Cowley vs SoxTalk

[justBLAZE]

Juan Pierre had game today, no doubt about it. Cowley starts talking s*** after Juan has a great day which makes him a hypocrite.

But at this point, even in the winner thread some posters seem to think there is no way Viciedo will replace Pierre at LF.

 

Still want to bench Pierre for Viciedo? Kenny baseball does. Meanwhile, Dunn down to .171. Pierre .262.

 

here's a spot for Viciedo - it just comes at the expense of $12 million this year, $14 mill next year and then $15 mill back-to-back.

 

Ozzie is by far the best manager I ever had, and I think is one of the best in the game. He is the White Sox.'' -- A. Rowand.

 

No question Pierre has been awful most of this year, but awful in a sea of bad. And if not Pierre, who leads off? Give me names.

 

History lesson: At the end of '04, Oz told KW get me a leadoff hitter and get rid of C. Lee and base cloggers. KW did and got a ring.

 

Now, KW wants to go back to his caveman way of thinking and the result is?

 

The formula was speed at the top - pitching and defense. It worked. Yet, the GM wants to now make the wheel square again.

 

The '05 offense was deadly and would fight you for 9 innings, but KW got rid of a grinder for what he thought was more offense.

 

He should have addressed the pitching before '06 if he wanted to make changes because that's what failed in the second half.

 

It's obvious there are a lot of dumb Sox fans out there that deserve to have Bevington back at manager.

 

You people followed garbage for 88 years, and now you act like Yankee fan? Please.

 

Keep sipping the company Kool-aid that KW is feeding you beause he was so successful before 2005 as a GM.

 

What have we learned today? Genius Sox fans want De Aza, Vizquel, Lillibridge and Viciedo to leadoff. .... [from responses on twitter]

 

..KW is a genius. Oz sucks because he is sticking with Pierre. And the 2005 teams won it all on power and pitching. Stay hot Sox fans!

 

Going to spend time with the family. You guys can go and lick your Bevington posters. I thought this was the smarter fan base ... my bad.

 

Thoughts?

[witesoxfan]

The 05 offense was deadly huh? What in the hell is the difference between this offense and that offense? Not enough grindiness? Sorry, we'll bring in Pretty Ricky and he can grind on you then.

[iamshack]

What a fool.

[justBLAZE]

Memo to Ken Williams: You still are the general manager of the White Sox.

 

It says it right here on Page 8 of the team’s media guide: “Senior Vice President/General Manager.’’ It has your name in all caps, and there’s even a picture of you ­smiling. Maybe the most recent picture caught of you smiling, but definitely smiling.

 

Last time I checked, it’s not a part-time job, either.

 

You can’t play GM when it comes to claiming the hefty contract of Alex Rios off waivers, then all of a sudden not have the intestinal fortitude to tell Jim Thome that he’s done with the Sox.

 

You can’t flex your GM muscles in persuading board chairman Jerry Reinsdorf to sign Adam Dunn for four years and $56 million in free agency, then run around town the last two weeks crying that Dayan Viciedo would be on the ­roster if only the big, bad coaching staff would allow you to play savior and bring up the rookie from Charlotte.

 

“Ozzie [Guillen] is not ready to change the mix he has right now, and that has to be respected,’’ Williams said recently in his usual Morpheus tone, describing the ­apparent roadblock in adding Viciedo to the mix.

 

What?

 

So Williams is responsible for a franchise-record $127 million payroll, but he’s bowing down to Guillen on minor-league call-ups? Are there any clear-thinking people out there who actually believe that to be true?

 

I’ll hand it to “Hollywood’’ Williams. I thought his acting on the MLB Network reality show “The Club’’ last summer was a bit dramatic at times, but this year’s ­sequel? Wow. David Hasselhoff thinks Williams is over the top in his latest role as woe-is-me-GM, held prisoner by the Venezuelan tyrant named Ozzie.

