Dick Allen Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 02:14 PM) They're going to pay Dunn + Konerko more than that for the next 3 years. Gonzalez + Viciedo will cost less for the next 4 years, probably better offensive production, a lot better defense. I thought Viciedo was considered part of the package for Gonzalez. If the Sox don't bring back Konerko, Dunn and Viciedo is probably better than just Gonzalez, and cheaper. Now the Sox have Viciedo in the wings or to maybe use as a trade chip, although I doubt it. I really think KW is hoping the kid can somehow play 3B, or move to the OF and Quentin is sent packing. Especially considering Gonzalez might not be full strength at the start of the season. I think the only worry if you want Konerko back is Texas. Edited December 5, 2010 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 The Red Sox owned this f***ing deal. With Martinez and eventually Beltre and Felipe Lopez signing elsewhere, they accumulate 5 of the top 50 picks in what's supposed to be a loaded draft. So they'll be able to restock the system rather easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisoxfan09 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 MLBTR reporting this deal may fall apart yet due to the short extension window. Agon´s camp wants the extension done now and the BosSox want to wait, Stay tuned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Heyman saying says Gonzalez deal fell through, according to his sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 01:58 PM) MLBTR reporting this deal may fall apart yet due to the short extension window. Agon´s camp wants the extension done now and the BosSox want to wait, Stay tuned. WTF Boston? If you're going to trade for the guy and ask for the extension window, why wouldn't you get the extension done? Crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 01:42 PM) Heyman saying says Gonzalez deal fell through, according to his sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa1334 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (DirtySox @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 01:51 PM) werent the cubs supposably in on agone? does this mean they have a chance of getting him now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 01:58 PM) werent the cubs supposably in on agone? does this mean they have a chance of getting him now? If Padres are still willing to trade him, he is up for grabs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That funky motion Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 01:58 PM) werent the cubs supposably in on agone? does this mean they have a chance of getting him now? Or they go after Paulie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:58 PM) werent the cubs supposably in on agone? does this mean they have a chance of getting him now? It wouldn't be hard at all for the Cubs to beat that package if they gave up Castro or Soto, but they might not get the "I used to work for Boston" discount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa1334 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 01:59 PM) If Padres are still willing to trade him, he is up for grabs. it makes a ton of sense(sadly). of the big market teams, the cubs make the most sense because the yankees have teixeira, angels have morales, the red sox now appear out of it. agone is still going to make only 5-6 mil this yr and next year when he makes 18-20, the cubs can afford it because of ramirez's contract coming off the books Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:03 PM) it makes a ton of sense(sadly). of the big market teams, the cubs make the most sense because the yankees have teixeira, angels have morales, the red sox now appear out of it. agone is still going to make only 5-6 mil this yr and next year when he makes 18-20, the cubs can afford it because of ramirez's contract coming off the books Boston isn't necessarily out of it. It's far from over. I bet they keep working on it through the winter meetings this week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (DirtySox @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 03:06 PM) Boston isn't necessarily out of it. It's far from over. I bet they keep working on it through the winter meetings this week. It's not about the players though, it's about the contract extension. They can't exactly negotiate with Gonzalez now since he's a Padre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:00 PM) It wouldn't be hard at all for the Cubs to beat that package if they gave up Castro or Soto, but they might not get the "I used to work for Boston" discount. I doubt they would give him the long-term contract he is looking for. I wonder if they would be willing to give up the pieces for a one-year rental, especially since they aren't expected to contend in 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:07 PM) It's not about the players though, it's about the contract extension. Indeed. Is their something preventing them from re-attempting this deal with another extension window though? I'm not well versed on such a matter. It sounds like the issue was length. Adrian wants 8, Boston wanted to do 6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (DirtySox @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 03:10 PM) Indeed. Is their something preventing them from re-attempting this deal with another extension window though? I'm not well versed on such a matter. It sounds like the issue was