6 man rotation

[Lemon_44]

Why are the Sox going to do away with the 6 man rotation at the beginning of June? Are the starters complaining about it? The results have been very good. The only bad start that comes to mind was Peavy's last start and that was rain shortened to say it was all that bad. We have 6 SP's throwing the ball well, why change it? How can you legitimately put Humber in the pen when he's been the best SP so far? Maybe the pitchers are worried about number of starts which would affect number of wins, IP's and so on, thus, in theory, could lower their contract demands/negotiation. I'm an Ozzie fan but I think he's making a mistake by changing up something that's working pretty well. If the SP's start faltering you can always make the change then.

[lasttriptotulsa]

Sox have only had one off day since the return of Jake Peavy. Combining that with the fact that they did not know what they would get from Peavy was the reason they stuck with the 6 man. In June they have 4 off days and don't play more than 9 games in a row without one. If they stuck to the 6 man, they would each have 6 or 7 days off between starts which is a pretty long lay-off.

 

I don't believe that the reason for the starters recent success is because of the 6 man. Each one of them are a proven quality starter (other then Humber til this year) and long layoffs between starts could do as much harm as it could do good, especially when your pitching well. I hate to see Humber go to the pen, but I'm sure he will be called on a couple more times this year to start (double headers, long runs without off days, etc..) I would not be the least bit surprised to see them let Jackson walk after the season and plant Humber in the 5th starter spot in 2012.

 

Humber in the pen also gives a quality arm to eat up innings when a starter struggles. No longer would we have to stick Pena out there to serve up BP. Out of the pen, I could see Humber being this years D.J. Carrasco. Eat up a ton of innings with a mid to upper 3's E.R.A.

Edited May 27, 2011 by lasttriptotulsa

[Balta1701]

Putting Phil Humber in the bullpen because he's not paid enough is ****ing baseball suicide.

[Lemon_44]

I see your point but why have Humber eating innings in a likely blowout when he's starting and giving the Sox a chance to win every time out? Long relief is a perfect role for Pena. When he comes in the game is likely decided one way or the other. I just think it's wasting your best pitcher, so far, by putting him in a lousy role like long relief. I know the off days are a problem, but...... I guess it's a good thing having 6 guys pitching well. I don't know what the "right" decision is but I'd stick with what's working.

Edited May 27, 2011 by Lemon_44

[Swingandalongonetoleft]

Danks and Vazquez are the candidates. I was a big fan of the Hudson/Vazquez deal, but the guy can't be relied upon. Throw his ass in the pen.

 

*edit*

 

I've kept

Edited May 27, 2011 by Swingandalongonetoleft

[iamshack]

Putting Phil Humber in the bullpen because he's not paid enough is ****ing baseball suicide.

Are we actually hearing this, or are you guys just speculating?

 

 

[bigruss]

Are we actually hearing this, or are you guys just speculating?

My guess is based off of past decisions, it's educated speculation.

[maggsmaggs]

Are we actually hearing this, or are you guys just speculating?

 

Phil Humber has the lowest ERA (2.85) among White Sox starters. But it’s possible he’ll go to the bullpen when the Sox shelve the six-man rotation. A decision could come in the next few days.

 

Who goes won’t be a “worst of the bunch” scenario.

 

“We have to know if this guy can pitch out of the bullpen, how long it will take to get loose,’’ manager Ozzie Guillen said. “There are so many things to go over with [pitching coach Don Cooper] to see about who is the best guy to go there. If Humber has to go there, that’s the way it is. We talk about a few players.’’

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/wh...own-in-pen.html

 

Kill me now. Yeah, let's put our best starter in the pen that will help this club win more games. So so so stupid. I don't care he isn't yet established, but moving him while he is going strong is just dumb. If he goes out and gets bombed the next two starts, that would be more acceptable, but for Ozzie to talk about this s*** now just shows what a moron he is.

 

Is it possible for our idiot manager to just say nothing and say we'll cross that bridge when we get to it? And on a sidenote, how many more starts did Juan Pierre buy himself with a lucky ass game-winning single?

