Bears versus Packers game thread

[Chisoxfn]

How long did it take for it to leak that Benson pulled himself in the SB? How many players were adamantly defending him after the game?

Game, Set, and Match. Well played!

[IlliniKrush]

And you keep believing everything the organization tells you. As if they had a choice to say anything else.

And reporters who aren't part of the organization. And and MRI. You're right, I shouldn't believe players. No one has ever called out a teammate in any sport.

 

I believe facts, and you believe the make up world of what you want to believe.

 

It is what it is.

[fathom]

You don't think there'd be a few people who threw Jay under the bus, at least in the anonymous quote sense, if they thought he really had given up on them?

 

Well, it certainly would be Holmes and ZZ (dumbest reporter anywhere) that would do it. However, it would come out sooner than later. As someone brilliantly put it earlier, Fox was definitely going with the theme of Cutler pouting on the sideline when he wasn't ruled out.

Edited January 25, 2011 by fathom

[IlliniKrush]

Jason Whitlock is trying to take the meatball side vs. B & B....

To say it's been entertaining wouldn't do it justice.

[SoxFan1]

B&B RIPPING Jason Whitlock right now. Whitlock says Cutler should have stayed in the game until he took a sack, and THEN came out.

 

That's just stupid. And he's citing Brett Favre's love for acting.

[fathom]

To say it's been entertaining wouldn't do it justice.

 

Awesome...wasn't he also on the Danny Mac show earlier?

[MexSoxFan#1]

This douche was just trying to rub it in.

 

Link

OAK LAWN, Ill. — A car salesman in suburban Chicago has been fired for refusing to remove a Green Bay Packers tie that he wore to work the day after the Packers beat the Chicago Bears to advance to the Super Bowl.

 

John Stone says he wore the Packers tie to work Monday at Webb Chevrolet in Oak Lawn to honor his late grandmother, who was a big Green Bay fan.

 

The sentimental gesture did not impress his boss, Jerry Roberts.

 

Roberts says the dealership has done promotions involving the Bears and he was afraid the tie could alienate the team's fans and make it harder to sell cars.

 

Roberts adds that Stone was offered five chances to take off the tie but he refused.

Edited January 25, 2011 by MexSoxFan#1

[Chisoxfn]

Well, it certainly would be Holmes and ZZ (dumbest reporter anywhere) that would do it. As someone brilliantly put it earlier, Fox was definitely going with the theme of Cutler pouting on the sideline when he wasn't ruled out.

I don't think it was any Fox conspiracy. They just cut to Cutler at times and didn't have a reporter who followed up on what was going on and in general didn't have very good sideline coverage of his injury, etc. That might have been because there reporters stunk or it might have been because the Bears weren't talking much at the time. I don't know, but I don't think Fox conspired in this.

 

However, there is only so much you can get from a couple shots on the sideline. I just know some he was by himself, others he was with the QB's. The beat writers fill in the rest for me saying he was helping. I also tend to notice that Cutler is usually (historically during Bears games) around Hanie a decent amount.

[iamshack]

Here's the problem: you don't know this. You don't know that they had him on film, almost the entire half, doing nothing. That's just a blind assertion by you. What you know is that for about a total of a minute in the second half (however long they had Jay on camera), he wasn't always sitting with Hanie or going over plays. But sometimes he was talking to Hanie, cheering him on, in those brief snippets we do have. So it kinda blows your whole theory.

 

As far as it being a giant conspiracy, even after the official "Grade II MCL" report came out, you were still questioning the severity of the injury, even though we knew exactly how severe it was, by definition of "Grade II MCL Sprain". You still ask "why was he walking around without braces and ice?" The only implication there that I can see is that you don't believe he really has a Grade II MCL Sprain.

 

The reporters and some in the media (like B&B) have been saying that the Bears should have handled it differently and made the severity of Jay's injury clear as soon as possible to avert all this nonsense and to avoid tarnishing the reputation of their star QB. They're not advocating that the Bears should have lied about his injury, in fact they're doing just the opposite. They're chastising Lovie and Co. for playing their stupid mind games and letting this get out of hand.

Seriously, you and Illini are just being incredibly ridiculous with your burden of proof. It's as if an organization has never misled anyone to protect itself or their players. It's as if players have never refused to throw their teammates under the bus. It's as if reporters have never looked the other way when they knew damn well what the organization was spinning was bs (umm, steroids, people?).

 

I cannot prove to you that Jay did anything other than get injured and ruled out by his coaches and athletic trainers for the remainder of the second half. Nor was it ever my intention to. And yet, it is clearly your intention to try and prove to me everything happened as it has been reported by the Bears. Well I just don't believe their version of events at this time. I am sorry if that offends you. I am sorry if you can't accept that. But it's my opinion and my belief.

