Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 02:03 AM) I love Buehrle. I'd really love to see him one day win a Cy Young, but that's probably not gonna happen unless he takes some of Paul Konerko's career revitalizing potion. He would have to go '05 and then some for that to happen. Mark is what he is at this point. No upside or downside. You're gonna get the innings. The 30+ starts. He's going to give up a s***load of hits. The peripherals will be mediocre. But he'll continue to overcome that like he has his entire career and do what he does. I'll be just fine with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:03 AM) I don't think he should get a 2 year contract from the Sox. He's at the age where he's bound to start a deep decline. Another team will probably outbid the Sox for his services, and he'll go elsewhere, and the Sox will IMO be better off with the cost savings. Mark Buehrle isn't the sort of pitcher that is coming out there with dominant stuff that he needs to worry about losing though. Mark's real fans have always used a guy like Jamie Moyer as a comparison; he's beating people by changing speeds and being ahead of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:03 AM) I don't think he should get a 2 year contract from the Sox. He's at the age where he's bound to start a deep decline. Another team will probably outbid the Sox for his services, and he'll go elsewhere, and the Sox will IMO be better off with the cost savings. How? Will his FB velocity go from 86 MPH to 84? Long as he remains healthy, he's got another 5 solid years, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 If this team fails to win the Central this year, I'd expect M-56 will be allowed to walk and the team will go for a rebuilding effort. If the team wins, they're going to keep the band together for one more year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 I think the AL Central has and will continue to figure him out. You can only fool people with junk for so long. IMO it's time for him to go before he turns awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:22 AM) I think the AL Central has and will continue to figure him out. You can only fool people with junk for so long. IMO it's time for him to go before he turns awful. Every bit of baseball I've ever watched totally disagrees with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:26 AM) Every bit of baseball I've ever watched totally disagrees with you. I'd almost be willing to bet you that he doesn't win 10 games in a Sox uniform this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:13 AM) If this team fails to win the Central this year, I'd expect M-56 will be allowed to walk and the team will go for a rebuilding effort. If the team wins, they're going to keep the band together for one more year. It would be the ugliest rebuild in team history. And I'm one that would be all for it if we get raped by the Twins again. But when you've got as many question marks as we have with the rotation after '11, combined with the natural disaster that is the farm, I think unfortunately we'd be looking at multiple 2007-like seasons. QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:22 AM) I think the AL Central has and will continue to figure him out. You can only fool people with junk for so long. IMO it's time for him to go before he turns awful. Again, I don't see how Mark would just all of a sudden start to suck outside of injury. His stuff has always been mediocre by many standards. And he continues to get the job done. Edited February 19, 2011 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:30 AM) I'd almost be willing to bet you that he doesn't win 10 games in a Sox uniform this year. I'd take that bet and give odds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:30 AM) I'd almost be willing to bet you that he doesn't win 10 games in a Sox uniform this year. Did Michael Vick hack into your account? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:34 AM) Did Michael Vick hack into your account? Like you just said... his stuff has always been mediocre by some standards and we all have seen him get absolutely pounded on the mound. I just think that those bad games will be more frequent as he gets older and that it might be coming up on the right time for the Sox to rid themselves of MB before he becomes terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisoxfan09 Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 Like you just said... his stuff has always been mediocre by some standards and we all have seen him get absolutely pounded on the mound. I just think that those bad games will be more frequent as he gets older and that it might be coming up on the right time for the Sox to rid themselves of MB before he becomes terrible. I don´t agree with you but at you at least saying let him play out his 2011 contract? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:44 AM) Like you just said... his stuff has always been mediocre by some standards and we all have seen him get absolutely pounded on the mound. I just think that those bad games will be more frequent as he gets older and that it might be coming up on the right time for the Sox to rid themselves of MB before he becomes terrible. Well that's true. His stuff is mediocre by most standards. I just don't see this decline you're hinting at. At least not in 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:30 AM) I'd almost be willing to bet you that he doesn't win 10 games in a Sox uniform this year. Let's bet. Buehrle's game has never been about "stuff". Its not about other teams "figuring him out", although if I were an opponent, I would make sure to interrupt his rythm by taking my time getting in the batter's box and stepping out a lot more than is being done now. Buehrle is all about location. If he's even slightly off, he tends to get pounded. As long as he can throw it were he wants, he'll be an effective pitcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Buehrle is the best 4th starter in baseball. As long as he wants to be paid like a 4th starter after this year, he can stay as long as he's putting up 32 starts and 200+ innings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (chisoxfan09 @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 07:49 AM) I don´t agree with you but at you at least saying let him play out his 2011 contract? I say call up the Yanks to see what the Sox could get for him. Maybe they could land one of the Yanks prized pitching prospects to fortify the rotation in the future AND get some big time payroll relief this year. I know that's not "all in" but it could be better for the organization in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (flavum @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:04 AM) Buehrle is the best 4th starter in baseball. As long as he wants to be paid like a 4th starter after this year, he can stay as long as he's putting up 32 starts and 200+ innings. That would be Cole Hamels. But I get the point you were trying to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:08 AM) That would be Cole Hamels. But I get the point you were trying to make. Yeah, I guess technically Hamels is a 4, but he's really a 3. I'd consider Halladay a 1. Lee and Oswalt are 2's, and Hamels is a 3. I consider Buehrle a 4 because of his production the last 5 seasons. On a championship team, he's the guy that you'd want pitching the 4th game at this point in his career. We need Danks, Jackson, and Floyd to step up, and man, if we get 25-30 starts from Peavy--and a postseason, then we have a shot this season. Edited February 19, 2011 by flavum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balfanman Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 09:06 AM) I say call up the Yanks to see what the Sox could get for him. Maybe they could land one of the Yanks prized pitching prospects to fortify the rotation in the future AND get some big time payroll relief this year. I know that's not "all in" but it could be better for the organization in the long run. Except that Buerhle has full no trade rights and I would be pretty sure that the Yankees are on his "no way"list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (balfanman @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:50 AM) Except that Buerhle has full no trade rights and I would be pretty sure that the Yankees are on his "no way"list. I wouldn't be so sure about that. I can't see him pitching for the Mets, but the Yanks? I could see that. Plus doesn't his contract get extended another year if he's traded? I think he'd fit in well with the Yanks or the Cardinals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balfanman Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 10:02 AM) I wouldn't be so sure about that. I can't see him pitching for the Mets, but the Yanks? I could see that. Plus doesn't his contract get extended another year if he's traded? I think he'd fit in well with the Yanks or the Cardinals. I would think that Mark is the type to not want to put up with New York & all that goes with it. I would bet that its too far awy from Missouri as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:44 AM) Like you just said... his stuff has always been mediocre by some standards and we all have seen him get absolutely pounded on the mound. I just think that those bad games will be more frequent as he gets older and that it might be coming up on the right time for the Sox to rid themselves of MB before he becomes terrible. You do realize that Jamie Moyer has pitched until his late forties...he and Mark have very similar pitching styles, and the fact that Mark is a southpaw will always make him reasonably effective. Mark is going to be able to pitch as long as he wants to, and as long as he manages to stay healthy. The question of whether he will be effective enough to merit a spot in a major league rotation is not something that should be an issue for him for many, many years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 02:03 AM) I love Buehrle. I'd really love to see him one day win a Cy Young, but that's probably not gonna happen unless he takes some of Paul Konerko's career revitalizing potion. His only Cy Young caliber season was 2005. And TBH he deserved it over Fartolo. Too bad Johan was actually better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 QUOTE (flavum @ Feb 19, 2011 -> 08:19 AM) Yeah, I guess technically Hamels is a 4, but he's really a 3. I'd consider Halladay a 1. Lee and Oswalt are 2's, and Hamels is a 3. I consider Buehrle a 4 because of his production the last 5 seasons. On a championship team, he's the guy that you'd want pitching the 4th game at this point in his career. We need Danks, Jackson, and Floyd to step up, and man, if we get 25-30 starts from Peavy--and a postseason, then we have a shot this season. Buehrle's a second starter on most teams. 3-4 WAR pitchers don't grow on trees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Chet, I'm pretty sure you're the only person in the entire world that thinks Buehrle is going to swiftly fall off a cliff. Personally, I think he's going to put up an ERA of about 4.25 over the next 5-7 years and throw 1000-1500 innings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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