Edited May 27, 2011 by maggsmaggs

[iamshack]

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/wh...own-in-pen.html

 

Kill me now. Yeah, let's put our best starter in the pen that will help this club win more games. So so so stupid. I don't care he isn't yet established, but moving him while he is going strong is just dumb. If he goes out and gets bombed the next two starts, that would be more acceptable, but for Ozzie to talk about this s*** now just shows what a moron he is.

 

Is it possible for our idiot manager to just say nothing and say we'll cross that bridge when we get to it? And on a sidenote, how many more starts did Juan Pierre buy himself with a lucky ass game-winning single?

Wow. The only possible justification I can see for this is that they put Humber in the pen and audition Danks/Jackson/Mark for possible suitors. I don't know why you can't just stick with the 6 man rotation otherwise.

[BigSqwert]

Management of this organization is brain dead.

[southsider2k5]

Do people really think that Phil Humber will finish the season with better numbers than the rest of the starting 5? f***, I thought I was the anointed homer.

[BigSqwert]

Do people really think that Phil Humber will finish the season with better numbers than the rest of the starting 5? f***, I thought I was the anointed homer.

The guy is on fire. Why fix something that's not broken? It's not like he's been all smoke and mirrors and every out he gets is a hard hit line drive.

[iamshack]

Do people really think that Phil Humber will finish the season with better numbers than the rest of the starting 5? f***, I thought I was the anointed homer.

Did you think Jose Bautista was going to turn into the best hitter in baseball last year? Should the Blue Jays have benched him?

 

Humber, while he has not had a good MLB career, does have a plus curve, and he was a first round draft pick. He's not doing this with smoke and mirrors. You don't put him in the pen simply because he doesn't have the track record.

[southsider2k5]

Did you think Jose Bautista was going to turn into the best hitter in baseball last year? Should the Blue Jays have benched him?

 

Humber, while he has not had a good MLB career, does have a plus curve, and he was a first round draft pick. He's not doing this with smoke and mirrors. You don't put him in the pen simply because he doesn't have the track record.

 

I'm going with history here. Humber hasn't had a stretch anywhere like this since 2006, when he was at A+ and AA. If I am going to bet on performance, I am guessing that 99 times out of a 100, the guys with a history are going to outdo the guys who have never done anything remotely close to this before. For every Jose Batista out there, there are a ton of Chris Sheltons littering the landscape. Believe me, I was about the only one on this entire website who said that Humber could be serviceable this year, but expecting to outperform the starting 5 this year? Crazy.

[southsider2k5]

The guy is on fire. Why fix something that's not broken? It's not like he's been all smoke and mirrors and every out he gets is a hard hit line drive.

 

He has a WHIP under 1.0, a H/9 of 6.4 and a K/9 of 5.2. Those are not sustainable numbers for Phil Humber.

[iamshack]

I'm going with history here. Humber hasn't had a stretch anywhere like this since 2006, when he was at A+ and AA. If I am going to bet on performance, I am guessing that 99 times out of a 100, the guys with a history are going to outdo the guys who have never done anything remotely close to this before. For every Jose Batista out there, there are a ton of Chris Sheltons littering the landscape. Believe me, I was about the only one on this entire website who said that Humber could be serviceable this year, but expecting to outperform the starting 5 this year? Crazy.

We're 1/3 of the way through the season and it's not even really close! When you compare the upside of putting him in the pen versus the risk, it's not even a decision.

 

We've seen Cooper dramatically change the careers of many pitchers that have come through here, whether it was Esteban Loaiza, Matt Thornton, Jose Contreras, or Gavin Floyd. Why the hell would you start questioning this now? What if we would have put Gavin in the bullpen in 2008 after 10 starts?

 

This is pure lunacy...

[SoxAce]

Wow... Mike is owning in this thread.

[BigSqwert]

We're 1/3 of the way through the season and it's not even really close! When you compare the upside of putting him in the pen versus the risk, it's not even a decision.

 

We've seen Cooper dramatically change the careers of many pitchers that have come through here, whether it was Esteban Loaiza, Matt Thornton, Jose Contreras, or Gavin Floyd. Why the hell would you start questioning this now? What if we would have put Gavin in the bullpen in 2008 after 10 starts?

