Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 QUOTE (Paint it Black @ Jan 9, 2011 -> 10:03 PM) Within reason, what the hell did you want them to do that they didn't do? Already answered that in is the Kenny done thread. Not doing it here. I've already apologized to Tex and I'm not turning this thread into the J4L hates life soap opera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 All I really hope for in the off season is reasons to make me optimistic for the coming year and they have done that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2HH Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 I'm happy with their off season tinkering and deals. That is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Paint it Black @ Jan 9, 2011 -> 10:03 PM) Within reason, what the hell did you want them to do that they didn't do? J4L's expectations are higher than most users'. I don't think that's a huge issue. I wouldn't give the off-season an A+ either. I think out of all the teams in baseball, the Sox might have had the 4th or 5th best off-season in terms of acquiring talent and spending responsibly and efficiently. I'd rate teams like the Brewers, Phillies, Red Sox, and the A's ahead of our off-season right now. I'd even consider the Tigers since they just added Penny. As it stands, I'd give The Sox FO an A- with room to improve to an A if they bring in a good 4th OFer. Edited January 11, 2011 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 12:30 PM) J4L's expectations are higher than most users'. I don't think that's a huge issue. I wouldn't give the off-season an A+ either. I think out of all the teams in baseball, the Sox might have had the 4th or 5th best off-season in terms of acquiring talent and spending responsibly and efficiently. I'd rate teams like the Brewers, Phillies, Red Sox, and the A's ahead of our off-season right now. I'd even consider the Tigers since they just added Penny. As it stands, I'd give The Sox FO an A- with room to improve to an A if they bring in a good 4th OFer. Can't believe I will say this, but... I don't know that you will find a substantially better 4th OF than Lillibridge or De Aza. Because if you did, they wouldn't be a 4th OF, they'd be starting somewhere. I'm not a fan of spending big money on a backup OF unless you plan some sort of rotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 02:32 PM) Can't believe I will say this, but... I don't know that you will find a substantially better 4th OF than Lillibridge or De Aza. Because if you did, they wouldn't be a 4th OF, they'd be starting somewhere. I'm not a fan of spending big money on a backup OF unless you plan some sort of rotation. I could see De Aza as a 4th outfielder, but Lillibridge's bat is about as bad as you can get. If De Aza's healthy and puts up a .320 wOBA, I would be okay with him as a 4th OFer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 02:44 PM) I could see De Aza as a 4th outfielder, but Lillibridge's bat is about as bad as you can get. If De Aza's healthy and puts up a .320 wOBA, I would be okay with him as a 4th OFer. Lillibridge has the advantage of also being an infielder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 04:51 PM) Lillibridge has the advantage of also being an infielder. The Sox already have Vizquel and Teahen to play infield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 02:54 PM) The Sox already have Vizquel and Teahen to play infield. If my memory serves me correctly Ozzie likes to have 2 backup IFs. I don't count Teahen as he backs up 1B/3B/LF/RF Edited January 11, 2011 by justBLAZE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 04:04 PM) If my memory serves me correctly Ozzie likes to have 2 backup IFs. I don't count Teahen as he only backs up 3B/1B. So who backs up Rios? Pierre, and have Teahen play left? That sounds dreadful with Quentin in RF too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 03:06 PM) So who backs up Rios? Pierre, and have Teahen play left? That sounds dreadful with Quentin in RF too. Well, Lillibridge can cover some outfield too. My point was De Aza is strictly an outfielder, Lillibrigde played 6 games in CF last year. Edited January 11, 2011 by justBLAZE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 03:06 PM) So who backs up Rios? Pierre, and have Teahen play left? That sounds dreadful with Quentin in RF too. I really want Andruw Jones back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 03:09 PM) I really want Andruw Jones back. A 2 WAR player off the bench would be real nice. Our bench currently comprises of at least 3 possible replacement level players in Teahen, Lillibridge, and De Aza. Vizquel's not too far away from that mark since he can't hit all that well. Edited January 11, 2011 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 03:12 PM) A 2 WAR player off the bench would be real nice. Our bench currently comprises of at least 3 possible replacement level players in Teahen, Lillibridge, and De Aza. Vizquel's not too far away from that mark since he can't hit all that well. We've flat got no power off the bench. And that concerns me somewhat. What's the word on Jones anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 03:21 PM) We've flat got no power off the bench. And that concerns me somewhat. What's the word on Jones anyway? Looking at the Yankees per the Score this afternoon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 03:28 PM) Looking at the Yankees per the Score this afternoon That sucks. Thanks for the update. