You are KW/JR. You have the power

[YonderLaroche]

No one on this board, no one in the press, no one in baseball thought this team, as constructed, would be this horrible. So how the hell can anyone fault KW for not knowing it was bad?

 

What I see each game is a lack of preparedness, a lack of intensity, a lack of fundamentals, and a lack of confidence. None of these have anything, whatsoever, to do with the GM.

 

This team's been doing the same $hit since 2006 when they choked. 2007 was a disaster, 2008 was garbage til June then they got lucky and into playoffs (Undeserved as much as I enjoyed the blackout game and Twin playoff games, Twins were better that year), 2009, 2010 were CHOKES. This team lacks leadership, drive, and pure talent. They can't beat the Twins because of they get weak and scared by them. If Paul Konerko is team captain and AJ is a problem, why resign these guys. What they did in the past made history, but its time to move on. We got headcases in Konerko, AJ, Rios, Quentin, Ozzie, Walker who go through more mental ups and downs than a pregnant woman. You can now add Beckham, Dunn, Ramirez, Pierre, Thorton, Sale to that list because they're doing the same $hit now.

[Milkman delivers]

No one on this board, no one in the press, no one in baseball thought this team, as constructed, would be this horrible. So how the hell can anyone fault KW for not knowing it was bad?

 

What I see each game is a lack of preparedness, a lack of intensity, a lack of fundamentals, and a lack of confidence. None of these have anything, whatsoever, to do with the GM.

 

Because it is a cumulative issue. It isn't about just this season. KW has been in charge for a long time and it's been almost all disappointment.

 

And it's great that people thought it'd be a good team. People have thought that he's put together good teams a few times, and his teams have failed much more often than they've succeeded.

 

It's time to cut this snake's head off and just keep working your way down.

[caulfield12]

No one on this board, no one in the press, no one in baseball thought this team, as constructed, would be this horrible. So how the hell can anyone fault KW for not knowing it was bad?

 

What I see each game is a lack of preparedness, a lack of intensity, a lack of fundamentals, and a lack of confidence. None of these have anything, whatsoever, to do with the GM.

 

 

They play that way because the young players that are brought up aren't prepared well enough. KW hired Bell, so he's accountable for the bottom line.

 

They play that way because KW mixes in 6-10 different players per year from every organization in baseball (because our minor league system sucks). There's no cohesion, there's not a discernible "Sox Way" or identity of what our strategy is, there's no developing together in the minor leagues for 4+ seasons together and then another 6 seasons together at the major league level, so the players don't have trust and confidence in each other....a perfect example was sticking Teahen at 3B next to Ramirez last year.

 

Because our minor league system sucked/sucks, he wasn't able to make the moves he needed at midseason last year.

 

Acquiring Manny Ramirez and wasting what would be a huge bonus for a first round draft pick???

Edited May 4, 2011 by caulfield12

[jenksycat]

What do you suggest they do (sincere question)?

 

My point is I don't know either....but what I don't/won't do is give myself an ulcer worrying about who in the front office we're going to fire when really, theres not a whole hell of a lot more they could do.

 

As someone else said above, on paper this team should be solid. I don't see how you can blame the FO for literally a historic underachievment by proven players.

[jenksycat]

Jenksy attacking fellow posters instead of the vastly underachieving team. That's new

 

Milkman being a douche, thats new.

 

I'm fine with attacking the players, its 100% on them. Having a panic attack over how we should fire everyone involved with the organization is comical to me.

[Balta1701]

Milkman being a douche, thats new.

Seriously? Don't you know better than this?

[RockRaines]

My point is I don't know either....but what I don't/won't do is give myself an ulcer worrying about who in the front office we're going to fire when really, theres not a whole hell of a lot more they could do.

 

As someone else said above, on paper this team should be solid. I don't see how you can blame the FO for literally a historic underachievment by proven players.

Leadership has to lead, from the FO on down. KW hasnt had the f***ing balls to do something about a team that chronically underachieves every year but one. The entire organization lacks direction IMO, and it all starts at the top, KW.

[Milkman delivers]

Milkman being a douche, thats new.

 

I'm fine with attacking the players, its 100% on them. Having a panic attack over how we should fire everyone involved with the organization is comical to me.

 

Personal attack after mocking the entire board.

 

Just saying!

[jenksycat]

Personal attack after mocking the entire board.

 

Just saying!

 

You win the internet, collect your prize at the ticket office.

