Tea Party Libertarians complaining of co-opting

[NorthSideSox72]

I think you'd agree though that if you polled 10 people on the street, the majority would dismiss tea party members as either racist/homophobic/crazy christian/etc. Libertarian or "people just pissed at the size of government and the amount of spending by the government" is not what comes to mind, despite being the key message of the various rallies.

Well this is just silly. First of all, I've seen polls recently that indicated better than 50% of the country consider themselves supporters of the Tea Party to one degree or another, so that's 5 people right there who wouldn't say that. Then there are people who are actually educated enough to not just put everyone into an extreme category. I'd be shocked if more than 1 or 2 out of 10 said anything like that.

 

[Jenksismyhero]

Well this is just silly. First of all, I've seen polls recently that indicated better than 50% of the country consider themselves supporters of the Tea Party to one degree or another, so that's 5 people right there who wouldn't say that. Then there are people who are actually educated enough to not just put everyone into an extreme category. I'd be shocked if more than 1 or 2 out of 10 said anything like that.

 

You have more faith in the American public than I do apparently. I'm saying if you ask 10 random people to describe a tea party member, you'll get something along the lines of "extreme GOP member" or Palin supporter, etc.

[LittleHurt05]

You have more faith in the American public than I do apparently. I'm saying if you ask 10 random people to describe a tea party member, you'll get something along the lines of "extreme GOP member" or Palin supporter, etc.

 

You have more faith in the people than I do. I bet several of those people have no idea what the Tea Party even is.

[Rex Kickass]

You have more faith in the American public than I do apparently. I'm saying if you ask 10 random people to describe a tea party member, you'll get something along the lines of "extreme GOP member" or Palin supporter, etc.

 

I think that has to do with a lot of the high profile "Tea Party Approved" candidates that showed up last year. Like Christine O'Donnell, who was propelled to her nomination by the DE Tea Party. Or Joe Miller from Alaska. Or even Rand Paul, who may have won in KY, but did so in a manner that made him pretty embarrassing to half the self described tea party members.

 

If the Tea Party wants to distance themselves from Palin and her ilk, Tea Party organizations should stop inviting her to speak at every other event they have. Its hard not to be tied in to the crazy faces of your party, when those crazy faces keep winning GOP nominations and run high profile campaigns.

[lostfan]

80% of the American public also thinks Obama raised taxes in 2010. They don't understand complicated ideas. If self-identified Tea Party supporters don't like how it sounds when they hear other people define the movement, they should try having left of center political views and hearing Tea Partiers define even the simplest left-wing ideology. It varies between hilarious, annoying, and sad.

[NorthSideSox72]

You have more faith in the American public than I do apparently. I'm saying if you ask 10 random people to describe a tea party member, you'll get something along the lines of "extreme GOP member" or Palin supporter, etc.

Well that might be true - but what you just said is very different than what you said earlier.

 

[Jenksismyhero]

80% of the American public also thinks Obama raised taxes in 2010. They don't understand complicated ideas. If self-identified Tea Party supporters don't like how it sounds when they hear other people define the movement, they should try having left of center political views and hearing Tea Partiers define even the simplest left-wing ideology. It varies between hilarious, annoying, and sad.

 

That's the problem here. If you've been to a rally, you know the message, and just because Palin or O'Donnell or whatever has jumped onto the bandwagon (and the hater-media has jumped onto them jumping on the bandwagon) the message has gotten lost. That doesn't devalue the message, or require that the original supporters explain themselves. It requires people educate themselves and not rely on the moronic media to tell them about it.

[southsider2k5]

That's the problem here. If you've been to a rally, you know the message, and just because Palin or O'Donnell or whatever has jumped onto the bandwagon (and the hater-media has jumped onto them jumping on the bandwagon) the message has gotten lost. That doesn't devalue the message, or require that the original supporters explain themselves. It requires people educate themselves and not rely on the moronic media to tell them about it.

 

And to remember the quote about repeating something a bunch of times not actually making it true.

[mr_genius]

The main issues will continue to be fiscal. If the evangelicals want to run candidates in primaries that are focused on social issues, they can certainly do that. But no one did that this last election. They ran on fiscal issues, so these newly elected reps should follow through or they will be 1 term flashes in the pan.

[Rex Kickass]

The main issues will continue to be fiscal. If the evangelicals want to run candidates in primaries that are focused on social issues, they can certainly do that. But no one did that this last election. They ran on fiscal issues, so these newly elected reps should follow through or they will be 1 term flashes in the pan.

 

Pan meet flash.

WASHINGTON — As one of its first acts, the new Congress will consider denying citizenship to the children of illegal immigrants who are born in the United States.

 

Those children, who are now automatically granted citizenship at birth, will be one of the first targets of the Republican-led House when it convenes in January.

 

GOP Rep. Steve King of Iowa, the incoming chairman of the subcommittee that oversees immigration, is expected to push a bill that would deny "birthright citizenship" to such children.

