Greinke traded to the Brewers

[Jordan4life_2007]

The question for any team like that is...if you give up a major young piece for a $10 million a year pitcher under control for only 2 years, can you actually win anything to make it worth it? Even if Bautista repeats his year, I'm not sure the Jays can.

 

The Jays are stacked with quality arms right now. That's why they were able to trade Marcum and not really downgrade at all.

[Balta1701]

I'm not singling this particular prospect out, hell he could be the next V-Mart for all I know and every team in the league's scouts agree on that, but I take NYY prospect trumpeting with a grain of salt because they're the Yankees. Not saying the org hasn't produced some wonderful players but there's also Joba updates we had to endure only because he was on the NYY.

I totally agree, and if I were the Royals...I'd be a little excessively skeptical with any offer from the Yanks. I'd be demanding they overpay.

[iamshack]

Yeah, but would have to see who is on and who is not on his NTC, could change a lot.

When you start demanding a trade, NTC's seem to become irrelevant.

 

 

[Balta1701]

The Jays are stacked with quality arms right now. That's why they were able to trade Marcum and not really downgrade at all.

Which to me begs the question..."why would you give up quality cheap and under control arms for Greinke unless you think you can field a 95 win team next year with him?"

[SoxFan562004]

The question for any team like that is...if you give up a major young piece for a $10 million a year pitcher under control for only 2 years, can you actually win anything to make it worth it? Even if Bautista repeats his year, I'm not sure the Jays can.

boy, that's a tough call and one they would spend days looking at. Obviously I see your point, but to look at it from the positive perspective of the Jays, at this point or even with AP back, the NYY rotation isn't spectacular, Tampa's offensive took a hit with Crawford (I know they have a great prospect replacing him, but he's still young), and Baltimore is Baltimore. Obviously the Red Sox are the cream of the crop, so they'll have to look at AL central and west to see if they think they have a good chance at being a wild card...

 

Also, some teams just roll the dice, baseball has been flat-lining in Toronto for a few years now, and if they think this might be the move to get some relevancy back, then they may pull the trigger.

[Vote4Pedro]

The Yankees will go very hard after him I imagine.

can you imagine the spotlight that will be on Greinke if he indeed does get traded to them....he went from no pressure in KC to the most in all of sports overnight - recipe for disaster in NY

[Jordan4life_2007]

Which to me begs the question..."why would you give up quality cheap and under control arms for Greinke unless you think you can field a 95 win team next year with him?"

 

Exactly. Which is why I believe the Jays wouldn't be a player. They appear to be totally committed to building from within.

[Balta1701]

Also, some teams just roll the dice, baseball has been flat-lining in Toronto for a few years now, and if they think this might be the move to get some relevancy back, then they may pull the trigger.

Trouble is, that's pretty much a recipe for long-term mediocrity, giving up things not because it's the best move to win, but instead because it might help put people in the seats.

[Balta1701]

Exactly. Which is why I believe the Jays wouldn't be a player. They appear to be totally committed to building from within.

And although I don't know their system...I'd say that's exactly what they ought to be doing.

[SoxFan562004]

When you start demanding a trade, NTC's seem to become irrelevant.

not really because you still have to waive it for certain teams. I could be wrong, but I didn't see where he said he would hold out if not traded. Guys put a NTC in for leverage. There's 15 teams on the list according to reports, he can limit it to a handful of teams and make the Royals pick from the reduced list, it's still a major factor.

 

of course the Jays have 15 other teams not on the list they can ship him to, but may get less because he might make it clear he won't sign an extension with those teams.

Edited December 18, 2010 by SoxFan562004

[SoxFan562004]

And although I don't know their system...I'd say that's exactly what they ought to be doing.

I think there's a few players that become available that make teams rethink their plans a little. Greinke may be one of those for many teams... again, just brainstorming here and thought of the Jays because they're mentioned in the main article

[Jordan4life_2007]

boy, that's a tough call and one they would spend days looking at. Obviously I see your point, but to look at it from the positive perspective of the Jays, at this point or even with AP back, the NYY rotation isn't spectacular, Tampa's offensive took a hit with Crawford (I know they have a great prospect replacing him, but he's still young), and Baltimore is Baltimore. Obviously the Red Sox are the cream of the crop, so they'll have to look at AL central and west to see if they think they have a good chance at being a wild card...

 

Also, some teams just roll the dice, baseball has been flat-lining in Toronto for a few years now, and if they think this might be the move to get some relevancy back, then they may pull the trigger.

 

The Jays have some of the deepest collection of arms in the game right now. If you've read anything about him, Alex Aposopahdhd (I couldn't spell his last name to save my life) has totally committed and allocated most of their resources into the farm and player development. I seriously doubt they would alter that plan at this point. And it's not like they're just one player away.

[SoxFan562004]

The Jays have some of the deepest collection of arms in the game right now. If you've read anything about him, Alex Aposopahdhd (I couldn't spell his last name to save my life) has totally committed and allocated most of their resources into the farm and player development. I seriously doubt they would alter that plan at this point. And it's not like they're just one player away.

again, I'm not saying they are going to go gung-ho after the guy, but plans change, sometimes names pop up on the market and owners override baseball people and sometimes even if a prospect is highly regarded around baseball the internal scouts of a team have different views on guys.