[G&T]

Leadership has to lead, from the FO on down. KW hasnt had the f***ing balls to do something about a team that chronically underachieves every year but one. The entire organization lacks direction IMO, and it all starts at the top, KW.

 

That's on Reinsdorf to some extent. After last year's feud and family nonsense someone had to go and Reinsdorf just is not interested in making tough decisions anymore.

[RockRaines]

That's on Reinsdorf to some extent. After last year's feud and family nonsense someone had to go and Reinsdorf just is not interested in making tough decisions anymore.

Of course it is, however I think of him as some old figurehead on the board at this point

[Milkman delivers]

You win the internet, collect your prize at the ticket office.

 

You can say whatever you like. That's fine. But you mocked the entire board and then you provided a personal attack when called out on it.

 

I believe that's worthy of a suspension, but that's not my call.

[mmmmmbeeer]

I can respect the view that this has been a debacle since '06....but I see firing Guillen and KW both as throwing the baby out with the bath water. Nearly every year it's been a matter of performance...outside of last year, when have we gone into a season as an underdog? We're consistently picked to finish 1st or 2nd in the division at the beginning of each season. The rosters are there, the performance isn't. By all means, fire KW, but atleast see how another manager does with these "good on paper" rosters before doing so.

[G&T]

I can respect the view that this has been a debacle since '06....but I see firing Guillen and KW both as throwing the baby out with the bath water. Nearly every year it's been a matter of performance...outside of last year, when have we gone into a season as an underdog? We're consistently picked to finish 1st or 2nd in the division at the beginning of each season. The rosters are there, the performance isn't. By all means, fire KW, but atleast see how another manager does with these "good on paper" rosters before doing so.

 

I have come to the conclusion, rightly or wrongly, that performance problems stem from lack of accountability. It's not like anyone wants to fail, but when it doesn't really matter whether the manager's kids act like idiots, and the GM and manager are fighting, and you have year after year of failure and nothing happens to anyone, then it is just easy to stop pushing.

 

I just don't think it coincidence that Ozzie's best seasons were in his first 3 years.

 

I don't know why I quoted you. I actually think KW should get another chance with a new manager.

Edited May 4, 2011 by G&T

[Marty34]

I think Kenny going would potentially be a bigger positive for the organization - depending on who replaces him - (Hahn gets a pass in this mess by all, but he's the contract guru) than Ozzie being let go. Anyway fire them both if need be.

[jenksycat]

Leadership has to lead, from the FO on down. KW hasnt had the f***ing balls to do something about a team that chronically underachieves every year but one. The entire organization lacks direction IMO, and it all starts at the top, KW.

 

I get that, but what else could he have done?

 

Huge DH hole -> filled, massive underacheiver nobody would have predicted.

 

Bullpen holes -> filled closer with an All-star reliever, a solid rookie from previous year, and another guy coming off a good year within the same division, and dumps 2 guys who were done.

 

Ideally has Peavy coming back healthy to join a rotation with 4 other guys who should have been solid.

 

The only big risk I saw KW take going into the year was Morel and maybe AJ. No way on earth you can predict your entire team will have a historically underachieving start to the season after just winning 88 games with the identical team + massive upgrades at DH and (at the start of the year) Peavy

 

 

[Milkman delivers]

I have come to the conclusion, rightly or wrongly, that performance problems stem from lack of accountability. It's not like anyone wants to fail, but when it doesn't really matter whether the manager's kids act like idiots, and the GM and manager are fighting, and you have year after year of failure and nothing happens to anyone, then it is just easy to stop pushing.

 

I just don't think it coincidence that Ozzie's best seasons were in his first 3 years.

 

I don't know why I quoted you. I actually think KW should get another chance with a new manager.

 

The team has certainly been in a malaise for quite some time.

[StrangeSox]

no one man should have all that power

[Paint it Black]

Having a panic attack over how we should fire everyone involved with the organization is comical to me.

 

Quoted for truth.

[greg775]

Fire both now.

 

This is big boy land, the major leagues.

Both have single-handedly cost the Sox zillions of dollars in revenue the rest of the year.

It's tough to be out of the race after five weeks. The Sox have accomplished that.

 

Kenny and Ozzie should both be shown the door today.

Who cares at this point if Ozzie goes on to win many WS titles with another team (which he'll do). It's hexed up right now in Chicago.

 

I think Ozzie will have success somewhere else; Kenny I think is done. He'll be a scout like Jerry Krause.