 

Second verse same as the first

 

Brass tacks time: This latest song and dance is as transparent as the one that took place last season. Different year, same cold war with Guillen.

 

Those three or four classes Williams took at Stanford before leaving to chase his major-league dream must have made him real smart because now he’s a lot more calculated.

 

The days of running to Reinsdorf for Guillen’s head and expressing his anger publicly are over. The new tactic of pretending all is well with Guillen is saying that it’s Guillen’s stubbornness with the roster that’s killing the team. Brilliant!

 

Williams is playing magician, using the distraction of a Viciedo-for-Juan Pierre swap to steer attention from the 500-pound slumping gorilla in the room named Dunn.

 

The same Dunn who Williams thought would solve all the offensive woes but is the main suspect in the hitless-and-run crime spree overtaking the South Side.

 

I’m sure the clubhouse would love the news that a popular player such as Pierre is out of a job, despite other guys being in bigger holes than the leadoff hitter.

 

Look, Williams is a swing-from-the-hip GM. His strength is also his weakness, and there have been a lot more misses than hits lately.

 

With advice from Guillen, Williams had a formula in 2005 and built a World Series winner, but since then the GM has lost that identity. Each year it’s a new theme for Williams. In 2006, it was out with the grinders, headlined by Thome replacing Aaron Rowand. Looking back, maybe that was a bigger mistake than realized.

 

Rowand, Carl “The Truthosaurus’’ Everett and Orlando “El Duque’’ Hernandez were foxhole guys. Some had to be replaced, but they should have been replaced with grinders.

 

Excuses are wearing thin

 

“That mentality of leaving it all out there every day over the course of 162 games, that wins you games,” Rowand, now with the San Francisco Giants, said Thursday. “That mentality of never quitting, even when you’re down late in games … I mean, we had a lot of comeback victories [in ’05].’’

 

In ’07, Williams went with the hard-throwing-bullpen theme. Disaster. In ’08, it was the on-base-percentage guys such as Nick Swisher and Orlando Cabrera. Now? Heck, I don’t know what they are, and they play like they don’t know what they are.

 

But at least in the past, Williams would own up to his mistakes. The last two years, not a peep.

 

Maybe he’s feeling the pressure. Maybe the jealousy of Guillen being the face of the club is too much. What he needs to know is Guillen will get another job. Williams? Another GM job is questionable.

 

On the eve of Round 2 of the crosstown showdown with the Cubs, what is apparent is Williams’ excuse-making is hurting the product more than helping it.

 

The media guide says Williams is the GM.

 

Time for him to start acting like it again or exit stage left.

 

Page 8 can always be rewritten.

 

Cowley vs Ken Williams in latest SunTimes column.

[southsideirish71]

Who really cares about the opinion of the Guillen family biographer.

[The Ginger Kid]

Who really cares about the opinion of the Guillen family biographer.

Amen!

 

I have not read this guy in a month until this was posted and it's just a great reminder of why I don't read him anymore. He's just a jerk, or at least he tries to be, very hard. He strives to cultivate this aura of clever uniqueness but produces a stench of awkward desperation. He's as catty and spiteful as a prom queen and as sycophantic as a groupie. Remarkable that he's a sports writer in a town like Chicago.

[iamshack]

I don't understand how these writers can be so shortsighted.

 

Adam Dunn is owed approximately $49 million for the remainder of his contract here. But yeah, he's struggled terrible for 80 games, so let's just bench him permanently. Makes a ton of sense.

 

These guys are absolute fools. If it were up to them, we'd have half the payroll spent on paying players in other organizations because we DFA'd them after 30 games.

[Brian]

He picks a fight on Twitter? WHat is he? 13 years old?

[southsideirish71]

I don't understand how these writers can be so shortsighted.

 

Adam Dunn is owed approximately $49 million for the remainder of his contract here. But yeah, he's struggled terrible for 80 games, so let's just bench him permanently. Makes a ton of sense.