[StrangeSox]

I still question what in the living hell were the Bears trainers doing by not putting him on crutches or in a brace? Say the Bears win, wouldn't you want to limit any further damage that could have been done walking on the sideline or shaking hands with the Packers players after the game in order to get him ready for the Super Bowl?

 

If you take that line to the logical conclusion, you've got three possibilities:

 

1) Lovie's dumb mind games

2) Incompetent training staff

3) They're still lying about the injury and he really doesn't have a Grade II MCL Sprain

 

Either way, they're still saying 6-8 weeks before he's healed, so he probably wouldn't be playing in the SB regardless. Again, I'd look for more from ptatc, but maybe the risk of injury while just walking back and forth is low, since there wouldn't be much lateral movement.

[fathom]

I don't think it was any Fox conspiracy. They just cut to Cutler at times and didn't have a reporter who followed up on what was going on and in general didn't have very good sideline coverage of his injury, etc. That might have been because there reporters stunk or it might have been because the Bears weren't talking much at the time. I don't know, but I don't think Fox conspired in this.

 

However, there is only so much you can get from a couple shots on the sideline. I just know some he was by himself, others he was with the QB's. The beat writers fill in the rest for me saying he was helping. I also tend to notice that Cutler is usually (historically during Bears games) around Hanie a decent amount.

 

I didn't say it was a conspiracy by Fox to only show him when he was pouting. I'm saying that Fox was definitely trying to hype up the fact that this was a situation of the star player standing on the sidelines when he's supposed to have a knee injury and showing no emotion or anything.

[iamshack]

How long did it take for it to leak that Benson pulled himself in the SB? How many players were adamantly defending him after the game?

Are you going to compare Cedric Benson's importance to the Bears and Bears fans as that of Jay Cutler?

 

Not even close.

[fathom]

If you take that line to the logical conclusion, you've got three possibilities:

 

1) Lovie's dumb mind games

2) Incompetent training staff

3) They're still lying about the injury and he really doesn't have a Grade II MCL Sprain

 

Either way, they're still saying 6-8 weeks before he's healed, so he probably wouldn't be playing in the SB regardless. Again, I'd look for more from ptatc, but maybe the risk of injury while just walking back and forth is low, since there wouldn't be much lateral movement.

 

He'd be questionable for the SB if they won, according to ESPN last night. As for Lovie's dumb mind games, you can make that argument for the 3rd quarter, but once Hanie came in, we all knew Cutler was done for good. I'm definitely voting for the 2nd scenario there.

[Chisoxfn]

Are you going to compare Cedric Benson's importance to the Bears and Bears fans as that of Jay Cutler?

 

Not even close.

Regardless. He was an unliked player that got chewed out and the Bears teammates didn't try to protect him or cover anything up.

[iamshack]

And reporters who aren't part of the organization. And and MRI. You're right, I shouldn't believe players. No one has ever called out a teammate in any sport.

 

I believe facts, and you believe the make up world of what you want to believe.

 

It is what it is.

Look, I've allowed these passive-aggresive insults to float for a while now because I don't want to fire back and have happen exactly what ss2k was afraid would happen.

 

But honestly, I'm getting tired of them.

 

 

[Chisoxfn]

I didn't say it was a conspiracy by Fox to only show him when he was pouting. I'm saying that Fox was definitely trying to hype up the fact that this was a situation of the star player standing on the sidelines when he's supposed to have a knee injury and showing no emotion or anything.

And I'd say on the sideline throughout his career Cutler has had that exact same expression. It is who he is.

 

Tony Dungy said it best. Talked about how people in Indy used to whine and complain about Marvin Harrison's expressions on the sideline and how he would do his thing. Jay is the same way.

 

Fans can wish he was another way or more rah rah, but he tends to have that same face up or down. On the field he also shows the high's and lows, but by and large, I think part of what he does is he tries to keep his emotions from getting the best of him (possibly due to his diabetes). In fact, I know in the past he talked about how he had to work staying away from those emotional "highs" and "lows" as they can take up a lot of "blood sugar" or whatever it is. This was back in his Denver days when he was first diagnosed.

[IlliniKrush]

Seriously, you and Illini are just being incredibly ridiculous with your burden of proof. It's as if an organization has never misled anyone to protect itself or their players. It's as if players have never refused to throw their teammates under the bus. It's as if reporters have never looked the other way when they knew damn well what the organization was spinning was bs (umm, steroids, people?).

 

I cannot prove to you that Jay did anything other than get injured and ruled out by his coaches and athletic trainers for the remainder of the second half. Nor was it ever my intention to. And yet, it is clearly your intention to try and prove to me everything happened as it has been reported by the Bears. Well I just don't believe their version of events at this time. I am sorry if that offends you. I am sorry if you can't accept that. But it's my opinion and my belief.

The burden of proof IS on you because you are the one with the HUGE conspiracy theory. Everyone is lying, including doctors and MRI results.

 

You think he quit, that's the bottom line. Then the MRI came out, and the media stories and player interviews, and you stuck with it. Props to you.

