White Sox Sign Dunn

[GREEDY]

His agent may request a clause in the deal where if he doesn't play "X" amount of games in the field that the last one or two years of his deal are voided.

 

Perfect, wouldn't every team love short term deal with Dunn at a long term rate?

[Dick Allen]

I only watched Dunn play 1st base when the Nats were playing the Sox, but I can agree that he is not a good defensive 1st baseman. But, could imagine how small he could make The Cell look? I think his "bad" side (the glove) is more than compensated by his "good" side (the bat). If the Sox are parting ways with Konerko (and signs are pointing in that direction), I'd be more than happy with Dunn as his replacement.

He spent a lot of time in Cincinatti. There is nothing to suggest his HR rate would actually spike. Sluggers really don't hit many that wind up in the first row at USCF. When guys like Dunn or Thome hit homers, they are homers just about everywhere.

[Dick Allen]

Of course, Dunn may not want to sign if he can only be the DH. His agent may request a clause in the deal where if he doesn't play "X" amount of games in the field that the last one or two years of his deal are voided.

I would doubt that.

[NorthSideSox72]

I would doubt that.

Yeah that ain't happenin'. No team will sign him to a contract like that.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

Also, I've merged the multiple Dunn threads.

 

[harfman77]

I agree with KW for once. If you are not going to be competitive next season, sell off the veterans with value and start rebuilding to contend, being half way between contending and rebuilding has no benefit. If KW cant sign/acquire the players that are going to put this team into contention, tear this thing down and start rebuilding. The only problem I have with that is that the Sox minor league scouts have not shown to have a great track record of evaluating talent.

[Balta1701]

I agree with KW for once. If you are not going to be competitive next season, sell off the veterans with value and start rebuilding to contend, being half way between contending and rebuilding has no benefit. If KW cant sign/acquire the players that are going to put this team into contention, tear this thing down and start rebuilding. The only problem I have with that is that the Sox minor league scouts have not shown to have a great track record of evaluating talent.

I disagree. I think a lot of teams manage to contend by hanging on to some constant level of turnover while still holding on to a select group of key guys. Go through the list of teams that stayed competitive for multiple years; most of them have huge turnovers and still stay in there. The 2007 Red Sox looked very little like the 2004 Red Sox, save for Ortiz and Manroid. The 2006 Twins and 2010 Twins have Mauer and Morneau, but the pieces around them are pretty different. The 2008 and 2010 Rays made the playoffs with almost completely different starting rotations.

 

You can win by having constant, "Rebuilding" level turnover, if the couple key guys you have, who are on big salary contracts or who you need to produce big numbers, do so. For the Sox, right now, the key guy there is Peavy.

[harfman77]

I disagree. I think a lot of teams manage to contend by hanging on to some constant level of turnover while still holding on to a select group of key guys. Go through the list of teams that stayed competitive for multiple years; most of them have huge turnovers and still stay in there. The 2007 Red Sox looked very little like the 2004 Red Sox, save for Ortiz and Manroid. The 2006 Twins and 2010 Twins have Mauer and Morneau, but the pieces around them are pretty different. The 2008 and 2010 Rays made the playoffs with almost completely different starting rotations.

 

You can win by having constant, "Rebuilding" level turnover, if the couple key guys you have, who are on big salary contracts or who you need to produce big numbers, do so. For the Sox, right now, the key guy there is Peavy.

 

The thing with those teams are that they were built from the ground up. Mauer was a #1 pick, the Twins have competed by growing their own talent on the farm, having excellent minor league scouting (Nathan, Liriano, Santana) and then sprinkling in other pieces like Pavano, Capps, and Young.

 

The Rays pretty much grew their entire roster from the farm system, while they changed over most of their rotation, they did so with pieces from their own system Price, Shields, Davis, Hellickson, etc. Carlos Pena was brought in on the cheap as a reclamation project, as was most of their bullpen, but the key cogs all came from the organization.

 

The Red Sox produced Varitek, Ellsbury, Papelbon, Lester, Youk, Pedroia, used Hanley Ramirez and Anibal Sanchez to get Beckett, used other pieces to acquire VMart and added in Papi.

 

The key to being able to have the turnover that these organizations have had is the ability to replace the pieces you lose internally or having the pieces to go get someone to fill a gap. The Sox dont have the depth in the farm to do the same thing, that is why if you are not contend now, you build that depth and use the money saved from handing out contracts to sign amateur talent. Then when that depth starts to mature to the major league level you fill in any gaps through free agency or via trade.