[hogan873]

Fire both now.

 

This is big boy land, the major leagues.

Both have single-handedly cost the Sox zillions of dollars in revenue the rest of the year.

It's tough to be out of the race after five weeks. The Sox have accomplished that.

 

Kenny and Ozzie should both be shown the door today.

Who cares at this point if Ozzie goes on to win many WS titles with another team (which he'll do). It's hexed up right now in Chicago.

 

I think Ozzie will have success somewhere else; Kenny I think is done. He'll be a scout like Jerry Krause.

I doubt that. He's not a great manager. As far as firing someone, I'm calling for heads to roll, too, but they haven't single handedly cost the Sox "zillions" of dollars. The players are not performing. Ozzie and Walker and KW and whoever else aren't helping, but these are grown men. They can hit the ball...they've done it before. Somehow they are just sucking all at the same time.

 

I'm a proponent of Ozzie getting fired because it seems like he's totally uninvolved anymore. Will it do any good to fire him? Who knows. But I'm tired of seeing him standing on the dugout steps with a Gatorade towel wrapper around his neck watching this $128 million team fail over and over again.

[greg775]

Milkman being a douche, thats new.

 

I'm fine with attacking the players, its 100% on them. Having a panic attack over how we should fire everyone involved with the organization is comical to me.

 

Nobody's having an attack. We just think the fact KW and Ozzie's team already is out of the race is grounds for firing.

We've played our last meaningful game of the entire season and it's may 5.

That's difficult to do.

 

Think about it. This team is off the radar until spring training 2012.

Amazing.

 

I mean if that's not a fireable offense?? If you are not going to fire Oz, KW, Walker, etc., then you at least have to start dropping bodies.

I'd start with Pierre, Morel. AJ will fret, but he probably should be the backup catcher now.

 

Once again, by the time Peavy hits the ML club we're out of it. Amazing. If he has a couple good outings, see if you can trade him to the Yankees or Red Sox. Trade Mark and Paulie as well.

These trades will be vital for the future of the team. If they are rotten trades, we will be done for a long time.

Edited May 5, 2011 by greg775

[hogan873]

Nobody's having an attack. We just think the fact KW and Ozzie's team already is out of the race is grounds for firing.

We've played our last meaningful game of the entire season and it's may 5.

That's difficult to do.

 

Think about it. This team is off the radar until spring training 2012.

Amazing.

I try to remain positive, and for some reason I still watch the games. However, I'm starting to think that watching a Kids Can Play II team would be much more enjoyable than watching what's going on now.

[greg775]

I try to remain positive, and for some reason I still watch the games. However, I'm starting to think that watching a Kids Can Play II team would be much more enjoyable than watching what's going on now.

 

I watched the end of today's game while remaining positive.

I just was amazed (again) at the awful at bats in the ninth.

Their closer looked like horses***. We're at home, a supposedly desperate team and we can't at least TIE the game?

 

I hate to be a negative nancy this season, but god, how much can a sane person take?? It's driving me crazy watching it.

I'd rather see a guest fan come to bat with the game on the line than Juan Pierre and Omar.

[hogan873]

Nobody's having an attack. We just think the fact KW and Ozzie's team already is out of the race is grounds for firing.

We've played our last meaningful game of the entire season and it's may 5.

That's difficult to do.

 

Think about it. This team is off the radar until spring training 2012.

Amazing.

 

I mean if that's not a fireable offense?? If you are not going to fire Oz, KW, Walker, etc., then you at least have to start dropping bodies.

I'd start with Pierre, Morel. AJ will fret, but he probably should be the backup catcher now.

 

Once again, by the time Peavy hits the ML club we're out of it. Amazing. If he has a couple good outings, see if you can trade him to the Yankees or Red Sox. Trade Mark and Paulie as well.

These trades will be vital for the future of the team. If they are rotten trades, we will be done for a long time.

Sorry to keep replying off you, but I like a good discussion. I agree that Morel has to get on a plane bound for NC. Pierre I'm not sure about. To whom could be dump him and for what? Buehrle and Paulie aren't going anywhere. If Peavy comes back and pitches well, he will still be hard to move unless the Sox eat a lot of money. I could see Jackson being traded, easily. AJ...again, who would want him? I like Castro, and I think he's under-utilized. I'd like to see him behind the plate more often.

 

I think we're stuck with a lot of what we have. Anyone who is traded will most likely result in the Sox having to pay a chunk of their salaries.