Albert Pujols' extension - Cards fail to extend by deadline

[maggsmaggs]

Link: http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/st-loui...rces-say-020511

 

 

Quick update - Ken Rosenthal reports talks are not going well and Cards ownership balking at supposed asking price of 10/300 million. He could be a FA after the season but the clubs with money already have 1B locked up. The Cubs will have cleared a lot of payroll and if they unload Zambrano to the Yankees as some speculate well then even more money to spend... Time will tell.

It's a negotiation. There is no way Pujols doesn't re-sign with the Cardinals.

[SoxFan562004]

It's a negotiation. There is no way Pujols doesn't re-sign with the Cardinals.

I agree that it is aggressive negotiating by both sides, basically because many of the big market teams, specifically NYY, NYM, Bos and likel LAD unless their ownership situation shakes out won't be in it.

 

If asked today, I think it's likely he resigns with the Cards, however I don't think there's no way he doesn't. Even with the Wells deal I think the LAA will make a serious run at him if he hits free agency as well as if the Cubs can get some stuff straightened out they will. However, if he leaves it will be for top dollar, so it's not like the Cubs or another club can expect some sort of discount or even all things being equal with a Cards offer. If he hits FA, it's about money, and he'll have to get more than Stl is offering to leave. Will be interesting. Also, I could see the ST deadline coming and going and him still resigning.

[Balta1701]

It's a negotiation. There is no way Pujols doesn't re-sign with the Cardinals.

I don't know why Pujols would come down off that price. Maybe like 10/$280 as a discount for signing today, but other than a small discount, I don't know why he'd have anything to negotiate.

 

It's really the correct contract for him based on where the market has been for that level of player at that age.

[SoxFan562004]

I don't know why Pujols would come down off that price. Maybe like 10/$280 as a discount for signing today, but other than a small discount, I don't know why he'd have anything to negotiate.

 

It's really the correct contract for him based on where the market has been for that level of player at that age.

market has to do with timing when you're a FA as well, not only what's already on the books. With the 2 NY teams and Bos not really in on him there has to be teams that are going to give that to him. At this point who will? Possibly the LAA, maybe the Cubs if they can dump Zambrano and get some of their cash flow situation straightened out. He can't sit on that and expect it if a there's 3 teams seriously in on him and highest they'll go is like 8 and 28 a year.

[Balta1701]

market has to do with timing when you're a FA as well, not only what's already on the books. With the 2 NY teams and Bos not really in on him there has to be teams that are going to give that to him. At this point who will? Possibly the LAA, maybe the Cubs if they can dump Zambrano and get some of their cash flow situation straightened out. He can't sit on that and expect it if a there's 3 teams seriously in on him and highest they'll go is like 8 and 28 a year.

I think the Yankees would be thrilled to spend 10/$300 on that DH. I'd do that if I were Cashman.

 

I think the Angels would consider doing so, if they could move him to CF.

 

Boston could also be in the game; David Ortiz's contract is up at the end of this year, although their resources are a little more limited.

[SoxFan562004]

I think the Yankees would be thrilled to spend 10/$300 on that DH. I'd do that if I were Cashman.

 

I think the Angels would consider doing so, if they could move him to CF.

 

Boston could also be in the game; David Ortiz's contract is up at the end of this year, although their resources are a little more limited.

that's taking a major leap that Pujols would be OK DH'ing for the rest of his career... I haven't seen any hint of that. But I do agree, if he is willing to be a DH then NYY and Bos are in play.

[Balta1701]

that's taking a major leap that Pujols would be OK DH'ing for the rest of his career... I haven't seen any hint of that. But I do agree, if he is willing to be a DH then NYY and Bos are in play.

He won't want to obviously, but if he's geniunely going for the biggest contract possible, a willingness to DH brings the big guys in to play and makes it even more sensible for him to wind up in the AL.

[chisoxfan09]

that's taking a major leap that Pujols would be OK DH'ing for the rest of his career... I haven't seen any hint of that. But I do agree, if he is willing to be a DH then NYY and Bos are in play.

 

I can see him DHíng to save the wear and tear on his body (particularly his elbow) but I would be inclined to think most teams are not going to want to invest in him past his 38th/39th birthday. As noted before the only comparable player contract of this era belongs to ARod and he is beginning to show signs of regression now.

[SoxAce]

How about the Angels? I saw an article somewhere and posted about it in the off-season catch all thread. They missed out on their targets this year, maybe once the cost of Crawford and others got too much for them they decided to hold off and throw the bank at Pujols next year.

 

I would think every team in the MLB would be after or inquring about this guy (or at least make an offer, trade a guy to make room for him, etc..). It's Albert Pujols for gods sakes.

