Government Shutdown on the clock thread

[Balta1701]

What? The idea that democrats doin't believe in democratic policy is somethin else.

But they're generally pretty happy to roll over once they lose an election. That's how the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts were passed, that's why 1/3 of the Democrats voted in favor of the Iraq debacle.

[southsider2k5]

Hey Hickory, I know you are in Hoosierstan, any banks near you doing this? I know these guys are based up here, but it might mean other banks in the south would be doing the same thing.

 

http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/ban...d00158b970.html

[cabiness42]

Hey Hickory, I know you are in Hoosierstan, any banks near you doing this? I know these guys are based up here, but it might mean other banks in the south would be doing the same thing.

 

http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/ban...d00158b970.html

 

I haven't seen any of that down here. I know in Indy (where I am this weekend) there are a lot of businesses giving freebies or discounts to Federal employees but I haven't seen anything about banks.

[bmags]

But they're generally pretty happy to roll over once they lose an election. That's how the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts were passed, that's why 1/3 of the Democrats voted in favor of the Iraq debacle.

 

Tax cuts and hawks still have substantial pull in a large portion of the senate. Gutting health care for poor people, however, is a little different.

[StrangeSox]

But they're generally pretty happy to roll over once they lose an election. That's how the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts were passed, that's why 1/3 of the Democrats voted in favor of the Iraq debacle.

Rolling over when they're not a majority party to pass new legislation that the governing majority wants is a bit different than rolling over to undermine your own party's biggest legislative achievement in decades when you still hold the Senate.

[southsider2k5]

I haven't seen any of that down here. I know in Indy (where I am this weekend) there are a lot of businesses giving freebies or discounts to Federal employees but I haven't seen anything about banks.

 

I know you had some issues, so I figured this might help.

 

[mr_genius]

But they're generally pretty happy to roll over once they lose an election. That's how the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts were passed, that's why 1/3 of the Democrats voted in favor of the Iraq debacle.

 

actually a majority of Democrats in the Senate voted for the Iraq war and more than a third in the house did.

[Texsox]

NOTE FROM CHRIS:

 

A group of politically oriented long-haul truckers

planned to utilize their 18-wheelers to swarm

the U.S. capital during a protest all weekend,

completely shutting down the already-clogged Beltway.

The "Ride for the Constitution" gang has a mission:

"To give our domestic enemies such as Barack Obama,

John Kerry, Lindsay Graham and John McCain, etc.

time to comply with the demands of the American people."

 

Some last minute reports say the whole thing was a hoax,

others say it definitely was NOT a hoax, and still

others say a few dozen truckers actually showed up.

 

For the sake of comedy, we're going to say it was real...

 

 

 

The Top 16 Things Overheard During the Trucker Protest

 

"Wait, how is stopping traffic a protest? Isn't that what we do for a living?"

 

"I think that guy whose horn plays Liberace might be a spy."

 

"Obama's a terrorist! McCain's a terrorist! And if you don't meet this list of demands, you can deal with my raging mob of gun-toting buddies!"

 

"I don"t know about you, but I want more money going toward hemorrhoid cream research."

 

And the Number One Thing Overheard During the Trucker Protest...

 

"... and keep your tyrannical government hands off our federally-funded interstates!"

 

 

[Balta1701]

actually a majority of Democrats in the Senate voted for the Iraq war and more than a third in the house did.

In the House, 82 Democrats voted in favor of the Iraq debacle resolution, 126 voted against it.

 

I see you've adopted the definition of a "majority" used by the U.S. Senate.

[mr_genius]

In the House, 82 Democrats voted in favor of the Iraq debacle resolution, 126 voted against it.

 

I see you've adopted the definition of a "majority" used by the U.S. Senate.

 

Democratic Senate votes on Iraq war: 29 yea 21 Nay.

[Soxfest]

Went to Walmart after work saw a big sign on the front door saying people who use snap cards they are not working and sytem is down saw a lot of people complaining. Do not know If it is a glitch or part of Government shutdown.

[mr_genius]

Went to Walmart after work saw a big sign on the front door saying people who use snap cards they are not working and sytem is down saw a lot of people complaining. Do not know If it is a glitch or part of Government shutdown.

 

if it's part of the shutdown, the tea party will see that as a monumental win.

[Texsox]

You both realize how monumentally silly it is to argue about votes that were based on faulty information.

[NorthSideSox72]

So it now appears it will go down something like this...

 

--Senate is putting together a deal, to hit the floor Wednesday, being crafted by people from both parties. Sounds like extending gov't funding and debt ceiling to Jan/Feb period, adding income verification to ObamaCare,

--House is saying they are working on something, but apparently it is just the Republicans, and will include yet more ObamaCare stuff.

--Senate will pass their bill, and send it to the house late Wednesday, with Obama's pre-stamp of approval. It will probably pass with relatively bipartisan support.

--House may not even get a bill done, and if they do, it will be fully GOP-led, with little or no Dem support.

