Sox to go with four man rotation to start the season?

[TheChrisSamsa]

Seems kind of... logical, almost too logical for Ozzie.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2011/...ale-in-pen.html

 

Four-man Sox rotation could mean Sale in pen

February 12, 2011 3:29 PM | 3 Comments | UPDATED STORY

By Mark Gonzales

 

The question of how the White Sox employ prized left-hander Chris Sale could be solved soon, especially with Jake Peavy's uncertainty and the Sox's two days off in the first 14 games of the regular season.

 

Manager Ozzie Guillen told WSCR-670 White Sox Weekly host Chris Rongey that the Sox might use a fifth starter only occasionally early in the season, which could pave the way for Sale to start the season in the bullpen.

"I look at the roster and the games earlier in the season and how we're going to play it, I look at the fifth starter," Guillen said. "We're going to use the fifth starter maybe one or two outings because of the day off and we can bump people, move people in the rotation."

 

The Sox have off days on April 4 and April 14. That could mean that they wouldn't need a fifth starter until April 10 and not again until April 21. In past years, the Sox have stuck with a five-man rotation, only giving Mark Buehrle occasional extra rest when days off permitted that.

 

Using a four-man rotation early with the days off would lessen the need for a fifth starter while preventing Peavy, who is coming off right shoulder surgery, from trying to accelerate his recovery in time to join the bullpen by the start of the regular season.

 

Guillen emphasized he's not playing on Peavy being ready by opening day.

 

"I don't expect him to be out there," said Guillen, aware that Peavy will trying to convince him, general manager Ken Williams and pitching coach Don Cooper that he'll be ready by April 1.

 

"We have a Plan A," Guillen said. "Plan B is going to be with Peavy there on roster as the fifth starter."

 

As for Sale, who originally was thought to be groomed as the fifth starter until Peavy's return, "I think for him, he has to be in the bullpen," said Guillen, who wasn't sure if Sale would handle the closer or set-up duties.

 

Sale, 21, was a starter at Florida Gulf Coast University but impressed Guillen during a two-month stint as a reliever, posting a 1.93 ERA in 21 appearances.

 

"I know he was a starter in college," Guillen said. "But I already saw him in the big leagues last year in the bullpen, and I loved it."

 

Assuming that Sale starts the season in the bullpen even If Peavy isn't ready, the Sox's candidates for the fifth starter's job would be Lucas Harrell, Phil Humber and Jeff Gray.

 

Guillen also mentioned a lineup comprised of Juan Pierre, Gordon Beckham, Alex Rios, Adam Dunn, Paul Konerko, Carlos Quentin, A.J. Pierzynski, Alexei Ramirez and either Brent Morel or Mark Teahen.

[knightni]

I think that it's too risky, honestly.

 

Why build up innings that early?

[BigSqwert]

I think this is the way to go.

[LittleHurt05]

I think that it's too risky, honestly.

 

Why build up innings that early?

 

I concur. You are gonna make someone go on 3 days rest in April? That sounds dumb. It may win you that one game, but could cost you many more come August/September.

[TheChrisSamsa]

I think that it's too risky, honestly.

 

Why build up innings that early?

 

 

Would they really be building up innings, or just using the schedule to their advantage by having Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, and Jackson pitch on normal rest due to the off days?

 

Edit: My bad.. the schedule doesn't line up THAT well.. but they could certainly skip some starts from that 5th spot in the rotation over the first 3 weeks of the season.

Edited February 13, 2011 by ChrisLikesBaseball

[flavum]

Gonzales is wrong about not needing a 5th starter until April 10th. It's actually April 9th.

 

I'd go:

 

4-1 Cle Buehrle

4-2 Cle Jackson

4-3 Cle Danks

4-4

4-5 KC Floyd

4-6 KC Buehrle

4-7 TB Jackson

4-8 TB Danks

4-9 TB 5th starter

4-10 TB Floyd

4-11 Oak Buehrle

4-12 Oak Jackson

4-13 Oak Danks

4-14

4-15 LAA Floyd

4-16 LAA Buehrle

4-17 LAA Jackson

4-18 TB Danks

4-19 TB 5th starter

 

...and so on. At the earliest, I hope Peavy isn't considered to start until April 19th.

Edited February 13, 2011 by flavum

[TheChrisSamsa]

I just pulled out my calendar and was just about to post this exact same rotation. Over the first 17 games, they need a 5th starter twice to keep everyone on 4 days rest. From April 15-May 4, the Sox play 20 straight days, a stretch that would suicide to keep on a 4 man rotation.

 

I'd say ideally Peavy is back for the start on the 19th, and if not that, he can slide in somewhere during that 20 game stretch.

 

Gonzales is wrong about not needing a 5th starter until April 10th. It's actually April 9th.

 

I'd go:

 

4-1 Cle Buehrle

4-2 Cle Jackson

4-3 Cle Danks

4-4

4-5 KC Floyd

4-6 KC Buehrle

4-7 TB Jackson

4-8 TB Danks

4-9 TB 5th starter

4-10 TB Floyd

4-11 Oak Buehrle

4-12 Oak Jackson

4-13 Oak Danks

4-14

4-15 LAA Floyd

4-16 LAA Buehrle

4-17 LAA Jackson

4-18 TB Danks

4-19 TB 5th starter

 

...and so on. At the earliest, I hope Peavy isn't considered to start until April 19th.

Edited February 13, 2011 by ChrisLikesBaseball

[knightni]

Gonzales is wrong about not needing a 5th starter until April 10th. It's actually April 9th.