 

The measure, assailed by critics as unconstitutional, is an indication of how the new majority intends to flex its muscles on the volatile issue of illegal immigration.

 

Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/11/18/1039...l#ixzz168Txnx9q

[NorthSideSox72]

Pan meet flash.

 

 

Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/11/18/1039...l#ixzz168Txnx9q

Not only is this further showing that divide I was referring to, but its also clearly not Constitutional. They know this of course, and they know it won't pass as an amendment, so that means this is pretty much just for show. What a sad waste of time.

 

[Balta1701]

Not only is this further showing that divide I was referring to, but its also clearly not Constitutional. They know this of course, and they know it won't pass as an amendment, so that means this is pretty much just for show. What a sad waste of time.

Be honest. Do you think that this bill is not a tea party priority?

[NorthSideSox72]

Be honest. Do you think that this bill is not a tea party priority?

That's sort of like asking, do you think that extending the Bush tax cuts is a priority for this Congress? The answer is both "yes" and "sort of", depending on how you slice Congress or Tea Party.

 

[Balta1701]

That's sort of like asking, do you think that extending the Bush tax cuts is a priority for this Congress? The answer is both "yes" and "sort of", depending on how you slice Congress or Tea Party.

The reason why I ask is...I'd answer "Yes, of course", because of my opinion of the relationship between the Tea Party and the rest of the party, as I outlined earlier.

 

Frankly, if there was a Republican who spoke out strongly against that sort of bill, I'd say there's a good chance they'd face a "Tea party" primary challenge in 2012.

[NorthSideSox72]

The reason why I ask is...I'd answer "Yes, of course", because of my opinion of the relationship between the Tea Party and the rest of the party, as I outlined earlier.

 

Frankly, if there was a Republican who spoke out strongly against that sort of bill, I'd say there's a good chance they'd face a "Tea party" primary challenge in 2012.

Yes they would. But they don't have to speak out against it, because they know this is a non-starter. Its a show-the-flag sort of thing.

 

[southsider2k5]

Pan meet flash.

 

 

Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/11/18/1039...l#ixzz168Txnx9q

 

Illegal immigration is a huge financial issue. With all of the social programs we have, and the financial situations they are in, this might be one of the biggest financial bombs out there. This is literally a trillions of dollars question.

[Jenksismyhero]

Illegal immigration is a huge financial issue. With all of the social programs we have, and the financial situations they are in, this might be one of the biggest financial bombs out there. This is literally a trillions of dollars question.

 

Racist!

[NorthSideSox72]

Racist!

Alright seriously, could you stop with the hyperbole? No one is saying that, at all. I'd love it if we could have a discussion in here without people turning everything into an extreme.

 

Yes, I know that was in green, but you are clearly trying to say the only opposition to this is that its somehow racist.

 

[Soxbadger]

Everyone who wants to be a US citizen should be free to become one. Everyone who is born in the US is a citizen.

 

This will be a battle for the soul of America.

[NorthSideSox72]

Everyone who wants to be a US citizen should be free to become one. Everyone who is born in the US is a citizen.

 

This will be a battle for the soul of America.

That's a little melodramatic. This won't even make it to the President's desk, let alone be a battle for our souls. Its unconstitutional, and there is zero chance an amendment will survive, so its all just theater.

 

[Rex Kickass]

Illegal immigration is a huge financial issue. With all of the social programs we have, and the financial situations they are in, this might be one of the biggest financial bombs out there. This is literally a trillions of dollars question.

 

Please point to any concrete evidence where changing the 14th amendment would solve our undocumented immigration issues.

[Soxbadger]

I disagree, while I think its ultimately unlikely to succeed, I definitely think that immigration issues are going to become major focal points of certain campaigns.

 

Furthermore, the fact that people even are willing to consider something that I believe is so fundamentally un-American makes me believe that certain perspectives have already been warped.

 

I hope that it dies quickly, but I think that there are people out there that genuinely believe that this is an acceptable idea.

[southsider2k5]

Please point to any concrete evidence where changing the 14th amendment would solve our undocumented immigration issues.

 

Anchor babies are a huge part of the strategy in this. The whole "we can't break up families" tactic has been a cornerstone of legalization.

[NorthSideSox72]

I disagree, while I think its ultimately unlikely to succeed, I definitely think that immigration issues are going to become major focal points of certain campaigns.

 

Furthermore, the fact that people even are willing to consider something that I believe is so fundamentally un-American makes me believe that certain perspectives have already been warped.

 

I hope that it dies quickly, but I think that there are people out there that genuinely believe that this is an acceptable idea.

Certainly immigration will be a major issue in general, and yes, some people believe this is an acceptable idea. I am in fact one of them.

 

But this particular effort can't succeed, its just not viable. So I'd worry more about immigration laws that are not obviously unconstitutional, than this particular effort.

 

 

[Balta1701]

Anchor babies are a huge part of the strategy in this. The whole "we can't break up families" tactic has been a cornerstone of legalization.

You say that as though "Legalization" is an obviously dirty word.