length. Adrian wants 8, Boston wanted to do 6. They have to receive permission from the commissioner's office to have an extension negotiation window, and as far as I know, the rules on that aren't published anywhere. The Commish's office might well be able to say no. But...if Gonzalez wants 8, then there's no amount of negotiating that the Padres and Red Sox can do with each other that can change that. If the Red Sox lowered their offer to the Padres, thinking that an 8 year commitment was more than they wanted to do, then the Padres shouldn't accept the deal. So, until the Red Sox are either willing to go to 8 or they're willing to take Gonzalez as a 1 and gone guy, there's no reason to re-do the deal. Gonzalez holds all of the leverage there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtySox Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Buster_ESPN Buster Olney The negotiating window on the Gonzalez trade, from mlb's perspective, is officially closed,without a new contract.Could always resurrect 55 seconds ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Its shocking this didn't get done, but if Boston can't get it done, really who can? If Boston is willing to 6 at about $20 million per season, it seems silly to me a guy coming off shoulder surgery would rather roll the dice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 03:26 PM) Its shocking this didn't get done, but if Boston can't get it done, really who can? If Boston is willing to 6 at about $20 million per season, it seems silly to me a guy coming off shoulder surgery would rather roll the dice. 6 years at $20 million = a 7 year, $126 contract. Mark Teixeira's contract was 8 years, $180 million. And that was signed 2 years ago. There's a reason why 8 years is Gonzalez's number, because Tex is the comparable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:35 PM) 6 years at $20 million = a 7 year, $126 contract. Mark Teixeira's contract was 8 years, $180 million. And that was signed 2 years ago. There's a reason why 8 years is Gonzalez's number, because Tex is the comparable. So he wants a 9 year contract? Then he can roll the dice and hope Boston has room for him next year because there are only a couple of teams that can or will hand out a contract like that and the Yankees aren't one since that position is filled. Its like building a $30 million house. If you ever have to sell it, it may be worth $30 million but if there aren't any buyers with access to $30 million, you are going to be out some money. I don't see how over $100 million isn't enough. See Gonzalez, Juan. Edited December 5, 2010 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:44 PM) So he wants a 9 year contract? Then he can roll the dice and hope Boston has room for him next year because there are only a couple of teams that can or will hand out a contract like that and the Yankees aren't one since that position is filled. Its like building a $30 million house. If you ever have to sell it, you better hope there are some people who are interested and have the money. Once the Yankees sign Lee, Boston will be on the phone with Gonzalez's agent saying whatever it takes, let's get it done. Obviously, the pieces for the trade would be the same. There is NO WAY Gonzalez isn't on the Red Sox roster to start the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 (edited) QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:51 PM) Once the Yankees sign Lee, Boston will be on the phone with Gonzalez's agent saying whatever it takes, let's get it done. Obviously, the pieces for the trade would be the same. There is NO WAY Gonzalez isn't on the Red Sox roster to start the year. They can't negotiate with another team's player. This was a special window MLB granted. I also believe the Red Sox figure Cliff Lee is going to be a Yankee. If the Red Sox bring back Beltre, Gonzalez might not have Boston or the Yankees bidding for his services next year. The chances of a Mark Texiera size deal will be zero. Remeber, Tex had the advantage of a Boston/NYY bidding war. That's not happening with this player. Edited December 5, 2010 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:54 PM) They can't negotiate with another team's player. This was a special window MLB granted. I also believe the Red Sox figure Cliff Lee is going to be a Yankee. If the Red Sox bring back Beltre, Gonzalez might not have Boston or the Yankees bidding for his services next year. The chances of a Mark Texiera size deal will be zero. Ah, didn't know that. My point is still the same though. Lee to Yankees, Boston needs to react. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 02:55 PM) Ah, didn't know that. My point is still the same though. Lee to Yankees, Boston needs to react. I'm sure that already figured into their proposal. He still would be under contract for 7 years and $126 million. Its stupid for him to turn it down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 5, 2010 -> 03:58 PM) I'm sure that already figured into their proposal. He still would be under contract for 7 years and $126 million. Its stupid for him to turn it down. If he plays 1 more year and stays healthy, he'd likely be in line for a Tex level contract. In other words, playing 1 more healthy season would be worth $54 million total, based on the numbers we're guesstimating here. That's why it's not stupid for him to turn it downl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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