OBAMA/TRUMPCARE MEGATHREAD

[Reddy]

I dont really like TV, some movies are cool, video games turn me into a sloth so I gave them up years ago.

 

I answered your question, now make the post everyone knows is coming.

Just because we all know it's coming doesn't make it untrue.

 

If you want to have those things (and whether you do or not is irrelevant, because the general populace DOES want those things) then part of it is having people like me doing what I do. You can't have one without the other.

[Iwritecode]

It's easy to say that when it's not the case.

 

It's always easier to spend other peoples money, isn't it?

 

Now, when it comes to me, I actually CAN say that. Where you pay 50$ a month, I get to pay 400+$ a month for my family, and I work for the industry, no less.

 

That's actually not bad IMO. The last time I looked for insurance I was seeing premiums that were double that.

[DukeNukeEm]

Sounds to me like someone's complaining about their chosen lifestyle.

The diffence is I dont demand people feed me money to support it.

[Iwritecode]

No system is going to be perfect. No matter what system you put in place, you're going to have some people who legitimately need help and aren't going to get it, and you're going to have others soaking up all kinds of benefits they don't really need. The goal is to try to make the system as good as we can, but as long as we continue to single out the handful of outliers on either side as our reason for making (or not making) changes, things aren't going to improve.

 

This.

[DukeNukeEm]

Just because we all know it's coming doesn't make it untrue.

 

If you want to have those things (and whether you do or not is irrelevant, because the general populace DOES want those things) then part of it is having people like me doing what I do. You can't have one without the other.

Except the acting profession has a disproportionate amount of dreamchasers and wannabes. I used to work at a very famous comedy club in Chicago back when I was working 3 jobs. I saw them a lot, but there's maybe 5 openings for a job and 500 people who wabt it. The other 495 arent really adding much to the product.

[Y2HH]

Except the acting profession has a disproportionate amount of dreamchasers and wannabes. I used to work at a very famous comedy club in Chicago back when I was working 3 jobs. I saw them a lot, but there's maybe 5 openings for a job and 500 people who wabt it. The other 495 arent really adding much to the product.

 

Some dreamers chase, and thank God for that.

 

Other dreamers, like me, play it safe.

 

You don't want all of one or the other...

[DukeNukeEm]

Some dreamers chase, and thank God for that.

 

Other dreamers, like me, play it safe.

 

You don't want all of one or the other...

Like I said, theres no problem with that if you can support yourself. But when youre turning to food stamps and Obamacare payoffs to keep following that dream youve now included me in the suffering. Thats wrong.

[StrangeSox]

"If young people have to go to war and die to preserve our freedom, well, so be it. I support that. What you can do for your country..." - me, 31 year old who wouldn't be eligible for a draft.

War is just like health care access lmao

[Reddy]

Like I said, theres no problem with that if you can support yourself. But when youre turning to food stamps and Obamacare payoffs to keep following that dream youve now included me in the suffering. Thats wrong.

am I on food stamps? huh. didn't realize.

[StrangeSox]

So its ok for you to get his money because he works harder than you? Damn right you appreciate it man, hes allowing your parasitic lifestyle.

 

The mentality of the poor is so annoying. If you actually worked as hard as the rest of us you wouldnt be so willing to pay more. You just dont have any concept money because like some teenager from Wilmette driving a German luxury sedan to New Trier, you dont have any idea what goes into making that wealth just that youre entitled to a cut.

 

Youre not allowed to say youd pay more if you could, you cant. You cant relate to the rest of us who support you.

Pretty sure I make more than you. I relate to reddy's position and think yours is appallingly immoral, but keep on kicking poor(er) people if it helps you sleep at night.

[DukeNukeEm]

Pretty sure I make more than you. I relate to reddy's position and think yours is appallingly immoral, but keep on kicking poor(er) people if it helps you sleep at night.

Im less repulsed by the ones who fancy themselves charitable spending other peoples money.

[Reddy]

Im less repulsed by the ones who fancy themselves charitable spending other peoples money.

you realize it was your choice to not do something you enjoy with your life... right?

[StrangeSox]

Im less repulsed by the ones who fancy themselves charitable spending other peoples money.

Taxation is slavery!

[NorthSideSox72]

I can't believe I'm about to say this, but... I actually agree with the core point of what Duke is saying. I despise the way he is saying it, but, the idea that people are able to intentionally choose a life that requires extra government support does bother me. In Reddy's case, he chooses to make some money to live on freelancing and go after an acting career - which is 100% fine of course - but he's being given taxpayer dollars for that privilege. It shouldn't work that way.

 

Here though is where Duke's philosophy hits the brick wall of reality. How do you determine a Reddy vs a poor family who don't have the skills/tools/education to make any more than that? He knows there is no easy way to do so. Therefore he chooses the path of intellectual simplicity - since we can't tell who is who, screw 'em all.

 

For me, I would much rather provide a program that helps a lot of people who truly need it... and then attempt to make small steps as we go on to try to weed out some of the abusers. And for that matter, Reddy isn't much of an abuser, relatively speaking. I am aware this means I will pay more, because some people will get my money that should not. But I can live with that and sleep at night. I can't do that taking Duke's approach. I find his approach to the problem to be immoral and sad. But as I said, I fully understand his frustration with certain individual cases.