[scotty22hotty]

I agree with KW for once. If you are not going to be competitive next season, sell off the veterans with value and start rebuilding to contend, being half way between contending and rebuilding has no benefit. If KW cant sign/acquire the players that are going to put this team into contention, tear this thing down and start rebuilding. The only problem I have with that is that the Sox minor league scouts have not shown to have a great track record of evaluating talent.

If that's the attitude, then shouldn't KW be fired ASAP? Because basically looking back over the last two season, hes the reason the Sox wouldn't be competitive...

[Jordan4life_2007]

The thing with those teams are that they were built from the ground up. Mauer was a #1 pick, the Twins have competed by growing their own talent on the farm, having excellent minor league scouting (Nathan, Liriano, Santana) and then sprinkling in other pieces like Pavano, Capps, and Young.

 

The Rays pretty much grew their entire roster from the farm system, while they changed over most of their rotation, they did so with pieces from their own system Price, Shields, Davis, Hellickson, etc. Carlos Pena was brought in on the cheap as a reclamation project, as was most of their bullpen, but the key cogs all came from the organization.

 

The Red Sox produced Varitek, Ellsbury, Papelbon, Lester, Youk, Pedroia, used Hanley Ramirez and Anibal Sanchez to get Beckett, used other pieces to acquire VMart and added in Papi.

 

The key to being able to have the turnover that these organizations have had is the ability to replace the pieces you lose internally or having the pieces to go get someone to fill a gap. The Sox dont have the depth in the farm to do the same thing, that is why if you are not contend now, you build that depth and use the money saved from handing out contracts to sign amateur talent. Then when that depth starts to mature to the major league level you fill in any gaps through free agency or via trade.

+1

[harfman77]

If that's the attitude, then shouldn't KW be fired ASAP? Because basically looking back over the last two season, hes the reason the Sox wouldn't be competitive...

 

Is there a better time to rebuild? With AJ and PK's contracts coming off the books frees up some money but also leaves some pretty big holes in the lineup that will be really tough to fill with budget. KW was building the team to compete last year and fell short. If anyone hit in the first half and Peavy doesnt get hurt, this was probably a playoff team. Now its time to turn the page and look toward next year. Is this team going to be good enough to win the central with the Twins coming back pretty much intact and the Tigers taking it up a notch? I think KW if hes honest has to answer that question no, but as we have seen in the past KW always thinks he has a chance to win. I am not defending what KF has done, I understand his thinking process, I just dont necessarily agree with it.

[LittleHurt05]

The Rays pretty much grew their entire roster from the farm system, while they changed over most of their rotation, they did so with pieces from their own system Price, Shields, Davis, Hellickson, etc. Carlos Pena was brought in on the cheap as a reclamation project, as was most of their bullpen, but the key cogs all came from the organization.

 

It's a lot easier to rebuild from within when you have a top 10 pick for ten straight seasons, and a top 4 pick for 8 of 10 seasons. Maybe the White Sox should become the worst team in the league for the next ten years, maybe they can become like the Rays.

 

I will give them credit for making some good moves, but they also were bad for a really long time which helped them get the top talent in draft after draft.

[mmmmmbeeer]

I agree with KW for once. If you are not going to be competitive next season, sell off the veterans with value and start rebuilding to contend, being half way between contending and rebuilding has no benefit. If KW cant sign/acquire the players that are going to put this team into contention, tear this thing down and start rebuilding. The only problem I have with that is that the Sox minor league scouts have not shown to have a great track record of evaluating talent.

 

With a starting 5 of Danks, Floyd, Jackson, Buehrle, and Peavy/Sale, we're going to be competitive. It didn't work out very well last season (though we did win 88 games) I would say that we're actually entering this season with a much stronger rotation (lose Freddy add Edwin). We have holes and the pen could be an issue, but with a staff like that you're nearly guaranteed a .500 record with nothing more than a meager offense. KW has to know this and, imo, believes this as he has always placed a premium on SP.

 

[Chicago White Sox]

It's a lot easier to rebuild from within when you have a top 10 pick for ten straight seasons, and a top 4 pick for 8 of 10 seasons. Maybe the White Sox should become the worst team in the league for the next ten years, maybe they can become like the Rays.