 

This is pure lunacy...

Thank you.

[elrockinMT]

Putting Phil Humber in the bullpen because he's not paid enough is ****ing baseball suicide.

 

 

I can see the move back to a 5 man rotation, but the one I see as being an inconsistent performer is Jackson not Humber. Maybe jackson with his abiity to strike people out would work better as the long relief man and spot starter until he can get back to being a consistent performer

[flavum]

There's no way Humber comes out of the rotation right now. That can't happen.

 

Why not see what happens with Buehrle tonight? If he has a rough one, maybe you skip him next time, and keep everyone else on 5 days rest. If not, Jackson has to be the guy to go to the bullpen.

 

 

[southsider2k5]

We're 1/3 of the way through the season and it's not even really close! When you compare the upside of putting him in the pen versus the risk, it's not even a decision.

 

We've seen Cooper dramatically change the careers of many pitchers that have come through here, whether it was Esteban Loaiza, Matt Thornton, Jose Contreras, or Gavin Floyd. Why the hell would you start questioning this now? What if we would have put Gavin in the bullpen in 2008 after 10 starts?

 

This is pure lunacy...

 

Which was the entire basis of my thinking that Humber could be decent this year. But expecting him to be Cy Young? No that would be lunacy.

 

[iamshack]

He has a WHIP under 1.0, a H/9 of 6.4 and a K/9 of 5.2. Those are not sustainable numbers for Phil Humber.

Maybe not that low, but there is absolutely nothing that says there is a huge correction coming, other than his past history, which honestly shouldn't concern any of us. His issue was never whether he had a good arm or good stuff.

[southsider2k5]

Maybe not that low, but there is absolutely nothing that says there is a huge correction coming, other than his past history, which honestly shouldn't concern any of us. His issue was never whether he had a good arm or good stuff.

 

So other than his history and his unsustainable numbers, there is nothing to say he will regress. Ok. I probably should be done here.

[iamshack]

Which was the entire basis of my thinking that Humber could be decent this year. But expecting him to be Cy Young? No that would be lunacy.

Cy Young? No one is expecting him to be Cy Young...so your argument is essentially if he isn't AS good as he has been through 9 starts, he should be put in the bullpen? Even if he comes back down to earth a bit, and his FIP doesn't really suggest that he is doing this with smoke and mirrors, he is still far more deserving of a spot in this rotation.

 

I don't really understand your argument here whatsoever.

[maggsmaggs]

Did you think Jose Bautista was going to turn into the best hitter in baseball last year? Should the Blue Jays have benched him?

 

Humber, while he has not had a good MLB career, does have a plus curve, and he was a first round draft pick. He's not doing this with smoke and mirrors. You don't put him in the pen simply because he doesn't have the track record.

 

He was third overall to boot.

 

I'm going with history here. Humber hasn't had a stretch anywhere like this since 2006, when he was at A+ and AA. If I am going to bet on performance, I am guessing that 99 times out of a 100, the guys with a history are going to outdo the guys who have never done anything remotely close to this before. For every Jose Batista out there, there are a ton of Chris Sheltons littering the landscape. Believe me, I was about the only one on this entire website who said that Humber could be serviceable this year, but expecting to outperform the starting 5 this year? Crazy.

 

Yes, I think he will finish with better numbers than Edwin Jackson. Chris Shelton had one hot month in April as a former 33rd-round draft pick. Humber has now been going strong for two straight months as a former top-five MLB pick. He clearly has talent otherwise he wouldn't have been taken that high. And he was picked by the Mets who don't have any issues with signability, so he was worthy of being picked that high. He has six straight quality starts and has two road starts against top six offenses in the MLB during that stretch where has given up one run in 14.2 innings. You're kidding yourself if you think he is doing with smoke and mirrors. If he does regress in the next couple starts badly, then maybe you can move him to the pen. But you can't do it when he is on fire. Who knows maybe we found another Esteban Loaiza or maybe a top-three MLB pick is finally realizing his potential under one of the best pitching coaches in baseball?

Edited May 27, 2011 by maggsmaggs