 

This will put the issue squarely in Boehner's lap as we hit the deadline. He'll have a very difficult decision to make, whether or not to buck his own party core.

 

What will he do?

 

[Cknolls]

If they were smart they would come back with a clean 1 year CR. And of course a debt limit raise.

Edited October 15, 2013 by Cknolls

[Soxbadger]

If they were smart we wouldnt be in this predicament.

[Balta1701]

So it now appears it will go down something like this...

 

--Senate is putting together a deal, to hit the floor Wednesday, being crafted by people from both parties. Sounds like extending gov't funding and debt ceiling to Jan/Feb period, adding income verification to ObamaCare,

--House is saying they are working on something, but apparently it is just the Republicans, and will include yet more ObamaCare stuff.

--Senate will pass their bill, and send it to the house late Wednesday, with Obama's pre-stamp of approval. It will probably pass with relatively bipartisan support.

--House may not even get a bill done, and if they do, it will be fully GOP-led, with little or no Dem support.

 

This will put the issue squarely in Boehner's lap as we hit the deadline. He'll have a very difficult decision to make, whether or not to buck his own party core.

 

What will he do?

It's worth noting that since a bill isn't already on the floor, if Ted Cruz or another senator wants to single-handedly delay the Senate acting on a bill for several days until after the debt limit deadline is breached, he can do so at this point. There are multiple steps where he can request 30 hours of debate; bringing the bill to the floor, actually acting on the bill, and a third I can't remember right now. Those delays can easily push past the Oct. 17th reported deadline for the Senate to take its initial vote on any bill.

[StrangeSox]

If they were smart we wouldnt be in this predicament.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

It's worth noting that since a bill isn't already on the floor, if Ted Cruz or another senator wants to single-handedly delay the Senate acting on a bill for several days until after the debt limit deadline is breached, he can do so at this point. There are multiple steps where he can request 30 hours of debate; bringing the bill to the floor, actually acting on the bill, and a third I can't remember right now. Those delays can easily push past the Oct. 17th reported deadline for the Senate to take its initial vote on any bill.

True. Then that senator would wholly own the consequences in the media. Cruz might like that, though it essentially destroys any chance the GOP has of taking the Senate in 2014, and may even lose them the house.

 

[StrangeSox]

True. Then that senator would wholly own the consequences in the media. Cruz might like that, though it essentially destroys any chance the GOP has of taking the Senate in 2014, and may even lose them the house.

Cruz's voters and his campaign coffers would love it. Cruz doesn't particularly seem to care what the rest of the GOP thinks, either.

 

edit: It sort of highlights a fatal flaw in our particular system that a single person or the minority party in one house of Congress* could inflict this much damage against the wishes of a majority of Congress and any rational person.

 

*The GOP doesn't actually want to block the debt ceiling increase with a filibuster, but they very easily could.

Edited October 15, 2013 by StrangeSox

[Balta1701]

Cruz's voters and his campaign coffers would love it. Cruz doesn't particularly seem to care what the rest of the GOP thinks, either.

It's also possible that some Senators could want to avoid having the decision time come in the House out of concern that the House leadership will give up the fight and would consider using those delaying tactics to prevent the House from taking up the Senate's measure until after the deadline as well.

[Soxbadger]

Cruz's voters and his campaign coffers would love it. Cruz doesn't particularly seem to care what the rest of the GOP thinks, either.

 

Doubtful. Large donors are going to go berserk if this impacts stock prices on wall street. Ive been told 4 weeks of shutdown was what major institutions were willing to accept, before they start to sell.

 

Republicans and Democrats both answer to the same master. Multinational corporations arent going to forgive a Senator who cost them billions of dollars over political idealism.

Edited October 15, 2013 by Soxbadger

[Balta1701]

So it now appears it will go down something like this...

 

--Senate is putting together a deal, to hit the floor Wednesday, being crafted by people from both parties. Sounds like extending gov't funding and debt ceiling to Jan/Feb period, adding income verification to ObamaCare,

--House is saying they are working on something, but apparently it is just the Republicans, and will include yet more ObamaCare stuff.

--Senate will pass their bill, and send it to the house late Wednesday, with Obama's pre-stamp of approval. It will probably pass with relatively bipartisan support.

--House may not even get a bill done, and if they do, it will be fully GOP-led, with little or no Dem support.

 

This will put the issue squarely in Boehner's lap as we hit the deadline. He'll have a very difficult decision to make, whether or not to buck his own party core.

 

What will he do?

The House Republican leadership are now talking about passing their bill and then leaving town to prevent the House from even considering any legislation that will/could possibly pass the Senate.

[StrangeSox]

I don't want to live on this planet any more.

[cabiness42]

The House Republican leadership are now talking about passing their bill and then leaving town to prevent the House from even considering any legislation that will/could possibly pass the Senate.

 

Isn't a quorum 50%? If so, the 20 most moderate Republicans could say they'll go along with that, then sneak back and join the Democrats to pass something while they're gone.