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 01:30 PM) J4L's expectations are higher than most users'. I don't think that's a huge issue. I wouldn't give the off-season an A+ either. I think out of all the teams in baseball, the Sox might have had the 4th or 5th best off-season in terms of acquiring talent and spending responsibly and efficiently. I'd rate teams like the Brewers, Phillies, Red Sox, and the A's ahead of our off-season right now. I'd even consider the Tigers since they just added Penny. As it stands, I'd give The Sox FO an A- with room to improve to an A if they bring in a good 4th OFer. The Orioles have had an underrated offseason. Between Reynolds, Lee, Hardy, and Uehara, that's conservatively 9 wins worth of additions. Which is more than the White Sox added for much less money (they obviously had more spots to address, though). Even with their pitiful rotation, I think they'll be very close to a .500 team in 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (3E8 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 04:40 PM) The Orioles have had an underrated offseason. Between Reynolds, Lee, Hardy, and Uehara, that's conservatively 9 wins worth of additions. Which is more than the White Sox added for much less money (they obviously had more spots to address, though). Even with their pitiful rotation, I think they'll be very close to a .500 team in 2011. I agree with you about the O's offseason. But they've gotta prove it to me. I had them as a big sleeper last year. I didn't think they could win the division or anything. But almost 100 losses? I didn't expect that at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 04:09 PM) I really want Andruw Jones back. I agree 110%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (3E8 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 04:40 PM) The Orioles have had an underrated offseason. Between Reynolds, Lee, Hardy, and Uehara, that's conservatively 9 wins worth of additions. Which is more than the White Sox added for much less money (they obviously had more spots to address, though). Even with their pitiful rotation, I think they'll be very close to a .500 team in 2011. Are you sure that's more than what the Sox added? You can count on at least 6 wins between Konerko and Dunn. A.J. is two wins because he's a catcher and that's like automatic. Crain and Ohman together is worth a win. I like the Orioles' off-season too. I made a list of the best off-seasons on my blog before the year ended. I used a system (albeit kinda flawed) and my opinion to put it together. I had the Orioles as 11th, but that was before they got Lee. With Lee, I'd say they crack the top 10, but probably aren't there with the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 06:15 PM) Are you sure that's more than what the Sox added? You can count on at least 6 wins between Konerko and Dunn. A.J. is two wins because he's a catcher and that's like automatic. Crain and Ohman together is worth a win. I like the Orioles' off-season too. I made a list of the best off-seasons on my blog before the year ended. I used a system (albeit kinda flawed) and my opinion to put it together. I had the Orioles as 11th, but that was before they got Lee. With Lee, I'd say they crack the top 10, but probably aren't there with the Sox. Yeah, Dunn, Konerko, and AJ alone put up like a 10 WAR last year (if memory serves). I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect a 14 WAR out of Donkey Kong, AJ, Crain, Ohman, and Morel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 06:23 PM) Yeah, Dunn, Konerko, and AJ alone put up like a 10 WAR last year (if memory serves). I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect a 14 WAR out of Donkey Kong, AJ, Crain, Ohman, and Morel. They did, but that was with Konerko and Dunn both posting the highest WAR either of them have in the past five years. My conservative estimate for them is 2.5 for PK and 3 for Dunn (looking at the most recent seasons, this is perfectly reasonable). Even being optimistic for both, say 3.5 wins apiece, in your 14 WAR prediction you'd have to get 7 wins from AJ/Morel/Crain/Ohman. That's a bit unrealistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (3E8 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 06:37 PM) They did, but that was with Konerko and Dunn both posting the highest WAR either of them have in the past five years. My conservative estimate for them is 2.5 for PK and 3 for Dunn (looking at the most recent seasons, this is perfectly reasonable). Even being optimistic for both, say 3.5 wins apiece, in your 14 WAR prediction you'd have to get 7 wins from AJ/Morel/Crain/Ohman. That's a bit unrealistic. Let's just be clear about 1 thing...the reason why Dunn's WAR was the highest last year out of his career was that for once, UZR didn't hate his defense. Normally his defense counts for -1.5 to -3 wins. His bat has been worth 4-ish wins most every year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 QUOTE (3E8 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 06:37 PM) They did, but that was with Konerko and Dunn both posting the highest WAR either of them have in the past five years. My conservative estimate for them is 2.5 for PK and 3 for Dunn (looking at the most recent seasons, this is perfectly reasonable). Even being optimistic for both, say 3.5 wins apiece, in your 14 WAR prediction you'd have to get 7 wins from AJ/Morel/Crain/Ohman. That's a bit unrealistic. I had Dunn at 4 WAR, Konerko at 3, Morel at 2.5, AJ at 2, Crain at 1.5, and Ohman at 1. That's 14 WAR. 2.5 WAR may seem high for Morel, but if his defense is as good as advertised, then he could do it, although I agree that 2.5 is still pretty optimistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 11, 2011 -> 06:44 PM) Let's just be clear about 1 thing...the reason why Dunn's WAR was the highest last year out of his career was that for once, UZR didn't hate his defense. Normally his defense counts for -1.5 to -3 wins. His bat has been worth 4-ish wins most every year. Right. And moving to the AL and becoming a DH, he'll get the automatic negative positional adjustment which will not allow him the chance to benefit from a very questionable UZR. Dunn's bat has been worth 4 wins exactly once. Two out of the past four years, his bat has not been worth three wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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