 

One other note to Duke: there is really no need for you to insult people while making these points. Please stop that.

[DukeNukeEm]

you realize it was your choice to not do something you enjoy with your life... right?

I actually love driving truck. I just think Im going to enjoy the enjoy the end much more than the means.

[StrangeSox]

I can't believe I'm about to say this, but... I actually agree with the core point of what Duke is saying. I despise the way he is saying it, but, the idea that people are able to intentionally choose a life that requires extra government support does bother me. In Reddy's case, he chooses to make some money to live on freelancing and go after an acting career - which is 100% fine of course - but he's being given taxpayer dollars for that privilege. It shouldn't work that way.

 

Here though is where Duke's philosophy hits the brick wall of reality. How do you determine a Reddy vs a poor family who don't have the skills/tools/education to make any more than that? He knows there is no easy way to do so. Therefore he chooses the path of intellectual simplicity - since we can't tell who is who, screw 'em all.

 

For me, I would much rather provide a program that helps a lot of people who truly need it... and then attempt to make small steps as we go on to try to weed out some of the abusers. And for that matter, Reddy isn't much of an abuser, relatively speaking. I am aware this means I will pay more, because some people will get my money that should not. But I can live with that and sleep at night. I can't do that taking Duke's approach. I find his approach to the problem to be immoral and sad. But as I said, I fully understand his frustration with certain individual cases.

 

One other note to Duke: there is really no need for you to insult people while making these points. Please stop that.

 

I think it's a good thing if society can allow for people to pursue engaging and rewarding careers instead of having to take whatever grudging job they can just to subsist.

 

Universal health care and a basic income for everyone.

[Jenksismyhero]

War is just like health care access lmao

 

Yeah, that's what I said.

[Jenksismyhero]

I think it's a good thing if society can allow for people to pursue engaging and rewarding careers instead of having to take whatever grudging job they can just to subsist.

 

Universal health care and a basic income for everyone.

 

And cell phones and xbox 360's and cars and houses and kids they can't afford and... what else should every American get?

[DukeNukeEm]

I think it's a good thing if society can allow for people to pursue engaging and rewarding careers instead of having to take whatever grudging job they can just to subsist.

 

Universal health care and a basic income for everyone.

Hmmm should I work at the plant in Solon OH or make the same money struggling as an actor in NYC?

Edited November 21, 2013 by DukeNukeEm

[StrangeSox]

And cell phones and xbox 360's and cars and houses and kids they can't afford and... what else should every American get?

Noted socialist Fredrick Hayek and communist Milton Friedman endorsed universal basic income. And a ps4 for every American.

[Reddy]

I actually love driving truck. I just think Im going to enjoy the enjoy the end much more than the means.

And what if you could... you know... enjoy all of it?

[Reddy]

And cell phones and xbox 360's and cars and houses and kids they can't afford and... what else should every American get?

Let's see. I pay for my cell phone. I don't own an xbox or a car or a house or kids, and probably wont until I can AFFORD to have those things.

 

Why do you equate an Xbox with a living wage?

[Reddy]

Hmmm should I work at the plant in Solon OH or make the same money struggling as an actor in NYC?

 

if it's the same money and you'd enjoy the latter, then why the hell not?

[DukeNukeEm]

I can't believe I'm about to say this, but... I actually agree with the core point of what Duke is saying. I despise the way he is saying it, but, the idea that people are able to intentionally choose a life that requires extra government support does bother me. In Reddy's case, he chooses to make some money to live on freelancing and go after an acting career - which is 100% fine of course - but he's being given taxpayer dollars for that privilege. It shouldn't work that way.

 

Here though is where Duke's philosophy hits the brick wall of reality. How do you determine a Reddy vs a poor family who don't have the skills/tools/education to make any more than that? He knows there is no easy way to do so. Therefore he chooses the path of intellectual simplicity - since we can't tell who is who, screw 'em all.

 

For me, I would much rather provide a program that helps a lot of people who truly need it... and then attempt to make small steps as we go on to try to weed out some of the abusers. And for that matter, Reddy isn't much of an abuser, relatively speaking. I am aware this means I will pay more, because some people will get my money that should not. But I can live with that and sleep at night. I can't do that taking Duke's approach. I find his approach to the problem to be immoral and sad. But as I said, I fully understand his frustration with certain individual cases.

 

One other note to Duke: there is really no need for you to insult people while making these points. Please stop that.

You have to deal in absolutes or you'll run into major inconsistencies with what you want. Say whatever you want about me (yes Im an asshole in person too) but I know for a fact Im consistent. That matters, you call it intellectual simplicity but I think it takes a lot of fortitude to use the "screw em all" approach.

[DukeNukeEm]

if it's the same money and you'd enjoy the latter, then why the hell not?

Because someone has to work at the plant to support the guy partyi ng and doing whatever in New York. Ive said numerous times I got no problem living the struggling actor life as long as youre independently capable of supporting it. But when you cant do that, and you then expect to make the same amount as the guy working a miserable 9-5 packing Stouffers by way of garnishing the plant workers wages to subsidize your life...

 

Yea thats clearly f***ed up.