 

These guys are absolute fools. If it were up to them, we'd have half the payroll spent on paying players in other organizations because we DFA'd them after 30 games.

 

 

Take a look at Oney's twitter timeline. He commends Theo for releasing Cameron. As a GM who admits and owns up to his mistakes. Then makes a comment that the Rockies are not a contender because they don't have a leadoff hitter.

 

Then we get the twitter bomb from the guillen mouthpiece following this up.

[Leonard Zelig]

The 05 offense was deadly huh? [bWhat in the hell is the difference between this offense and that offense? Not enough grindiness? Sorry, we'll bring in Pretty Ricky and he can grind on you then.

 

About .5 runs per game.

[witesoxfan]

I don't understand how these writers can be so shortsighted.

 

Adam Dunn is owed approximately $49 million for the remainder of his contract here. But yeah, he's struggled terrible for 80 games, so let's just bench him permanently. Makes a ton of sense.

 

These guys are absolute fools. If it were up to them, we'd have half the payroll spent on paying players in other organizations because we DFA'd them after 30 games.

 

I have absolutely no problem with Viciedo coming up and taking significant at bats away from Dunn and Pierre. Perhaps a mental reprieve is exactly what Dunn needs to get back, and Viciedo is simply a better option than Pierre. You can get all 3 of them pretty significant playing time, which allows you to play the hot hand when it's necessary. If all 3 of them start hitting really well, then I'm sure there will be another on the field who is in the early stages of a slump that you can find a sub for.

 

This team needs some kind of offensive spark, and Viciedo could be exactly that.

[Soxfest]

Which Guillen son wrote the review?

[SoxFan1]

The 05 offense was deadly huh? What in the hell is the difference between this offense and that offense? Not enough grindiness? Sorry, we'll bring in Pretty Ricky and he can grind on you then.

I would "like" and retweet this if I could. :wub:

[MurcieOne]

Joe Cowley is lacks appreciable logic, baseball understanding, writes poorly and seems determined to assume the "heel" role in the Chicago sports scene. When you read his column, the terrorists win.

[iamshack]

I have absolutely no problem with Viciedo coming up and taking significant at bats away from Dunn and Pierre. Perhaps a mental reprieve is exactly what Dunn needs to get back, and Viciedo is simply a better option than Pierre. You can get all 3 of them pretty significant playing time, which allows you to play the hot hand when it's necessary. If all 3 of them start hitting really well, then I'm sure there will be another on the field who is in the early stages of a slump that you can find a sub for.

 

This team needs some kind of offensive spark, and Viciedo could be exactly that.

I don't think ANYONE has a problem with Dunn getting days off. The problem is Cowley is going to argue we permanently bench Dunn and give up on him in favor of Viciedo, when you simply cannot do that.

 

What player would you get rid of to bring up Viciedo?

[Jordan4life_2007]

I hate when I have to give Wite credit. But he just demolished this thread.

[iamshack]

I hate when I have to give Wite credit. But he just demolished this thread.

I like Wite. But again, I don't think anyone has a problem with Viciedo taking time away from Dunn. The problem is who do you take off this roster so that Viciedo can move up?

 

You know they're not going to take Pierre/Teahen/Lilli off this roster. So who's it going to be?

 

Best solution, IMO, is to make up a bulls*** injury for Dunn and just DL him and bring up Viciedo.

[nickofypres]

Juan Pierre had game today, no doubt about it. Cowley starts talking s*** after Juan has a great day which makes him a hypocrite.

But at this point, even in the winner thread some posters seem to think there is no way Viciedo will replace Pierre at LF.

 

 

 

Thoughts?

 

Oh for f***s sake...that was terrible.

 

 

In regards to Cowley.

[caulfield12]

The 2005 offense had "complementary" players like Uribe, Rowand and Crede. Those same players would be #3 options on this team after Quentin and Konerko for offensive firepower.