Edited February 5, 2011 by SoxAce

[Jerksticks]

Ricketts is completely handcuffed by the horrible contracts and cub fans are agitated that he isn't pumping money into this Titanic of a baseball roster. He's getting the label of being a cheap-ass but there's really nothing he can do but wait it out.

 

With the potential revenue of the cubs year in and out, Pujols is a very legit target for Ricketts. If cub fans really think Ricketts isn't going to try to win with the cubs they're delusional. He's a cub fan, but he's just laying low during this necessary purge. I expect Ricketts to make huge moves once he is able to... as his livelihood depends on putting butts in those seats. Pujols would be perfect and it scares the crap outa me that he could actually do that.

 

We'd become completely meaningless if Pujols signed there.

[fathom]

Ricketts is completely handcuffed by the horrible contracts and cub fans are agitated that he isn't pumping money into this Titanic of a baseball roster. He's getting the label of being a cheap-ass but there's really nothing he can do but wait it out.

 

With the potential revenue of the cubs year in and out, Pujols is a very legit target for Ricketts. If cub fans really think Ricketts isn't going to try to win with the cubs they're delusional. He's a cub fan, but he's just laying low during this necessary purge. I expect Ricketts to make huge moves once he is able to... as his livelihood depends on putting butts in those seats. Pujols would be perfect and it scares the crap outa me that he could actually do that.

 

We'd become completely meaningless if Pujols signed there.

 

It is very scary the idea of Pujols going to the Cubs, but I still think this is just a negotiation ploy.

[mmmmmbeeer]

I would think every team in the MLB would be after or inquring about this guy (or at least make an offer, trade a guy to make room for him, etc..). It's Albert Pujols for gods sakes.

 

 

Absolutely....I feel it's completely irrelevant what 1B teams like NYY and BOS have....this is Albert Pujols....the greatest player in MLB and one of the greatest of all-time. If you can get him, you get him...figure out how to shuffle the roster later.

[bigruss]

It is very scary the idea of Pujols going to the Cubs, but I still think this is just a negotiation ploy.

I see the Cubs going after him, and I think their offseason this year was a sign of what they expect to do. If they went full rebuild, why would Pujols go to them? Of course they could offer him more money but I think they learned a little bit about what happens when they do that.

 

My guess is that they want to contend enough this season, show Pujols that with him instead of Carlos Pena, that the team will be that much closer to contending. Throw in some additional moves and they wouldn't be too far off with Pujols on that team.

[southsider2k5]

I don't know why Pujols would come down off that price. Maybe like 10/$280 as a discount for signing today, but other than a small discount, I don't know why he'd have anything to negotiate.

 

It's really the correct contract for him based on where the market has been for that level of player at that age.

 

Unless there is steroid stuff out there, or he REALLY loves STL, there isn't any reason for him to settle.

[SoxFan562004]

Ricketts is completely handcuffed by the horrible contracts and cub fans are agitated that he isn't pumping money into this Titanic of a baseball roster. He's getting the label of being a cheap-ass but there's really nothing he can do but wait it out.

 

With the potential revenue of the cubs year in and out, Pujols is a very legit target for Ricketts. If cub fans really think Ricketts isn't going to try to win with the cubs they're delusional. He's a cub fan, but he's just laying low during this necessary purge. I expect Ricketts to make huge moves once he is able to... as his livelihood depends on putting butts in those seats. Pujols would be perfect and it scares the crap outa me that he could actually do that.

 

We'd become completely meaningless if Pujols signed there.

oh come on, what is your next post, the sky is falling?

 

The White Sox would not become completely irrelevant if Pujols signed with the Cubs. The Cubs are already a far more popular team in this city and the White Sox have won divisions and a World Series in the last 20 years of the Cubs gaining momentum. There wasn't a hotter/bigger story in summers sports than the Sosa/McGwire stuff and not a harder ticket in baseball to get than Cubs tickets, but somehow the Sox survived.

 

To portray Ricketts as some sort of bottomless pocket owner who is biding his time with some bad contracts and then it's bonanza time for the Cubs is not the reality IMO. He bought the team basically at the worst possible time, at the peak right before the economy hit, he was scrambling for celebrity investors to finalize the deal. Forbes has that team worth roughly 10% less than it was worth when he bought it, he has an aging stadium in a state that has zero interest in helping him pay for upgrades or the money it takes year in and year out to just keep the status quo there. Spiegel on WSCR was saying his payment on his loan for the team before dime one is spent on the stadium or the the team is something like 30m a year.