 

I'd go:

 

4-1 Cle Buehrle

4-2 Cle Jackson

4-3 Cle Danks

4-4

4-5 KC Floyd

4-6 KC Buehrle

4-7 TB Jackson

4-8 TB Danks

4-9 TB 5th starter

4-10 TB Floyd

4-11 Oak Buehrle

4-12 Oak Jackson

4-13 Oak Danks

4-14

4-15 LAA Floyd

4-16 LAA Buehrle

4-17 LAA Jackson

4-18 TB Danks

4-19 TB 5th starter

 

...and so on. At the earliest, I hope Peavy isn't considered to start until April 19th.

 

In essence, you'd have this:

 

4-1 Cle Buehrle

4-2 Cle Jackson

4-3 Cle Danks

4-4

4-5 KC Floyd

4-6 KC Buehrle

4-7 TB Jackson

4-8 TB Danks

4-9 TB Floyd on short rest

4-10 TB Buehrle on short rest

4-11 Oak Jackson on short rest

4-12 Oak Danks on short rest

4-13 Oak Floyd on short rest again

4-14

4-15 LAA Buehrle

4-16 LAA Jackson

4-17 LAA Danks

4-18 TB Floyd

4-19 TB Buehrle on short rest again

 

[flavum]

Short rest in April? Pass.

[knightni]

Use April 9 as a bullpen game. Start Pena and they should be okay.

 

However, I really doubt that Peavy will be truly 100% by April 19.

 

I have a feeling that they are over confident and he will be running at 70% all season.

[flavum]

I don't think Tony Pena is in that 5th starter/spot starter mix. It's much more likely that it's Phil Humber or Lucas Harrell. Don Cooper also mentioned Jeff Gray the other day.

[knightni]

I don't think Tony Pena is in that 5th starter/spot starter mix. It's much more likely that it's Phil Humber or Lucas Harrell. Don Cooper also mentioned Jeff Gray the other day.

He'd be out there for 3 innings.

 

Then bring in the other scrub relievers. They don't want to add another pitcher to the 25 man if they can help it. Not many guys have options left.

[TheChrisSamsa]

In essence, you'd have this:

 

4-1 Cle Buehrle

4-2 Cle Jackson

4-3 Cle Danks

4-4

4-5 KC Floyd

4-6 KC Buehrle

4-7 TB Jackson

4-8 TB Danks

4-9 TB Floyd on short rest

4-10 TB Buehrle on short rest

4-11 Oak Jackson on short rest

4-12 Oak Danks on short rest

4-13 Oak Floyd on short rest again

4-14

4-15 LAA Buehrle

4-16 LAA Jackson

4-17 LAA Danks

4-18 TB Floyd

4-19 TB Buehrle on short rest again

 

I'd rather see them slide a fifth starter in on the 9th to keep everyone on normal rest, and if necessary do a short run of everyone on short rest starting the 19th with Floyd, even though, if I recall correctly, Gavin isn't very good on short rest.

[flavum]

He'd be out there for 3 innings.

 

Then bring in the other scrub relievers. They don't want to add another pitcher to the 25 man if they can help it. Not many guys have options left.

 

I could go for that. Probably will depend on who gets the 7th spot in the pen.

Edited February 13, 2011 by flavum

[knightni]

I'd rather see them slide a fifth starter in on the 9th to keep everyone on normal rest, and if necessary do a short run of everyone on short rest starting the 19th with Floyd, even though, if I recall correctly, Gavin isn't very good on short rest.

By nature, a sinker ball pitcher should be better when he's tired. He relaxes and the ball drops more. However, Gavin has always been a bit of a headcase and very sensitive to change. I think that an early bullpen game would be a better choice over burning another option on a young guy for only one start.

[flavum]

Trust me, there's no way in hell anyone is pitching on short rest in April. Not going to happen.

Edited February 13, 2011 by flavum

[soxrwhite]

I remember when 4 man rotations were the norm. I still don't understand why today's super athlete can't handle it.

[knightni]

I remember when 4 man rotations were the norm. I still don't understand why today's super athlete can't handle it.

Because they aren't used to it.

 

There are pitch/start limits in Little League/Pony/Babe Ruth and 5 man rotations in HS, Legion, and the minors.

 

That would be akin to telling every NFL Offensive Lineman that they need to play defense as well, because people used to do it years ago.

[Rowand44]

Ya, not happening.

[southsider2k5]

Bring along a Harrell or someone to be that swing man until Peavy is ready. Start Sale in the pen and leave him there.

[knightni]

Harrell is a gas can. You're better off giving the bullpen the innings while still allowing the team a chance to actually win.

[Jordan4life_2007]

A 4-man rotation at any point in April is a terrible idea. And it just reinforces how bad our minor league system is that we don't have one capable arm to fill in for even a few starts, let alone for half a season.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Bring along a Harrell or someone to be that swing man until Peavy is ready. Start Sale in the pen and leave him there.

 

You may as well throw me out there. Lucas Harrell couldn't crack the Pirates' rotation. The Sox can't afford to throw games away early, as they've been a perennial subpar second half squad under Ozzie.

[southsider2k5]

You may as well throw me out there. Lucas Harrell couldn't crack the Pirates' rotation. The Sox can't afford to throw games away early, as they've been a perennial subpar second half squad under Ozzie.

 

Your choices pretty much are throw away a few games on a bad AAA pitcher, burn up the pen, or burn up the starters in April. I go with throwing a Marquez/Harrell, or someone like that and wasting just a few games instead off burning up vital pitchers at the start of the season.

[flavum]

Eh, maybe it'll be Chris Sale.

 

If he's stretching himself out in spring training, he can start until Peavy is ready. I think Sale can make the move from starter to bullpen one time during the season. But if he moves from starter to bullpen in April, he's got to stay in the pen the rest of the season. He can't keep bouncing back and forth.