 

Thomas raked in the middle of the summer when he was actually healthy. Pods and Iguchi were very dangerous together the first four months. We haven't gotten anything like that level of production this year...especially the steals and getting out of top for early leads in games on a consistent basis, not since the first 2-3 weeks of the season. Pierre hasn't intimidated anyone at all this year...opposing teams WANT him to run so that they can throw him out.

 

We're really missing that 3rd option offensively that was supposed to be Dunn, the role filled by Dye and Thome previously.

 

As far as not addressing the pitching before 2006, we did exactly that with the Javy acquisition. It just didn't work out as well as expected, but remember all the talk of having TOO MUCH depth with McCarthy on the outside looking in? Javy just didn't get the job done except when the pressure was diminished.

 

As far as the team not having a clear or coherent identity (call it a "strategic vision"), I'll definitely agree with Cowley on that. KW tinkers way too much, and it has consequences.

Edited July 1, 2011 by caulfield12

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Juan had a good series .Actually stole a base for the 1st time in a while , 3 rbi , didn't drop any fly balls and even had a sac fly and almost hit a HR. Thing is if you give Viciedo playing time I'll wager he has more 3 rbi games in half a season than Juan has all year. The offense needs him plain and simple. Who he replaces on any given day is not really the point.

[Dick Allen]

I don't think ANYONE has a problem with Dunn getting days off. The problem is Cowley is going to argue we permanently bench Dunn and give up on him in favor of Viciedo, when you simply cannot do that.

 

What player would you get rid of to bring up Viciedo?

Exactly. Pierre is gone in 3 months either way, he can be sacrificed. Ozzies needs a leadoff hitter? How much have the Sox won with Pierre on the team even when he's playing well?

 

The Sox are 4-1 this year with Pierre out of the line up.

 

I'm quite sure Cowley did get Oney's approval before submitting his piece of trash.

Edited July 1, 2011 by Dick Allen

[southsider2k5]

Who really cares about the opinion of the Guillen family biographer.

 

No doubt. This is Ozzie Jr.s answer to Kenny Williams throwing his dad under the bus repeatedly. I just wish Ozzie had the testicles to do it himself, instead of his little sockpuppet "Joe"

[southsider2k5]

Joe Cowley is lacks appreciable logic, baseball understanding, writes poorly and seems determined to assume the "heel" role in the Chicago sports scene. When you read his column, the terrorists win.

 

[TaylorStSox]

The difference between 05 and 11 is that in 05 we almost always scored first. That took a lot of pressure off the pitchers. They started out great and it was contagious throughout the rotation. The problem with 11 is that we have no speed at the top of the order. This version of Pierre has no speed. He's useless. If we replace him with Dayan, we don't really have a lead off hitter. Who cares? This offense isn't getting it done anyway. I guarantee that an offense including Dayan scores more runs. Isn't that what it's all about?

 

This isn't even addressing the fact that we don't have a 2 hitter anywhere near as competent as Iguchi. Omar can be that guy, but he's 67 years old. He can't play every day. Morel has the potential, but that's an awful burden for a kid that's already struggling.

 

I'd rather go back to being a base clogging, home run hitting team than watch this nonsense.

[southsider2k5]

The difference between 05 and 11 is that in 05 we almost always scored first. That took a lot of pressure off the pitchers. They started out great and it was contagious throughout the rotation. The problem with 11 is that we have no speed at the top of the order. This version of Pierre has no speed. He's useless. If we replace him with Dayan, we don't really have a lead off hitter. Who cares? This offense isn't getting it done anyway. I guarantee that an offense including Dayan scores more runs. Isn't that what it's all about?

 

This isn't even addressing the fact that we don't have a 2 hitter anywhere near as competent as Iguchi. Omar can be that guy, but he's 67 years old. He can't play every day. Morel has the potential, but that's an awful burden for a kid that's already struggling.

 

I'd rather go back to being a base clogging, home run hitting team than watch this nonsense.

 

That is where the leadoff hitter thing comes from. Unfortunately we haven't been able to find a good one.