a 3 year old and less on someone of perhaps Muslim origin, just to appear to be non-profiling? Just look around at other incidents that have happened. That guy who shot up the military base, Nadal, was spouting off some things that should have caused people to take a closer look at him. But everyone was afraid of being accused of Islamophobia, so nobody did anything. In a world where a second grader can point his finger at someone and go 'bang', then be expelled because they think he is a serial murderer-in-waiting, we can't look twice at the person in Islamic garb, even though most terrorism seems to come from people that might wear such garb? We can't look closer at the jittery guy in line because he happens to look arabic, don't want to offend anyone, so let's give the 80 year old lady the once over instead, just to assure our Muslin friends that we are not profiling anyone.

 

You wanna do these scanner, first have to make it so that there is ZERO chance that anyone can ever get those pictures off the machine. Because if there is a way, someone will find it and manipulate it to their gain or pleasure. But stop the security-theater, it wastes time, wastes resources and is just a waste, period.

You are describing isolated cases of reverse racism, or maybe better put, people who are too PC in the name of fear. And what you seem to be describing as profiling, is different than what others are calling it.

 

Your version of profiling is to look for specific signals - like saying strange things, behaving oddly, etc. I don't think anyone disagrees with that.

 

What others are referring to as profiling is racial or religious profiling, which is morally repugnant and also patently ineffective.

 

[lostfan]

I haven't read all 8 pages, it'd take too long but I know the gist of what the argument is and who's going to say what. This whole thing is a catch-22. Obviously you don't want people sneaking bombs onto planes and you don't want to be so intrusive either. But what's the one place the TSA isn't going to look?

[EvilMonkey]

I haven't read all 8 pages, it'd take too long but I know the gist of what the argument is and who's going to say what. This whole thing is a catch-22. Obviously you don't want people sneaking bombs onto planes and you don't want to be so intrusive either. But what's the one place the TSA isn't going to look?

For now................

[EvilMonkey]

You are describing isolated cases of reverse racism, or maybe better put, people who are too PC in the name of fear. And what you seem to be describing as profiling, is different than what others are calling it.

 

Your version of profiling is to look for specific signals - like saying strange things, behaving oddly, etc. I don't think anyone disagrees with that.

 

What others are referring to as profiling is racial or religious profiling, which is morally repugnant and also patently ineffective.

Tell that to El Al.

[lostfan]

Tell that to El Al.

If our security procedures were as tight as they are in Israeli airports, it 1) wouldn't be cost-effective, the U.S. is waaaay bigger than Israel and 2) would cause everyone here to flip all the way the f*** out because of how over-the-top intrusive it is.

[EvilMonkey]

If our security procedures were as tight as they are in Israeli airports, it 1) wouldn't be cost-effective, the U.S. is waaaay bigger than Israel and 2) would cause everyone here to flip all the way the f*** out because of how over-the-top intrusive it is.

Well, they use profiling, and it works. So you can;t say it doesn't work. You can say it may not be cost effective, but it works.

[Soxy]

So, since 9/11 how many successful terror attacks have their been using airplanes?

 

Serious question, maybe airline travel is more dangerous than I thought.

 

Wouldn't a breathalyzer on every car save more lives annually? Or require everyone over 40 to get a colonoscopy?

 

I guess I think that all these extra security measures are a bit over the top.

[Reddy]

No one is making you fly. If you don't like it, there are tons of other modes of transportation out there available.

no there aren't.

 

not until the government puts more money into railways. how the hell do you suggest I get from NYC to Vancouver for a weekend for business?

[G&T]

So, since 9/11 how many successful terror attacks have their been using airplanes?

 

Serious question, maybe airline travel is more dangerous than I thought.

 

Wouldn't a breathalyzer on every car save more lives annually? Or require everyone over 40 to get a colonoscopy?

 

I guess I think that all these extra security measures are a bit over the top.

 

 

The government requires seatbelts, makes it very difficult to smoke, and would like to elimininate happy meals. And f the goverent has full control over health care you probably will be required to have colonoscopies. I wouldn't be shocked if breathalyzers were put in cars. They will get around to it all eventually.

 

For every person in this thread that thinks "I'm not doing anything wrong, so who cares", I will say that one day you will be doing something "wrong". Like looking suspicious.

[Jenksismyhero]

How will you react when the guy with a colon loaded with HMX explodes and takes out 250 people? Serious question.

 

so you'd agree that the next logical step is everyone gets cavity searches?

 

(and i think there are means to detect explosives that don't require some dude in a backroom staring at naked people all day or forcing people to be groped, which, at the end of the day, still doesn't prevent the most determined of terrorists)

 

 

[Balta1701]

(and i think there are means to detect explosives that don't require some dude in a backroom staring at naked people all day or forcing people to be groped, which, at the end of the day, still doesn't prevent the most determined of terrorists)

Well, no there aren't...but even if there were...are YOU going to want your taxes going up to pay for it?

[Balta1701]

The Colbert Report	Mon - Thurs 11:30pm / 10:30c
TSA Full-Body Scanners - Jeffrey Goldberg
www.colbertnation.com
Colbert Report Full Episodes 2010 Election March to Keep Fear Alive

[southsider2k5]

So, since 9/11 how many successful terror attacks have their been using airplanes?

 

Serious question, maybe airline travel is more dangerous than I thought.

 

Wouldn't a breathalyzer on every car save more lives annually? Or require everyone over 40 to get a colonoscopy?

 

I guess I think that all these extra security measures are a bit over the top.

 

I'd be curious how many people would still feel the same way if family members died from an event that could have been prevented with more intrusive measures? I know as soon as something does happen, the re-writing of what could have been done will start almost instantly, just like it did with 9-11. If you really do believe that freedoms are being violated by these checks, than you have to accept that people will die because of them.

[Jenksismyhero]

Well, no there aren't...but even if there were...are YOU going to want your taxes going up to pay for it?

 

if there's no means of testing it, then the only option is to search every square inch of a person. So this bulls*** that's going on now is worthless.