 

I will give them credit for making some good moves, but they also were bad for a really long time which helped them get the top talent in draft after draft.

Thank you! The people proposing a true "rebuilding" are nuts. It's a total crapshoot and if a huge portion of the players you acquire in trades (from selling off your veterans) and select in the draft don't develop into major league players, then it will be a long and painful process. Furthermore, I'm not even sure if KW and his front office could handle such a task.

 

Also, I don't know how anyone can advocate "rebuilding" when we have a starting rotation like ours. You don't have a 1-5 like ours very often and when you do you go for it.

[NorthSideSox72]

Thank you! The people proposing a true "rebuilding" are nuts. It's a total crapshoot and if a huge portion of the players you acquire in trades (from selling off your veterans) and select in the draft don't develop into major league players, then it will be a long and painful process. Furthermore, I'm not even sure if KW and his front office could handle such a task.

 

Also, I don't know how anyone can advocate "rebuilding" when we have a starting rotation like ours. You don't have a 1-5 like ours very often and when you do you go for it.

The talk of rebuiling is sort of silly.

 

For one thing, KW doesn't do that, because he can't. If there are no butts in seats, there is no money for a decent payroll. He has to field a competitive team basically every year. Doing otherwise would mire the team in mediocrity for a long, long time.

 

For another, some people keep talking about this team needing major overhaul... this was an 88 win team in a division that is usually won with 88-90 wins. And they won 88 games with absolute garbage at DH, a closer who fell apart, and losing their best SP for most of the season. You need one more very good bat to improve the DH slot (directly or indirectly if the bat is an OF), you need to try to bring back Paulie or do something else good at 1B, and make one good bullpen move, and this team is probably already good for 90 wins plus barring major injuries.

 

[gatnom]

For another, some people keep talking about this team needing major overhaul... this was an 88 win team in a division that is usually won with 88-90 wins. And they won 88 games with absolute garbage at DH, a closer who fell apart, and losing their best SP for most of the season. You need one more very good bat to improve the DH slot (directly or indirectly if the bat is an OF), you need to try to bring back Paulie or do something else good at 1B, and make one good bullpen move, and this team is probably already good for 90 wins plus barring major injuries.

 

This is a lot easier said than done with our situation, and you describe our situation as though it is in a vacuum (we will almost certainly let some of our free agents walk and have to trade away some major league talent). Definitely shouldn't be thinking rebuild, though.

[BigSqwert]

Dunn Seeks Four Years, $60MM

[Chicago White Sox]

Dunn Seeks Four Years, $60MM

I want to know what teams are interested in Dunn, because I don't see many offering him that contract. I think he's going to end up settling for a lot less just like last time. The fact that Pujols, Fielder, and Gonzalez are all free agents next year won't help his cause.

[Steve9347]

I want to know what teams are interested in Dunn, because I don't see many offering him that contract. I think he's going to end up settling for a lot less just like last time. The fact that Pujols, Fielder, and Gonzalez are all free agents next year won't help his cause.

I don't think $15 per is out of the realm of expectation...

[Balta1701]

I don't think $15 per is out of the realm of expectation...

I just don't see who'd give him that kind of money.

[knightni]

Dunn today is worth $15 mil a year just as much as Kong was worth $13 mil a year 5 years ago.

 

 

[Chicago White Sox]

Dunn today is worth $15 mil a year just as much as Kong was worth $13 mil a year 5 years ago.

He may be worth $15 million in a general sense, but who's going to pay him that much this offseason? I just don't see a big enough market for him this offseason to get that kind of contract. I don't see him getting more than $40/3 years.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Adam Dunn plays first like he has a beer in his hand and he doesn't want to spill it. He's a defensive girly-man, and at $15M per I laugh in his ugly face and either go after Jayson Werth who at a higher price is still a better value OR I go lower and look at a bargain veteran on a short-term deal.

[macsandz]

He may be worth $15 million in a general sense, but who's going to pay him that much this offseason? I just don't see a big enough market for him this offseason to get that kind of contract. I don't see him getting more than $40/3 years.

 

Baltimore.

[bschmaranz]

Baltimore.

 

Yep, I think the Orioles are gonna throw a big number at a couple guys this offseason. Hell, I could see them doing something crazy like $60m/3 for Jeter.