[iamshack]

Regardless. He was an unliked player that got chewed out and the Bears teammates didn't try to protect him or cover anything up.

So because that is how things happened with Cedric Benson, it must be how things would happen in this instance? I recognize the point that is being made, but this isn't some huge revelation that points out anything other than Cedric Benson did not mean to the Bears what Jay Cutler means to the Bears.

[IlliniKrush]

Are you going to compare Cedric Benson's importance to the Bears and Bears fans as that of Jay Cutler?

 

Not even close.

I'm really unsure what this is supposed to prove.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Regardless. He was an unliked player that got chewed out and the Bears teammates didn't try to protect him or cover anything up.

 

lol. So what? That was f***ing 4 years ago. How many players from that team are still on the current team? And you can't compare Benson to Cutler anyway. Totally different set of circumstances. And for the record, not that my opinion means a damn thing, but my respect for Shack, Sqwert and fathom has f***ing tripled in the last two days. They've been fair, constructive and respectful. The rest of you guys need to take a f***ing valium. Is Cutler paying your bills or something? Now people know what I was talking about when I went off a couple weeks ago.

Edited January 25, 2011 by Jordan4life

[StrangeSox]

Seriously, you and Illini are just being incredibly ridiculous with your burden of proof. It's as if an organization has never misled anyone to protect itself or their players. It's as if players have never refused to throw their teammates under the bus. It's as if reporters have never looked the other way when they knew damn well what the organization was spinning was bs (umm, steroids, people?).

 

I'm just asking for any evidence. All you've got is speculation.

 

Yeah, the Bears are usually evasive and give little to no information. I wouldn't expect team management/coaching to do anything but protect their QB right now. But that doesn't explain the reaction by the players. It doesn't support your claims that he was moping and not doing anything almost the entire second half (partially because there are reports and video of him doing things in the second half). It doesn't explain that he was actually injured in a way that impacts a QB's performance.

 

I cannot prove to you that Jay did anything other than get injured and ruled out by his coaches and athletic trainers for the remainder of the second half. Nor was it ever my intention to. And yet, it is clearly your intention to try and prove to me everything happened as it has been reported by the Bears. Well I just don't believe their version of events at this time. I am sorry if that offends you. I am sorry if you can't accept that. But it's my opinion and my belief.

 

It's my intention to try to figure out what evidence you're basing your opinion on.

 

[iamshack]

The burden of proof IS on you because you are the one with the HUGE conspiracy theory. Everyone is lying, including doctors and MRI results.

 

You think he quit, that's the bottom line. Then the MRI came out, and the media stories and player interviews, and you stuck with it. Props to you.

No, it's not. I am not trying to convince anyone. I have my own opinion of things, and it differs from yours. Get over it.

[Chisoxfn]

So because that is how things happened with Cedric Benson, it must be how things would happen in this instance? I recognize the point that is being made, but this isn't some huge revelation that points out anything other than Cedric Benson did not mean to the Bears what Jay Cutler means to the Bears.

We are just throwing out facts that support our notion. What you suggest involves every player on a team defending a player. That just doesn't happen. Regardless of who that player is and when the player is someone that some posters on here have suggested is not liked in the clubhouse (I personally don't believe that and think by and large he's at the a minimum respected) than it makes me believe even less that it would be possible for everyone to cover it up.

 

[iamshack]

I'm just asking for any evidence. All you've got is speculation.

 

Yeah, the Bears are usually evasive and give little to no information. I wouldn't expect team management/coaching to do anything but protect their QB right now. But that doesn't explain the reaction by the players. It doesn't support your claims that he was moping and not doing anything almost the entire second half (partially because there are reports and video of him doing things in the second half). It doesn't explain that he was actually injured in a way that impacts a QB's performance.

 

 

 

It's my intention to try to figure out what evidence you're basing your opinion on.

And that's most likely all I will ever have, SS. Speculation. But all sorts of things have happened in the sports world and in other well-documented events, that all we can do is speculate about. There is no proof.

 

Why am I not allowed to have this opinion? Why is everyone so hell bent on making me agree with them?

 

Sorry, I see all kinds of reasons for the Bears to take the stance they are taking and it doesn't add-up to me.

 

Edit: And come on, SS...as if I haven't argued my position ad nauseum.

Edited January 25, 2011 by iamshack

[Jordan4life_2007]

We are just throwing out facts that support our notion. What you suggest involves every player on a team defending a player. That just doesn't happen. Regardless of who that player is and when the player is someone that some posters on here have suggested is not liked in the clubhouse (I personally don't believe that and think by and large he's at the a minimum respected) than it makes me believe even less that it would be possible for everyone to cover it up.

 

Benson was a non-proven rookie who reported to camp late and thought he was the s*** before taking a single snap. Not at all a legitimate comparison. He warranted hate from the start.