 

Let's look at a realistic scenario, even favoring the Cubs some if they can ink Pujols in the offseason. He will be 32 at the beginning of 2012, in an era of better testing and it will only be getting better if anything (please note I am not getting into the Pujols PED debate, I'm just pointing out we will likely see players age in a more appropriate way in the future instead of guys having monster years in their mid 30s.) They have a few deals coming off this year and they can move a good portion of Zambrano's deal. OK, so if Pujols hits FA he is going to the highest bidder because it will be about the money at that point, so the Cubs aren't getting a discount in money and years or even significant deferrals. His reported starting point is 10yrs at 300m, but hey, that's negotiating, but if he leaves Stl, it's realistic he's looking at 10 and 26-28 or 8 at 240, something in that neighborhood. So, let's put him at averaging 28m a year, realistic since that's about what A-Rod's deal is I believe and if he leaves Stl it's going to be for an A-Rod type deal for a per year basis. Cubs then need a roster around him. As it is they'd have an aging A-Ram, Soriano's deal for 3 more years and a few nice younger players with some potential, Castro being the one with the highest ceiling who's seen MLB action to this point. Let's say they got a good deal in Pena this year, he becomes completely out of the picture if they sign Pujols. Then the pitching staff after Garza for 2-3 more years of control, they reportedly have some good arms, Kashner being one of them, but they are prospects at this point and some decent aging vets. It's not like they will be able to sign a top of the rotation pitcher or two and Pujols.

 

Yes, if he signs with the Cubs it will obviously be an instant boom for Cubs, there is zero doubt about that, but the White Sox have weathered a major Cubs boom before, and I don't see how Pujols with what the Cubs have now and would potentially have with him, make them a top WS contender year in and year out. I think you can make a realistic argument that if Pujols is looking for a mega deal at 8-10 years and you're not Stl and losing him or a Bos/NYY who can eat mega deals at the end, it wouldn't be the best baseball move. The baseball and economic impact of the first 4-5 years of that deal have to be weighed against the potential albatross the last 4-5 years of that deal could end up being.

[chisoxfan09]

The naive stupid part of me wants to think he will take 6/180 or 7/210 just to get a higher yearly average than ARod. But hey that just me... And you can never count out the BoSox or Yanks getting into the bidding id he does indeed make it to FA.

[Balta1701]

Ricketts is completely handcuffed by the horrible contracts and cub fans are agitated that he isn't pumping money into this Titanic of a baseball roster. He's getting the label of being a cheap-ass but there's really nothing he can do but wait it out.

 

With the potential revenue of the cubs year in and out, Pujols is a very legit target for Ricketts. If cub fans really think Ricketts isn't going to try to win with the cubs they're delusional. He's a cub fan, but he's just laying low during this necessary purge. I expect Ricketts to make huge moves once he is able to... as his livelihood depends on putting butts in those seats. Pujols would be perfect and it scares the crap outa me that he could actually do that.

 

We'd become completely meaningless if Pujols signed there.

It's not just the handicapped by horrible contracts that hurts the Cubs. It's the ballpark.

 

They get a big advantage out of their ballpark in 1 sense...they constantly have 35,000/game sold, guaranteed. They have a guaranteed revenue stream.

 

But, unlike teams with more modern stadiums, they don't have huge numbers of skyboxes or big revenue sources that they can take advantage of if they have a great season.

 

So, their revenue doesn't drop much, but they also can't count on a gigantic revenue boost if they are competitive for several years in a row.

[Milkman delivers]

I really don't see Pujols ever ending up on the Cubs. The smaller reason is that I don't believe he'd actually make that move. I feel like it would tarnish his image and he's smarter than that. He'd probably also get hurt if he went there. The larger reason is that another team would definitely outbid the Cubs if it is solely about money.

[Rooftop Shots]

The naive stupid part of me wants to think he will take 6/180 or 7/210 just to get a higher yearly average than ARod. But hey that just me... And you can never count out the BoSox or Yanks getting into the bidding id he does indeed make it to FA.

 

After what Boston added this year with AGon and Crawford to what they already had, and then to add Pujols in the lineup? Man that is just beyond the realm of scary! Those guys would make that Bugs Bunny cartoon with the goons batting around the order a reality waiting in the wings.

[LittleHurt05]

http://www.albertcountdown.com/

[SoxFan562004]

http://www.albertcountdown.com/

eh, these deadlines get extended all the time, Pujols people would just say we're making progress

[chisoxfan09]

New link up to keep the Hot Stove goin:

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ti-p...onstalled020811

 

Basically a rehash of prior posts that the talks seemed to be stalled and now it looks like the deadline has been brought up by 3 days as Pujols reports on the 16th. I reckon this thread will if anything die down once ST starts.

[Balta1701]

I reckon this thread will if anything die down once ST starts.

If they stop talking, it'll rapidly turn into the "Where will Pujols go" thread.

[Harry Chappas]

I think if he does not resign they trade him to a team that wants to sign him.

 

Think Angels for Morales, Trout and Weaver or something along those lines.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I think if he does not resign they trade him to a team that wants to sign him.

 

Think Angels for Morales, Trout and Weaver or something along those lines.

 

The Angels would laugh at the Cardinals if that's what they asked for.