 

Would I make them the front-runner? No, I would guess Texas would be.

[Balta1701]

I think there's a few players that become available that make teams rethink their plans a little. Greinke may be one of those for many teams... again, just brainstorming here and thought of the Jays because they're mentioned in the main article

The big difference is that he's only signed for 2 years. If it was like David Price who's under team control for a while, maybe, but if you trade for Greinke, you need to win this year. Bautista's a FA at the end of the year and God only knows what you get there, and then Greinke's gone next year.

[iamshack]

not really because you still have to waive it for certain teams. I could be wrong, but I didn't see where he said he would hold out if not traded. Guys put a NTC in for leverage. There's 15 teams on the list according to reports, he can limit it to a handful of teams and make the Royals pick from the reduced list, it's still a major factor.

 

of course the Jays have 15 other teams not on the list they can ship him to, but may get less because he might make it clear he won't sign an extension with those teams.

Look at what he's doing though...he's got a clause in his contract which implies he does not wish to be traded to half the League, then he gives the team an ultimatum to trade him.

 

They're going to come back and say "Look, we'll honor your request, but not under these conditions. We need to do what's best for the Kansas City Royals going forward and this condition hinders that."

 

My guess is he goes to a team on that list, ultimately.

[SoxFan562004]

Look at what he's doing though...he's got a clause in his contract which implies he does not wish to be traded to half the League, then he gives the team an ultimatum to trade him.

 

They're going to come back and say "Look, we'll honor your request, but not under these conditions. We need to do what's best for the Kansas City Royals going forward and this condition hinders that."

 

My guess is he goes to a team on that list, ultimately.

yes, I'm sure he will, it's why a lot of players put teams on that list, but I think he will go to one of those teams with an extension signed.

[Jordan4life_2007]

again, I'm not saying they are going to go gung-ho after the guy, but plans change, sometimes names pop up on the market and owners override baseball people and sometimes even if a prospect is highly regarded around baseball the internal scouts of a team have different views on guys.

 

Would I make them the front-runner? No, I would guess Texas would be.

 

Well in Romero, Morrow and Cecil they've already got a pretty solid foundation. And then there's Kyle Drabek, Deck McGuire, Zach Stewart and Asher Wojciechowski who are all pretty much universally regarded as big-time pitching prospects. I just don't see them going after a guy who's only got 2 years and over $26 million left on his current deal when they're hardly a player away from running with the Yankees and Red Sox.

[iamshack]

yes, I'm sure he will, it's why a lot of players put teams on that list, but I think he will go to one of those teams with an extension signed.

I guess I'd agree with you more if he didnt just fire his representation.

[SoxFan562004]

I guess I'd agree with you more if he didnt just fire his representation.

is his new agent have a reputation of any kind? He could have changed representation for many reasons, meaning maybe the new agent works better with big market teams or long term big money deals... also reverse could be true.

Edited December 18, 2010 by SoxFan562004

[iamshack]

is his new agent have a reputation of any kind? He could have changed representation for many reasons.

I guess what I'm pointing out is that his goals might have changed since the NTC was bargained for.

[SoxFan562004]

I guess what I'm pointing out is that his goals might have changed since the NTC was bargained for.

true, I don't think any of us know, what I'm pointing out is maybe he changed to wanting a long term extension to waive it and didn't feel his original agent was the right person for that job. Again, KC could get a great offer from one of the other 15 teams that are willing to take the 2 years and see what happens. A lot has to play out in this for it to happen.

[WCSox]

Yep. I just wonder how Greinke would fare under that big of a spotlight.

 

Yeah, no kidding. Having experienced Javy Vazquez's lack of fortitude *twice* in New York, I'd imagine that Cashman would be hesitant to pursue him.

 

[greg775]

They should trade him to the Rangers if they can get some good guys in return.

Rangers lost Lee; need Greinke.

[Harry Chappas]

Brewers, White Sox and Cardinals should all be in on this.

 

The White Sox should move Danks to the Yanks for the prospects the Royals would like and then add Viciedo or Morel.

 

A three way deal gets you around the NTC to a degree.

[caulfield12]

He's a pretty unique kid.

 

I think he'd actually be okay in New York, there are so many other superstars on that team that he could blend into the mix fairly well.

 

He wouldn't be coming in as the savior or with one of those huge contracts like Burnett.

 

I'll never forget the article in the KC Star where he said he would like to just walk away from baseball and "mow lawns with his headphones on" as his job. I think (correct me if I'm wrong) he was diagnosed with social anxiety disorder at that time...I do think that all the losing has worn on him, and he'd be much better off on a winning ballclub.

 

He's not a Javier Vazquez. If I'm Cashman, I make the deal and cross my fingers. (The downside is that Rivera, Jeter, Posada, Pettite, etc., won't be around forever and they'll need to build around some of their new younger wave of star players and prospects, like Cano and Montero).

 

But yes, teams like the Rangers or LA Angels/Dodgers (in terms of having a fanbase and mentality that's more laid-back and casual) would seem like better fits than East Coast teams. In some ways, he's always reminded me of Garland a bit, although I think he really has a next gear and "adrenaline" level where he can crank that fastball up into the mid to high 90's when he wants to, but he loses some of the control he has at 92-93.

Edited December 18, 2010 by caulfield12